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London riots mk2? Mark Duggan killing lawful, says jury

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Andy_Pagin
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PostPosted: 12:50 - 12 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
I think that if the police had needed to plant a gun they'd have put it on the body or in the car.
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Andy_Pagin
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PostPosted: 12:54 - 12 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Don't expect the police to divulge anything about their intelligence sources. Gathering, collating and analysing that stuff is a key part of modern policing and has to remain highly secretive.
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Andy_Pagin
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PostPosted: 13:12 - 12 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
This article sums up the inquest quite well.

[url]www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/mark-duggan-was-
he-really-armed-were-the-police-under-threat-all-the-key-evidence-9046789.html[/url]
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 13:15 - 12 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
fatpies wrote:
Harry Stanley

Convicted armed robber.

fatpies wrote:
Ian Tomlinson

Alcoholic homeless scrounging shagbeast.

fatpies wrote:
Mark Andrews the cop who threw a woman onto the floor

Vicious drunken harpy.

You forgot Jean Charles de Menezes, the Brazilian who was only here in the first place because he defrauded immigration. Paid a lot of income tax and VAT?

When the police start slotting and shoeing people who might be described as contributing members of society, I'll care. The cases above are pest control.
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arry
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PostPosted: 13:23 - 12 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
daemonoid wrote:

Now finally someone giving a point that isn't whipped up by propaganda. Wanna share some of that evidence? All I've ever seen is crappy press releases from the police.


Stuck on my phone til my new HD is installed so tough to navigate but:

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2014/01/08/article-2536197-1A7FA5E800000578-48_634x589.jpg

Here's his charity working mates in the press - didn't do it guv, honest:
https://www.haringeyindependent.co.uk/news/4423103.Tottenham_gangsters_jailed_for_nightclub_shooting/
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Boris the spider
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PostPosted: 16:17 - 12 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Clutchy wrote:
Police man did the world a favour.


This.

And as for all the hangers on who hate the police. Go get a fucking job you benefit scrounging fucks.
Same goes for you fucking swampy bastards that make a point of protesting at the opening of a letter.

Fuckers the lot of you
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swampy
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PostPosted: 17:06 - 12 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Boris the spider wrote:
Same goes for you fucking swampy bastards that make a point of protesting at the opening of a letter.

Fuckers the lot of you



Hey... Whistle
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-Matt-
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PostPosted: 17:09 - 12 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
daemonoid wrote:
Don't forget the crap they put forward after de menezes... The results of the enquiry were that the police made a mistake, but no individual did anything wrong. Yet according to the non-police witnesses they shot a man who was already being restrained.
I don't think Duggans case is comparable to Mendez - as much of a fuck up as it was that was a totally different situation, the whole place was on high alert after 7/7 with more suspected attacks on the horizon
Quote:
Operation Kratos referred to tactics developed by London's Metropolitan Police Service for dealing with suspected suicide bombers, most notably firing shots to the head without warning.
They responded in the correct way, they just got the identification totally wrong. The case of Duggan is to do with how they responded, gun or not, whether there was too much force used. It wasn't mistaken identity.
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MinhDinh
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PostPosted: 17:40 - 12 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
I play football in Totenham and it's a shithole, much worse than Hackney. There are 18 year olds with guns, it's not hard to believe.

The type of people that 'protested' for him weren't exactly choir boys now.
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daemonoid
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PostPosted: 21:33 - 12 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Mk1GSF wrote:
Hachi8 wrote:
Justice has already been done love.


Indeed. I doubt they would be asking the judge to over-rule the jury had it been found that yon dickhead had been unlawfully killed. The case was judged by 12 normal, everyday folk.


That's a prime example of the bollocks surrounding this whole thing. You clearly haven't taken in the first thing about it and yet still see fit to voice your opinion...

There were 10 people on the "panel", no case, no jury. It was not a trial.

I have asked repeatedly what makes people think this guy was a gangster, leader of a gang, whatever and no one can come up with anything, other than arry's photo of three lads looking not how he'd like to and a loosely connected story about someone else.

Even if it were all true about him, do you really think police should get away with botched jobs that end up with people dead? It happens far too often and they close ranks and get away with it every time.
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daemonoid
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PostPosted: 21:48 - 12 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
mpd72 wrote:
You have an avatar of someone looking like a gangster pointing a gun at the viewer. I'm not sure what motivates you but I for one don't hero worship gangsters.


Someone? That's me pointing that gun. Menacing eh? And if you think that's all it takes for me to be a gun criminal then I know what I'm up against.

You're really trying to question my character from one photo... And in your mind I think you really think I'm all into "gangsters 'n sh!t", instead I'm a liberal software engineer in my mid 30s. I'm about as far away from being a gangster as you can get, but still you make that inference... it's a petty attempt to colour my character that just helps me make a point - some people are easily influenced by the inconsequential. The propaganda in this case has relied on it - Duggan's gone from petty criminal to gang leader since his death and people like you lap it up... No smoke without fire and all that eh? Eh?

