Chinese crap?

[Dannyb2012]

Hi all
I have been in sales for over 12 years, fairly successful too, so I tend to know sales pitter patter when I hear it. However some informed opinions would be much appreciated as when it comes to bikes I'm a complete novice....
My plan is to fulfil my fathers dream and tour with him to far flung destinations in the coming years. As mentioned I'm starting from scratch, cbt this Wednesday and a plan for mod 1 and 2 spring next year.
The query...
I'm buying a 125 this week after completion of my cbt which I want to sell spring next year, so residual value is an issue which is contrary to my question.
I have been looking at ybr's, cg's, cbr's and any other recognised manufacturers machines and for 12-1300 pound can get something that is half decent, providing its not been thrashed by some 17 year old. The three bike shops I have been in have none, apparently hard to come by at the minute, and after discussions with shop keep and everything I have read was told to steer clear of cheap Chinese junk. Except shop number three, a reputable local seller, who had some brand new Zontes bikes. He said he had tried and declined to sell, except or advise on all budget bikes until he saw these at a trade show and had the chance to play with and ride around on one. He almost convinced me that as 125s go these are solid well built bikes and parts are stocked in the UK with a 98% pick rate. He also said that they are good bikes and given most 125s have been thrashed by kids that this would be your best bet.
Now 1500 for a new bike, I thought ain't bad (also acutely aware it will probably drop to two thirds of that value the moment he has stuck a reg plate on it), obviously it also looked pretty good, all shiny and new.
I almost bought it until rationale took hold of me and said don't be a smeg, you sell stuff for a living, and I never impulse buy.
So after much ramblings and waffle I guess my question is, for those in the know, is a zontes any different from other cheap brands? Could it be that there is a sheep amidst the wolves when it comes to budget imports? Or did I nearly fall for my own sales nonsense?

Dan
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New rider, looking to tour

[Shaft]

If residual value is a key issue, forget everything else you've mentioned and buy the best CG125 you can find for 800 quid, ride it until you pass your tests, then flog it for the same price you paid.

All the other bikes involve losing money, to a greater or lesser extent (greater in the case of the Ching Chong Zonte).
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Things get better with age; I'm close to being magnificent........
20 RE Interceptor, 83 Z1100A3, 83 GS650 Katana
WooHoo, I'm a Man Point Millionaire! https://www.bikechatforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=234035

[G]

Heh; it took me a while to realise that a lot of salesmen need to be 'sold' on the product to be good at selling it - and thus it turns out that a lot are basically chumps when it comes to buying stuff, as they're so good at being sold to as well as selling.

I find it hard to believe the Zontes is that much better than the other makes.

There are plenty of Jap 125s at your price point that will have been looked after. At your price point you should find ones with plenty of life left.

I'm sure something like a CBF125 will hardly depreciate, while the Chinese bike will certainly lose cash faster than it's little engine can accelerate it.

I would also question someone's opinion that bases it on playing with one/riding it around at a trade show.

That is not a good way to decide which brand to choose.
Ok, if the bike at a trade show is in a bad state it's a good bet you should avoid altogether - but being in good nick just means they've got someone with a bit of nouse that sorted one out, as you'd hope anyone paying for an expensive stand at a show would do!
Obviously, the bigger the prospective sale, the more effort goes to try and ensure you get it!

[theogster]

i got a chinese bike (new) they are cheap, & some seem quite good, but not for your purposes, i'm keeping mine for as long as it runs, with no plans to sell it, so the Massive depreciation isnt an issue for me. forget buying a new bike, if your only keeping it for a year then your just pissing money away. not just on the bike, but also on the fixed dealer services that you would need to do to maintain the warranty..

As above, get a good CG125, or maybe a huoniao HN125-8 (a korean copy, which you can get new for around £800, pennies second hand) the huoniao is also rebranded as the lexmoto Vixen. these are generally well regarded considering they are copies.

also, when you say £1500, was that "on the road" ? if not, theres around another £100 to be added onto it.

hope this helps.
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I toast, Therefore I am...

[Dannyb2012]

All good advice, to be fair walking away from the showroom I did feel like a mug, maybe it helped with the empathy of my own customers, lol.
To be fair, it did not say "on the road" (early on in my carrer I sold cars so you would of thought I would be a little more savvy, I guess I'm a little blinded by the romance of riding a bike). However think I'm now sold on the idea of a cg125, and if I can spend £800 something that will last me a year and sell it for the same price then happy days!
Thanks guys
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New rider, looking to tour

[Nick 50]

Chinese bikes are quite an amount cheaper than their Japanese rivals, there is a reason for that.

A big question to ask yourself, how much of OCD for cleaning/maintenance? Is it Rogerborg'eque who can keep a chinese bike looking respectable? or are you the "meh it'll be alright" type?

The reason I ask, is this. Earlier on this year I made my first ever stop for a rider in trouble. It was a young lad who had just come off his chinese copy on a dual carriageway. Thankfully he was very lucky and the only real damage was to his nerves as he was shaking like a leaf.

