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The Tory PR machine at work

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Lord Percy
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PostPosted: 11:23 - 05 Jan 2014    Post subject: The Tory PR machine at work Reply with quote
Possibly biased article, so take it as you please

https://legalaidandme.proboards.com/thread/8301/audacity-cameron-hypocrisy-help-buy?post-20923=undefined

Main points - Tory 'Help to Buy' scheme promoted by David Cameron meeting 'single mum' who benefited from it, who it turns out is actually married and reasonably well employed by an estate agent. The ground floor flat she 'bought' was from the estate agent she works for. Also, even though she 'bought' it, it's still listed as available on RightMove.
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Im-a-Ridah
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PostPosted: 12:18 - 05 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Are you trying to tell us that the other political parties articles are all unbiased? Laughing

Lib Dem PR machine at work

UKIP PR machine at work

Labour PR machine at work

Green PR machine at work

BNP and SNP PR machines at work

Thinking
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UrbanRacer
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PostPosted: 12:41 - 05 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Im-a-Ridah wrote:
Are you trying to tell us that the other political parties articles are all unbiased? Laughing

Lib Dem PR machine at work

UKIP PR machine at work

Labour PR machine at work

Green PR machine at work

BNP and SNP PR machines at work

Thinking


That makes it alright then eh?
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Lord Percy
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PostPosted: 12:47 - 05 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Im-a-Ridah wrote:
Are you trying to tell us that the other political parties articles are all unbiased? Laughing

Lib Dem PR machine at work

UKIP PR machine at work

Labour PR machine at work

Green PR machine at work

BNP and SNP PR machines at work

Thinking


I have absolutely no idea about the PR strategy of the other political parties, I don't really care either, I just saw this and it's a thing the Tories did so I'm showing it.

Also I wonder if you actually read the link at all.

When I said the article I biased, I mean the person who wrote it probably has some in-built Tory hatred. So I'm actually saying, 'don't necessarily trust the content, but have a look anyway'.

Of course every political party is biased towards themselves.

If you look at the info in the link, you'll see that what I actually mean is the Tories in this instance seem to have committed a serious case of false advertising, using actors and props and telling the paying public that it's real life.

Your reply is the same as telling me I can't complain about Apple products because Microsoft exists too. It makes no sense!
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fatpies
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PostPosted: 13:08 - 05 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Lord Percy wrote:
If you look at the info in the link, you'll see that what I actually mean is the Tories in this instance seem to have committed a serious case of false advertising, using actors and props and telling the paying public that it's real life.!



And it happens. Labour used stooges all the time, you'd see it on question time frequently, Tuition fees are great! ID cards are great!

A taxi driver from Iraq gave us some papers! we must fight for oilfreedom.

Those who swallow these lies will swallow them no matter where they come from. Because that is how politics works that people generally don't have the time to dig just a little deeper and expose it all.
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Benno
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PostPosted: 13:15 - 05 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Allow me to butt in for a moment

F*ck Cameron and the Conservatives.

Thanks, I'm done here.


Wait, no I'm not, f*ck em all actually - and this is coming from someone who has studied politics ffs.
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Lord Percy
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PostPosted: 13:41 - 05 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
fatpies wrote:
Lord Percy wrote:
If you look at the info in the link, you'll see that what I actually mean is the Tories in this instance seem to have committed a serious case of false advertising, using actors and props and telling the paying public that it's real life.!



And it happens. Labour used stooges all the time, you'd see it on question time frequently, Tuition fees are great! ID cards are great!

A taxi driver from Iraq gave us some papers! we must fight for oilfreedom.

Those who swallow these lies will swallow them no matter where they come from. Because that is how politics works that people generally don't have the time to dig just a little deeper and expose it all.


I'm more than willing to believe this.

I guess I should just add that this thread wasn't necessarily supposed to be any kind of lefty liberal 'down with the tories' rant. It just happens to be that they're the ones who were exposed, so they're the ones who get the mention.

I'm 100% disillusioned with the game of politics. I actually stopped following most political news several months ago, it's all so samey now, no matter who's in the spotlight.
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daemonoid
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PostPosted: 14:09 - 05 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Lord Percy wrote:
I guess I should just add that this thread wasn't necessarily supposed to be any kind of lefty liberal 'down with the tories' rant. It just happens to be that they're the ones who were exposed, so they're the ones who get the mention.


Exposed? I'm not so sure...

A more critical look at the 'expose' would reveal.
1. The title 'sales director' is a grandiose title for little more than being standard sales.
2. The woman is separated.
3. A picture of an expensive car doesn't mean that she's buying it new, buying it outright or even buying it at all (company car?).
4. The land registry does not update it's public facing records in anything like a timely manner.
5. Estate agents purposefully don't update theirs in a timely manner - they try to keep a nice predefined amount of for sale and sold properties on their site for obvious reasons.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 14:40 - 05 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
It's all about perspective.

https://www.dailyecho.co.uk/resources/images/2799327.jpg?type=articleLandscape

For example, if you take a picture at just the wrong time and angle, Cameron looks like a giant looming nonce about to pounce on a tiny pre-teen.

