SORN again

[Fowlersrs]

Can I get this straight from those in the know!!

If I have a bike in storage that is no longer insured but has tax and mot till January of the next year, do I need to SORN it?

Will I get fined before the tax expires?

I'm selling it you see but I don't wanna get fined by the Feds before its gone?

[Boxing]

SORN it. You can now get a fine for not SORNing your vehicle when the insurance is out. Regardless of tax. Better safe than sorry.

I've chanced it a month or two, no harm done though.

[Aff]

Yep, anything uninsured needs to be SORNed.
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Current Bikes:Honda 929RR Fireblade, Honda CD200 Benly (Project), Stomp Z2 140
Electric Bike Project

[stevo as b4]

It's the continuous insurance rule that will have you by the balls. Basically you cannot leave it uninsured unless you also sorn it, that's my understanding of how it works.

If there's loads of tax left then just cash it in. But Obviously the bike needs to be kept off the street whilst SORN'd.

I think the new SORN rule has come in now, where once you declare sorn, you can leave it for as long as you like and not need to re-declare it every year.

If the DVLA get that right and don't keep sending out reminder letter's it will be a miracle though!

[Fowlersrs]

Thanks lads il do it later.

When I SORN it will the tax disc on it become invalid or can it be used once its declared as back on the road?

I'd rather sell it with tax u see as cost is small

[Rogerborg]

As near as I can figure, you may surrender the vehicle license (tax disc) when you SORN it, but you aren't required to, and SORNing doesn't invalidate it.

I can't find any offence of using a SORNed vehicle on the road, nor any requirement, or statutory or regulatory mechanism for "unSORNing" a vehicle with an extant license when you want to use it again.

You can contact the DVLA again and say "unSORN, my good fellow", but I'd ride/drive a SORNed vehicle with a valid license on it and give very few figs.

Change of keeper cancels SORN anyway, so it shouldn't be an issue for the new keeper.

If all this makes SORN look like a huge waste of time dreamt up by some OCD spacker with nothing better to do, well, I won't disagree.
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[Vracktal]

[MarJay]

My understanding is that SORNing a bike invalidates the tax and you have to buy tax again to continue riding it, or un SORN it.
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British beauty: Triumph Street Triple R; Loony stroker: KR1S; Track fun: GSXR750 L1; Commuter Missile: GSX-S1000F; Cheap project: CBR900RR FireBlade
Remember kids, bikes aren't like lego. You can't easily take a part from one bike and then fit it to another.

[prawny1]

If you are going to sorn the vehicle, send the tax back for a refund too dvla "will" automatically assume it is invalid/ untaxed as the system does not differentiate between sorning an untaxed vehicle compared with an uninsured vehicle.

You need to declare a sorn before your tax/ insurance is out but it doesn't say anywhere that you need to cancel either once the declaration is made.

you can call dvla and request the sorn be lifted anytime you like at which point you will be in for some confusion with the operator as they will want to declare the vehicle untaxed,

It's upto you whether you want to argue with the operator as It can be down to the person on the other end of the line what happens, like anything to do with the dvla they are in control of the computer and often "computer say's no".

Sorn is lifted automatically when you re-tax or change ownership of a vehicle, the default when this happens is to also mark the vehicle as untaxed unfortunately.
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hellkat wrote:

Some people are only alive cos its against the law to kill them.

[Fowlersrs]

[prawny1]

I re wrote the last bit because it was looking like I was saying it is the "law " but it is not the dvla will "assume" that the vehicle was untaxed or the tax is handed in, but there is nothing that states that you need to hand it in.

You just need to be prepared to stand your ground when getting the tax status corrected, otherwise you are in for some A.N.P.R raping.
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hellkat wrote:

Some people are only alive cos its against the law to kill them.

[prawny1]

Another thing to not4e is vehicles that have been unlicence/ untaxed for a long time don't need to be sorned at all.

Not sure exactly what the timeframe is but I have an 1981 Honda camino moped that doesn't need sorning even though it is untaxed and uninsured.
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hellkat wrote:

Some people are only alive cos its against the law to kill them.

[Rogerborg]

Depends who you want to believe.

I'm going by the statute, not whatever the DVLA happen to believe that day (including their belief that they can invent laws).

On my reading, SORN is a consequence of surrendering the vehicle license (tax disc), or keeping an unlicensed vehicle. The surrender is really what the legislation concerns itself with, the regulatory declaration (SORN is a bit of a misnomer) is almost an afterthought.

If you don't surrender the license, I can't see anything in VERA 1994 or RV (R&L) R 2002 that says or implies that making a SORN declaration invalidates it. I'll note again that the physical paper disc is the "vehicle license". If you have that, you have a license.

Viewed another way, how would you prove that you have a license if you were accused of not having one? You'd show the disc. That's the only way that you can show that you've paid the VED.

The problem is that DVLA are choosing to accept SORN declarations without a surrender of the license, but I see that as their problem, not ours.
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[prawny1]

[Rogerborg]

True that, a phone call is usually my last resort.

I've actually had a couple of lucid, surprisingly well informed replies via the DVLA's web contact forms.

Granted, the answer was still "squeal like a pig", but at least they could tell me why they were going to get away with it.
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[Fowlersrs]

Just to throw a spanner in the works:

So I went to SORN it,

and I get this message:

Services provided by DVLA:
Declare SORN (Taking your vehicle off the road)
Tax Disc Refund
A SORN declaration is not due for this vehicle until: 01 01 2014
As you are declaring SORN before this date you may be entitled to a refund on the balance of the tax disc value.
This refund can be claimed by completing a Refund Application form (V14) and returning the tax disc with the form.

Does this not imply that I do not have to do anything until the date shown above? Surely they should be cross referencing the MID to check that theres valid insurance on it, or is that just too simple...

[MarJay]

[Fowlersrs]

And with that note, its done...

Still wondering if the original tax disc will be valid when the new keeper buys my bike as with the sale the bike will no longer be sorn and will have a tax disc present...

my betting says no but would be interesting to know for sure..

[Rogerborg]

Look at it this way. You're going to sell the bike with a vehicle license (aka tax disc) on it. Even if that license was somehow invalid (and I can see no reason why it would be) then would it be reasonable or just to prosecute the new keeper?
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[Fowlersrs]

[groovylee]