And the full story on my avatar... Gun photo was one time in Vegas on business and I tweaked it and used it as my counter strike avatar when I used to be rather good at FPSs.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 21:54 - 12 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
daemonoid wrote:
I have asked repeatedly what makes people think this guy was a gangster

https://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/02333/ojsimpson_2333338b.jpg
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daemonoid
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PostPosted: 22:01 - 12 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Rogerborg wrote:
https://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/02333/ojsimpson_2333338b.jpg


This is the second time I'm telling you this... Roger, Mr data... Mr FOI... You're better than that.

Show me a shred of evidence that isn't based on a conversation in a pub. Arry tried but I'm still waiting on something more than a cheap insinuation.
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daemonoid
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PostPosted: 22:14 - 12 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Mk1GSF wrote:
12, 10, whatever. Still a 'panel' of peers.

The judgement, if I'm right, is based upon what a 'reasonable' person would do/think/whatever. So were the jury/panel a group of reasonable people, or not? If they were, I don't see the problem. If they aren't, do you think they aren't 'reasonable' because they found the killing lawful, or do you think there is some underlying issue, perhaps that the chap was black maybe?

I personally think it speaks volumes that it was a 9/1 decision that it was lawful.

I also find it amusing that there was no uproar to this extent, when the verdict was reached on Ian Tomlinson.


8 to 2, who couldn't make up their mind so had to have the bar lowered... Balance of probabilities too... As in 8/2 thought the cop probably thought Duggan had a gun in his hand.

I think the whole thing is incredibly shifty, the removal of the taxi and then the video where the cop walked round a fence, into a park straight to a spot and miraculously found a gun. Combine that with the fact that the police have consistently got away with the indefensible - Tomlinson a prime example whose killer got away with it because the forces own bent medical examiner gave evidence contrary to the prevailing opinion.

So yes, I don't trust any enquiry into police behaviour.

Add to that, the fact that these CO19 officers are meant to be the best we have... Should they really be mistaking a blackberry for a gun in a sock? Should they really be using tactics that put them face to face with a potentially armed man one hat should for them be a routine operation? Should they be shooting their own? Should they then ignore basic procedure and remove evidence from a crime scene?

Oh, don't worry about all of that, it was a stressful situation and matey boy was a gangster anyway...
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Ste
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PostPosted: 22:33 - 12 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
If they planted the gun then they wouldn't they have planted it in a much more incriminating place?
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daemonoid
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PostPosted: 22:36 - 12 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Mk1GSF wrote:
Diane Abbott, self-serving champion of the underclasses(!) put it at 9-1 in what I saw. So was she wrong on it? If she's so supportive of the case, it's amusing that she'd get something like that incorrect.

Seeing as you're dead set that the police are wrong, what do you think YOU would have done in that situation?


I hadn't heard her say 9-1, but it is 8-2 https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/mark-duggan-inquest-london-man-was-lawfully-killed-jury-finds-9046813.html (second paragraph).

I know someone who was in CO19, he was disciplined for using the butt of his rifle instead of shooting someone (who did have a gun). In this situation I think whacking him one would've been more appropriate.
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daemonoid
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PostPosted: 22:43 - 12 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
mpd72 wrote:
It says a lot about you when, you use an adapted photo of you wearing a hoodie pointing a gun at the viewer, as the image people you want people on the Internet to perceive you as.

Why choose THAT image to represent your persona? Do you like to pretend that you're an intimidating gangster, or are you just a twat? Smile


Why have you switched from a perfectly reasonable discussion about the rights and wrongs of policing methods and treatment of human beings to a personal attack on me?

Again, your reaction is a great example of why you are so easily influenced by the media. They show an image you don't like the look of, tie it to an insinuation and you're all up in arms with moral outrage.

And I think you don't know what counter strike is... Nor are your eyes all that good as I'm not wearing a hoodie.

<one more thing> you're just moving the debate from a perfectly reasonable question "show me something that isn't a cheap insinuation that actually shows Duggan to be a gang member or 'leader'". How's about you give up with the worthless sideshow and try to answer that...
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daemonoid
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PostPosted: 22:58 - 12 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
mpd72 wrote:
I like to know who I'm dealing with.

In your case I'm curious why you pick an adapted photo of you thinking you look intimidating pointing a gun at the viewer.

In a thread about a gun toting gangster scrote, it seems a sensible question.

So, why chose that photo of you, which you think makes you look intimidating, to represent your Internet persona?


I've explained twice, but if you can't google for yourself... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counter-Strike I also notice that you don't bother with any of the other things in my sig. You'd at least learn something there.

Do you have a valid co back to my question then? I make that 3 posts in a row where I've made a point to you, I'm waiting for you to make a decent one in return...
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Ste
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PostPosted: 23:00 - 12 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
daemonoid is in the Tottenham Man Dem, I thought everyone knew this?
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Old Thread Alert!

The last post was made 11 years, 205 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful?
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