Which of course he isn't.

To the best of our knowledge.

Currently.
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Lord Percy
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PostPosted: 14:52 - 05 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
daemonoid wrote:
Lord Percy wrote:
I guess I should just add that this thread wasn't necessarily supposed to be any kind of lefty liberal 'down with the tories' rant. It just happens to be that they're the ones who were exposed, so they're the ones who get the mention.


Exposed? I'm not so sure...

A more critical look at the 'expose' would reveal.
1. The title 'sales director' is a grandiose title for little more than being standard sales.
2. The woman is separated.
3. A picture of an expensive car doesn't mean that she's buying it new, buying it outright or even buying it at all (company car?).
4. The land registry does not update it's public facing records in anything like a timely manner.
5. Estate agents purposefully don't update theirs in a timely manner - they try to keep a nice predefined amount of for sale and sold properties on their site for obvious reasons.


Either way, she's reasonably well employed and she bought her house from her own employer, no doubt she got a great deal there. I doubt it's as easy for most. She got it good so the PR crew pounced on her story.

Bottom line is that this 'Help to Buy' scheme is just smoke and mirrors. How many signed up for it? 6000 I think? I doubt it's gonna change anything for the country, it's just another bit of political publicity. Image over action.
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oldpink
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PostPosted: 15:13 - 05 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
same as the lie that there was never a list of 75 pits to be closed
it took 30 years for the truth to come out about that one Thumbs Up
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daemonoid
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PostPosted: 15:58 - 05 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Lord Percy wrote:
Either way, she's reasonably well employed and she bought her house from her own employer, no doubt she got a great deal there. I doubt it's as easy for most. She got it good so the PR crew pounced on her story.

Bottom line is that this 'Help to Buy' scheme is just smoke and mirrors. How many signed up for it? 6000 I think? I doubt it's gonna change anything for the country, it's just another bit of political publicity. Image over action.


Yes, she was reasonably employed, that's the whole bloody point! It's not a scheme to help the jobless... It's a scheme to help those who can't raise deposits due to the economic climate being massively different from when the last generation bought their houses!

And 6000 sign ups so far is quite a lot. That's a rough estimate of 600,000,000 into the property market... So far...
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daemonoid
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PostPosted: 16:01 - 05 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
oldpink wrote:
same as the lie that there was never a list of 75 pits to be closed
it took 30 years for the truth to come out about that one Thumbs Up


Education, education, education
There are weapons of mass destruction

I don't think collapsing a cabal (the unions) can be considered anywhere near as bad as destroying the future of a whole generation and starting an unjust war... But hey, if you think thatcher was solely responsible for pit closures and the union's ridiculous demands had nothing to do with it...
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oldpink
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PostPosted: 16:17 - 05 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
daemonoid wrote:
Education, education, education
There are weapons of mass destruction

I don't think collapsing a cabal (the unions) can be considered anywhere near as bad as destroying the future of a whole generation and starting an unjust war... But hey, if you think thatcher was solely responsible for pit closures and the union's ridiculous demands had nothing to do with it...


yes the unions were part of the problem
but to wipe out entire community's and put them on the scrap heap was not the way to sort it
it was a vindictive move and one of the reasons the cops are now a political tool to be used to harass peaceful protestors
maggie gave them the powers and ordered them to break the strikers at all cost
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daemonoid
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PostPosted: 16:25 - 05 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
oldpink wrote:
yes the unions were part of the problem
but to wipe out entire community's and put them on the scrap heap was not the way to sort it
it was a vindictive move and one of the reasons the cops are now a political tool to be used to harass peaceful protestors
maggie gave them the powers and ordered them to break the strikers at all cost


I thought it was Blair who took away the rights to protest too...

What was the option? Break the strikers or give in to demands? There was no middle ground by that time - the unions had proven time and again that they'd 'compromise' and then start the whole thing again a few months down the line.
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Kickstart
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PostPosted: 16:32 - 05 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Lord Percy wrote:
Either way, she's reasonably well employed and she bought her house from her own employer, no doubt she got a great deal there.


She probably bought the house through her employer. No doubt not a bad deal (and as an estate agent she probably has the skills and experience to hammer any seller on the price, irrespective of whether through her employer or not), but hardly like she is getting an employee discount on the property.

As an aside, it is no surprise that things like this would be twisted by one party or another to feed their supporters frenzy. Go back 30 years and there was a famous labour election poster of a queue of 'unemployed people', which turned out to be mostly employed.

All the best

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Last edited by Kickstart on 16:34 - 05 Jan 2014; edited 1 time in total
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Ste
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PostPosted: 16:33 - 05 Jan 2014    Post subject: Re: The Tory PR machine at work Reply with quote
What does it matter she was employed and worked for an estate agent?

