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Derbi Senda 50 Extreme SM Tuning Ideas

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Vale46
Two Stroke Sniffer



Joined: 04 Oct 2011
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PostPosted: 15:57 - 07 Oct 2013    Post subject: Derbi Senda 50 Extreme SM Tuning Ideas Reply with quote
I'm after some advice on the best way to tune my Derbi Senda. It is currently de restricted with an 80cc polini kit, 21mm carb and malossi exhaust.

Also any advice on the bike setup would be appreciated.

Cheers

Last edited by Vale46 on 16:15 - 07 Oct 2013; edited 1 time in total
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P.addy
Red Rocket



Joined: 14 Feb 2008
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PostPosted: 16:10 - 07 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Sell.

Buy 125.

Go faster standard. Thumbs Up
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Vale46
Two Stroke Sniffer



Joined: 04 Oct 2011
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PostPosted: 16:14 - 07 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Paddy. wrote:
Sell.

Buy 125.

Go faster standard. Thumbs Up


haha well I know I could do that but I cba doing my CBT as I'm gonna do it next year when I turn 21 and take my bike test. I'm looking for something I can do to improve the bike I have so save the agro of selling it and finding another.

Cheers anyway though.
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P.addy
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Joined: 14 Feb 2008
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PostPosted: 16:15 - 07 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Do you not have a CBT, if not why are you riding that Laughing
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Vale46
Two Stroke Sniffer



Joined: 04 Oct 2011
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PostPosted: 16:19 - 07 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Paddy. wrote:
Do you not have a CBT, if not why are you riding that Laughing


Driving license. It doesn't expire for a 50 if you passed your test before your cbt expires or something. Its meant to be restricted and stuff like but the chances of getting stopped are slim. Don't need L plates either so less likely to get pulled.
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Irn-Bru
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Joined: 13 Aug 2009
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PostPosted: 17:28 - 07 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Since he's 20 he's definitely breaking the law, can't ride anything legally without a CBT and even if you had passed before 2001 your ped is over 49cc.

This thread and the other one with the lad buying a bike without a v5 and tax are making me question todays yoofs.
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Vale46
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Joined: 04 Oct 2011
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PostPosted: 17:38 - 07 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
I wasn't asking what was legal and what wasn't and I didn't write the question to get a lecture on it.

I only want to know a way of tuning it a bit more but obviously thats a bit too much to ask ha

Chill out people.
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Irn-Bru
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PostPosted: 17:45 - 07 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
The point is this:

Vale46 wrote:
Driving license. It doesn't expire for a 50 if you passed your test before your cbt expires or something. Its meant to be restricted and stuff like but the chances of getting stopped are slim. Don't need L plates either so less likely to get pulled.


is completely untrue.
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Vale46
Two Stroke Sniffer



Joined: 04 Oct 2011
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PostPosted: 17:52 - 07 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Irn-Bru wrote:
The point is this:

Vale46 wrote:
Driving license. It doesn't expire for a 50 if you passed your test before your cbt expires or something. Its meant to be restricted and stuff like but the chances of getting stopped are slim. Don't need L plates either so less likely to get pulled.


is completely untrue.


Well i'm just going off the information I was given when I did my CBT mate so if I'm wrong then I best get it done again. But still just after a few tuning tips for my bike so then it can run a little better so I can keep it for a year until i've did my test.
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Ste
Not Work Safe



Joined: 01 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: 17:53 - 07 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
-> Sell ped
-> Get 125
-> Profit

Just do your CBT, it's valid for two years so you'll be able to do your bike test next year without having to redo it.

Tuning your ped is a waste of time and money that at best would result in it being slightly faster. If you want to go faster, just get a faster bike, it's incredibly simple.

Also, by selling your ped and getting a 125 you'll no longer be pedscum. Dance!
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G
The Voice of Reason



Joined: 02 Feb 2002
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PostPosted: 17:53 - 07 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Vale46 wrote:

I only want to know a way of tuning it a bit more but obviously thats a bit too much to ask ha

Chill out people.

Heh; seems you're the one that could do with a 'chill pill'!

You've got the best advice so far.

We are at 'polishing turd' levels.

You are already riding illegally.
You would be riding just as illegally on a 125cc.

Do you have loads of money to chuck at making your slow bike very slightly less slow?