I had a good look at the bike, it was a death-trap. Rusty, bits hanging off and clearly poorly maintained. It was on a 11 plate. Honestly it looked like it had been dumped in a brazilian rain-forest for a good few years. I couldn't believe it was just 2 years old.

I asked what happened, he had braked on a big white arrow and it was lashing down, queue crappy tires on a death-trap bike meant he was rather quickly dispatched from the bike.

Which leads on to another point. Tyres on Chinese bikes are cheap and nasty!

Now look at:

[Pigeon]

[SteveZZR]

I bought a cg for £100 and its still going strong.

Jap bikes live forever, Chinese not so much.
I bet my 1990 CG looks better than a Chinese bike from 2008 does

[Dannyb2012]

steve, ill give you one hundred and ten for it. Profit made, everyone's happy.
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New rider, looking to tour

[totalllama82]

I had a Haotian HT125-8 as my learner bike which was a 2008 model. I rode it through the winter too, done my CBT in August and passed my test in the following January.

I bought mine from a guy in Manchester and hired a van to bring it back up to Glasgow. It was in bad shape when I got a hold of it and there was a good bit of work needed, but for £275 it got me on the road. It took around another £150 of parts from the internet to get it back to near-showroom condition.

If you're going down the Chinese bike route you need to be aware that these bikes demand mechanical attention. I accepted this as I wanted to maintain my bikes myself so it helped me learn how bikes work. As mentioned before, get some decent branded tyres too no matter what's on there now.

To be honest, if you're looking to start riding a big touring bike ASAP, just get the Chinese bike and use it to learn on. I actually sold mine for more £££ than I bought it in the end plus, I got 6 months riding out of it.
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Gone: Haotian HT125-8 / Yamaha YZF 600R Thundercat / Kawasaki ZX9R C2
Current: Kawasaki ZZR 1400 A7F

[Rogerborg]

[i.p.phrealy]

My bike is Chinese, Sukida. It's done 17000km in all weathers, it's 7 years old and it had only 1 advisory on the last MOT. I agree the tyres are crap and I'll be sticking some better rubber on for winter. Just keep an eye on things and it'll be a good starting point.
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it is impossible to lick your own elbow...
and if you just tried you need professional help.
Finally allowed a big bike 19/03/14!

[G]

[mogstar]

Out of interest what bikes do you and your father intend to tour far flung destinnations on? I assume it won't be Chinese 125s?

[Dannyb2012]

Thanks again guys, I would love to go straight to the big boys test however I'm a little impatient at times and would like to be riding this week then the big boys test.

In terms of bikes we will tour on, my old man has a 1100gs and I assume I will know what I want when I have actually ridden for a short time, I do however like the look of the f800gs or something similar.
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New rider, looking to tour

[G]

Shouldn't take more than a week to get your DAS done .

[lukamon]

indeed. plus you get to ride someone else bike first you can fall off and its fine
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killa wrote: Im an ass man myself

[radicalrabit]

[Rogerborg]

Stolen-recovered Varadero near you. Knock him down as it needs work, then sell it on for a profit when you trade up. Varaderos are properly full sized 125s, bang at the power limit, and much better quality than any of the budget commuter 125s.

However, I warn you again that you are likely to get bum pumped on the insurance, so factor that in. That's a couple of hundred that could go towards the mandatory Ewan-and-Charlie suit for your GS.
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Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[theogster]

Why do you keep repeating this?

because by most accounts they are a good cheap bike, but, i guess i'm not a rabid anti chinese bike person lol...

& i only said it once, maybe you should look up the definition of the word "repeating"
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I toast, Therefore I am...

[nowhere.elysium]

[theogster]

thanks for the snarky comment, yes i am capable of reading, HUONIAO are a korean company that uses china for it's manufacture, just like some jap bikes are made in India..
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I toast, Therefore I am...

[theogster]

Ok, sorry, you guys got my back up a bit, my bad, i didnt mean to sound like i know anything (because my only experience is with off road 125's & 250's from 20 years ago)

i'm a total novice, i'll be the first to admit that, & i come here to enjoy talking to other folks that like bikes. but i notice the massive feeling against Chinese bikes, & i Do bow to your knowledge & experience, however, when i got mine i did a lot of checking around for what seemed like a good, affordable new bike, (i actually wanted an old 2 stroke dt125, but for reasons too embarrassing to go into i had to get what i got lol)

all chinese bikes cannot be bad, & the two bikes i landed on where the lexmoto arizona & the hn125 aka lexmoto vixen, i went for the arizona because a friend has had one for a few years & clocked a lot of miles without any major problems, however the hn125 had some really good feedback from actual owners

https://www.reviewcentre.com/reviews161414.html

again, i am only trying to be impartial, sorry if i got anyones back up.
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I toast, Therefore I am...

[nowhere.elysium]

[Rogerborg]