And the property being still listed on rightmove is nothing unusual, estate agents do that lots, as she works for them then I expect the for sale board is still outside. I expect that lots of estate agents buy homes that they've got on their books.

OP, I guess you'll be voting for Nu Liebore? Sick
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Lord Percy
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PostPosted: 17:03 - 05 Jan 2014    Post subject: Re: The Tory PR machine at work Reply with quote
Ste wrote:

OP, I guess you'll be voting for Nu Liebore? Sick


Not voting at all Very Happy All the same in the end. As said, it's not a jab at any political party, just a general exposure of a bit of possibly dodgy PR, which it turns out may not be so dodgy after all. As said in the OP, I thought the article might be biased, but thought it was worth a share anyway.
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Raffles
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PostPosted: 19:33 - 05 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
daemonoid wrote:
But hey, if you think thatcher was solely responsible for pit closures and the union's ridiculous demands had nothing to do with it...

Which ridiculous demands would they be then?
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 20:07 - 05 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Raffles wrote:
daemonoid wrote:
But hey, if you think thatcher was solely responsible for pit closures and the union's ridiculous demands had nothing to do with it...

Which ridiculous demands would they be then?

A pit pony in every pot.
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oldpink
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PostPosted: 02:21 - 06 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
daemonoid wrote:
But hey, if you think thatcher was solely responsible for pit closures and the union's ridiculous demands had nothing to do with it...


a lot of their points were valid as proved by the recent disclosures
this was not based on economics
it was a deliberate attempt to undermine a large part of her opposition and set them on a collision with the police
making them look like thugs and manipulating the media to back her up
soldiers in military boots and badly fitting copper uniforms just out for a fight
and turning the police into a political tool at their command

thats when we lost our right to protest
ever since that and the poll tax demonstrations in Trafalgar Sq
the cops have the law on there side
and can kettle or use what ever method they see fit to quash any decent or protest the government does not like
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Derivative
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PostPosted: 04:30 - 06 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
The first I've heard of this story is the article posted.
That said: I don't see any mention of a single mum at all. It also doesn't look like a 'modest home' to me. There are various other glaring inconsistencies with the posted images/quotes and the description given.

Essentially, if you're looking for spin, you'll find it.

Looking at the whole thing the first thing that comes to mind is 'husband isn't in, no way has she bought that alone'. I don't get it.
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daemonoid
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PostPosted: 07:22 - 06 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
oldpink wrote:
a lot of their points were valid as proved by the recent disclosures
this was not based on economics
it was a deliberate attempt to undermine a large part of her opposition and set them on a collision with the police
making them look like thugs and manipulating the media to back her up
soldiers in military boots and badly fitting copper uniforms just out for a fight
and turning the police into a political tool at their command

thats when we lost our right to protest
ever since that and the poll tax demonstrations in Trafalgar Sq
the cops have the law on there side
and can kettle or use what ever method they see fit to quash any decent or protest the government does not like


Those points you recount are valid, but they are due to the unions being so powerful and so ridiculous in their demands.

For many years before Thatcher the unions had been amassing a strength that allowed them not only to dictate policy for their members, but also to effectively control government. They were an unelected political force that could do as they pleased. Thatcher fought against them and their unlawful attempts to rule. Unfortunately the ordinary workers were the ones that suffered, that was not Thatcher's fault though, that was Scargill and his predecessor's. The unions had assaulted British democracy...

https://www.isj.org.uk/?id=640 wrote:
Thatcher herself wrote in her memoirs:

In February 1972 mass pickets led by Arthur Scargill forced the closure of the Saltley Coke Depot in Birmingham by sheer weight of numbers…it was a frightening demonstration of the impotence of the police…and it lent substance to the myth that the NUM had the power to make or break British governments, or at the very least the power to veto any policy threatening their interests by preventing coal getting to power stations.9

The success of the miners’ strike was only one of the high points in an extraordinary period which lasted throughout 1972 and was followed two years later by another strike that led to Heath’s fall. As Royden Harrison noted shortly after, the miners had achieved a series of victories which were unprecedented in British history:

First, they compelled the prime minister to receive them in 10 Downing Street—which he had sworn he would never do—then they forced him to concede more in 24 hours than had been conceded in the last 24 years. Then two years later their 1974 strike led him to introduce the three-day week—a novel system of government by catastrophe—for which he was rewarded with defeat in the General Election. Nothing like this had ever been heard of before!10

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dydey90
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PostPosted: 10:34 - 06 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
I don't know about anybody else, but I'm hoping to get on one of these help to buy schemes. It's either that or spend an eternity saving up a deposit, while paying rent to somebody else.

I'd quite like a 110% mortgage, which I could easily afford to pay back and it'd be no skin off the banks nose as it seems I'd be paying back at least double the value of the property over the 25 year period, so wouldn't actually start to own the house in any real sense until at least 12.5 years in.
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Old Thread Alert!

The last post was made 12 years, 294 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful?
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