If you 'CBA' doing your CBT; are you aware that it's likely to be a lot more work to tune your current bike further?

Also that you'll have to do your CBT at some point anyway if you want to do your test?
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Vale46
Two Stroke Sniffer



Joined: 04 Oct 2011
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PostPosted: 18:32 - 07 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
G wrote:
Vale46 wrote:

I only want to know a way of tuning it a bit more but obviously thats a bit too much to ask ha

Chill out people.

Heh; seems you're the one that could do with a 'chill pill'!

You've got the best advice so far.

We are at 'polishing turd' levels.

You are already riding illegally.
You would be riding just as illegally on a 125cc.

Do you have loads of money to chuck at making your slow bike very slightly less slow?

If you 'CBA' doing your CBT; are you aware that it's likely to be a lot more work to tune your current bike further?

Also that you'll have to do your CBT at some point anyway if you want to do your test?


polish turd levels and pedscum haha nice one cheers obviously this was a pointless topic.

Cheers for your help anyway
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G
The Voice of Reason



Joined: 02 Feb 2002
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PostPosted: 18:41 - 07 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Vale46 wrote:

obviously this was a pointless topic.

Glad you understand Thumbs Up.*

The correct topic would have been "What 125cc bike should I get to meet these requirements...." Smile.

*Ok, yes I know; you probably don't.
Seriously. When you ride a proper 125 you'll likely wonder why you bothered messing with a tarted ped for so long.
If you mess with that, then ride a bigger bike, you'll again wonder why you bothered when for the same money you can get a bike that will hit 60 in around 3 seconds and the quarter mile in 11.
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Ste
Not Work Safe



Joined: 01 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: 18:46 - 07 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Vale46 wrote:
I am wanting to get a 125

That was 2011, what changed your mind?
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Vale46
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Joined: 04 Oct 2011
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PostPosted: 18:49 - 07 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
G wrote:
Vale46 wrote:

obviously this was a pointless topic.

Glad you understand Thumbs Up.*

The correct topic would have been "What 125cc bike should I get to meet these requirements...." Smile.

*Ok, yes I know; you probably don't.
Seriously. When you ride a proper 125 you'll likely wonder why you bothered messing with a tarted ped for so long.
If you mess with that, then ride a bigger bike, you'll again wonder why you bothered when for the same money you can get a bike that will hit 60 in around 3 seconds and the quarter mile in 11.


I understand where you are coming from just the only reason I made this was cos I was hoping there may be a cheap way of getting a little extra out of it. I didn't do any of the modifications to the bike the previous owner did. I'm not dafting enough to waste money like he did looking at all the receipts. The only reason I was wanting to keep my current bike was cos I have a few mates who have 125's and theres are no faster but fair enough I could tune the 125 which would make it faster.

Really I never named the topic the best I was just looking for some ideas of course I know the best option is to get a 125 but was hoping for something cheaper and less hassle than swapping bikes fair enough its illegal as you have all pointed out so since you's are obviously massively against breaking the law I'll just keep the bike the way it is until after xmas and do my cbt and get a 125.

Cheers
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Irn-Bru
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Joined: 13 Aug 2009
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PostPosted: 18:51 - 07 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
You may as well just get a 600 then, same risks involved, no insurance or license, not displaying l-plates etc. problem solved.
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G
The Voice of Reason



Joined: 02 Feb 2002
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PostPosted: 18:54 - 07 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
I've seen a standard NSR125 show about 24hp on a dyno.
That should be good for around 100mph on the clocks.

As an idea, a tuned 85 competition motocross bike might be putting out around 24hp. But they'd be being used for half an hour at a time and getting regular engine rebuilds through the year.
I doubt yours is making that sort of power, personally so doubt it's as fast as 125cc road bikes available.

Getting it setup right might make it faster cheaply.
Certainly any more than that is going to cost you a fair bit of money, likely.

I don't care if you break this law and it's silly to make that assumption for everyone posting.
I do think you're silly to limit yourself to a slower bike when you're breaking the law already and you'd be breaking exactly the same law with a faster bike.
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Vale46
Two Stroke Sniffer



Joined: 04 Oct 2011
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PostPosted: 19:00 - 07 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
G wrote:
I've seen a standard NSR125 show about 24hp on a dyno.
That should be good for around 100mph on the clocks.

As an idea, a tuned 85 competition motocross bike might be putting out around 24hp. But they'd be being used for half an hour at a time and getting regular engine rebuilds through the year.
I doubt yours is making that sort of power, personally so doubt it's as fast as 125cc road bikes available.

Getting it setup right might make it faster cheaply.
Certainly any more than that is going to cost you a fair bit of money, likely.

I don't care if you break this law and it's silly to make that assumption for everyone posting.
I do think you're silly to limit yourself to a slower bike when you're breaking the law already and you'd be breaking exactly the same law with a faster bike.


That is a fair point about being daft breaking the law with a slower bike.

The last owner had it set up by chisel speed and it got 19bhp on the dyno (supposedly) according to the dyno sheet but I had problems it not wanting to start so I got a mate to sort it but since I've had it back off him it doesn't seem the same and I don't want to seem ungrateful but telling him hes messed up my bike.

Any ideas on the best way to set it up?
Would fuel/air mixture would you recommend?

Cheers
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Vale46
Two Stroke Sniffer



Joined: 04 Oct 2011
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PostPosted: 19:02 - 07 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Ste wrote:
Vale46 wrote:
I am wanting to get a 125

That was 2011, what changed your mind?


Not a clue mate probably got a car which I massively regret now massive waste of money when you 17-18. I only use the bike to get to uni and work which is 4 mile for uni and 10 mile for work so thats why I've gone back to the cheaper (and more fun) option of a bike again.
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G
The Voice of Reason



Joined: 02 Feb 2002
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PostPosted: 19:06 - 07 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
I suspect if it's really making 19hp at the back wheel on a dyno run from a road engine, that you've been sold a hand grenade, not a motorcycle.

Ideally you'd start by finding out what your mate did.

Do you have access to an air/fuel ratio meter?
If you do, I'd hope who ever has it can help you.

However, it's even more sounding like your best bet is to sell it on.

If your friend has lowered the power a bit, it's quite possibly a good thing.

Read up on 'plug chops', presuming you don't have access to an air/fuel meter.
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Vale46
Two Stroke Sniffer



Joined: 04 Oct 2011
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PostPosted: 19:11 - 07 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
G wrote:
I suspect if it's really making 19hp at the back wheel on a dyno run from a road engine, that you've been sold a hand grenade, not a motorcycle.

Ideally you'd start by finding out what your mate did.

Do you have access to an air/fuel ratio meter?
If you do, I'd hope who ever has it can help you.

However, it's even more sounding like your best bet is to sell it on.

If your friend has lowered the power a bit, it's quite possibly a good thing.

Read up on 'plug chops', presuming you don't have access to an air/fuel meter.


Yeah i'd imagine someone I know has a air/fuel ratio meter.

I'll have a read up on plug chops aswell thanks.

He just said he was going to set up the carb. The main problem with the bike is it is sluggish and just sounds restricted when in low revs but once you get upto around 6k it is fine :/ Really my question should of been how to fix this problem but I was more hoping that anyone who maybe had the same bike or new how to tune it would be able to solve this issue as it never did it when I first bought the bike.
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Ste
Not Work Safe



Joined: 01 Sep 2002
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PostPosted: 19:14 - 07 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
What's its top speed?
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Vale46
Two Stroke Sniffer



Joined: 04 Oct 2011
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PostPosted: 19:24 - 07 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Ste wrote:
What's its top speed?


Not sure the clock only goes upto 50 and it goes past that guessing 70ish. Its more acceleration i'm after trying to smooth it out as bottom end its sluggish and sounds restricted. Don't think anything above 70 would be very healthy for it like ha I just want it to dodge in and out of traffic really for the odd bit of dual carriageway but not much.
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G
The Voice of Reason



Joined: 02 Feb 2002
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PostPosted: 20:27 - 07 Oct 2013    Post subject: Reply with quote
Any engine, but 2 strokes especially will suffer lower down when they are tuned for peak power. The setup like yours will likely be configured purely to work well at peak power.
I have no idea what a restricted bike 'sounds' like. Despite having a variety of restricted and de-restricted bikes, the only way to tell would be how quickly they are revving if you knew how quickly a de-restricted one would accelerate.
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