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| TheSmiler |
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TheSmiler
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| Im-a-Ridah |
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Im-a-Ridah
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 Posted: 03:00 - 01 Feb 2014  Post subject: |
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More votes for UKIP  |
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| Rogerborg |
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Rogerborg
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Posted: 11:04 - 01 Feb 2014  Post subject: |
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Expected. nuLabor stuffed the "Lords" full of their creatures, and had the sense to elevate their bright young things so that they haven't been dying off during the Tory's stint.
The Soviet block of nuLabour + LibDems have a solid lock on the Lords, and will never let a referendum with a raw "out" option through. It was farcical to even go through the motions, but that's how the game is played.
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Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike |
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| Ed Case |
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Ed Case
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| Robby |
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Robby
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| reddeviljp |
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reddeviljp
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| Rogerborg |
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Rogerborg
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| Posted: 14:41 - 01 Feb 2014 Post subject: |
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| Robby wrote: | The Lords don't have to be concerned about being re-elected or getting things done in a short period of time, so they can take a long term view. |
Historically, yes. Now that the majority of it is made up of recent appointees from the rank (very rank) and file of the Inner Parties, I think it's a different story...
| Rogerborg wrote: | nuLabor stuffed the "Lords" full of their creatures, and had the sense to elevate their bright young things |
...and now the poster child for useless done-nothing lickspittle career pole climbing apparatchiks is bawwwing about the Tories putting their own creatures in place. The irony apparently being totally lost on her, or beyond her comprehension. 
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike |
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| Im-a-Ridah |
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Im-a-Ridah
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| Posted: 16:39 - 01 Feb 2014 Post subject: |
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| Ed Case wrote: | The politicians seem to think that by continually dodging the issue that it will go away, it's been festering since the 70's and I suspect it will keep on doing so. I will almost certainly vote UKIP at every opportunity knowing full well that in all probability that they wouldn't have a clue about running a corner shop never mind a country but if nothing else they will frighten the other buggers into giving us a 'Democracy' back and a free vote on our membership of this 'Nest of Vipers'. |
So UKIP would be about as qualified as the current and previous governments then? 
You can't have it both ways, you either want to be ruled by a class of political elites, or you don't. I do have to give credit to the traditional parties on convincing people to only vote for their candidates, because only they have the knowledge and the ability. That must have taken a lot of effort, or a really stupid electorate.
| Robby wrote: | I'm in two minds about this.
On the one hand, a referendum is one of the most democratic acts we have in the UK. Every vote counts. Politicians have no business deciding whether or not the people get to have a referendum, their job is to try and influence people to agree with them.
On the other hand, I prefer the Lords over the Commons. The Lords don't have to be concerned about being re-elected or getting things done in a short period of time, so they can take a long term view.
There is something about the death of expertise in there too. Leaving the EU would be a huge commitment, and I doubt that the electorate would be sufficiently well informed on the implications. Anti-EU sentiment is strong and well fed by the media - a story about the EU screwing up sells newspapers. A story about the myriad long-term benefits of membership does not. |
A fairly weak excuse TBH. I think you should just me more honest and say you like the EU, and you prefer the current system as it means your view is the one of government. Your reasons would be justification for government never doing anything ever.
Giving women the vote/Ending Slavery/Fighting WW2/Setting up the NHS etc would be a huge commitment, and I doubt that the electorate would be sufficiently well informed on the implications. Anti-[aforementioned] is strong and well fed by the media - a story about the [aforementioned] screwing up sells newspapers. A story about the myriad of long-term benefits does not. |
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| Rogerborg |
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Rogerborg
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| Posted: 17:26 - 01 Feb 2014 Post subject: |
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Quick note, the country is "run" by the civil service, councils, police forces and such.
If we released some rabid badgers into the Palace of Westminster and bricked up all the doors and windows, how long would it be before we noticed any change, for better or worse, in our daily lives?
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike |
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| Im-a-Ridah |
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Im-a-Ridah
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| Posted: 17:38 - 01 Feb 2014 Post subject: |
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| Rogerborg wrote: | Quick note, the country is "run" by the civil service, councils, police forces and such.
If we released some rabid badgers into the Palace of Westminster and bricked up all the doors and windows, how long would it be before we noticed any change, for better or worse, in our daily lives? |
Very true, though I was just adopting the terminology. In reality, as you say, the country is run by the Civil Service, and they could continue to do their job without political direction. Unfortunately these same Civil Servants, combined with weak governments, seems to be the reason it is so difficult to get changes made. |
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| Copycat73 |
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Copycat73
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| Posted: 18:38 - 01 Feb 2014 Post subject: |
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Im-a-Ridah
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Posted: 19:15 - 01 Feb 2014  Post subject: |
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It depends on the constituency, but this chart seems to be in the right ballpark. Lib Dems, Conservatives and people that never used to vote. IMO what really helps UKIP is that the main parties don't offer anything different, and tend to treat the electorate a problem to be avoided rather than as a public to serve. Their policies and the way they go about doing things is all very false, where nobody really knows what the politicians truly believe, and where they are more interested in looking good in the next days newspaper headlines and tv coverage. Even if you don't like Nigel Farage, you do actually know his actual opinion. Does anyone really know what Dave, Ed or Nick really, truly thinks? Or just what their opinion is in front of the cameras this week?
https://blogs.channel4.com/factcheck/wp-content/uploads/sites/9/2013/03/04_survation_eastleigh.jpg
https://blogs.channel4.com/factcheck/factcheck-whos-voting-for-ukip/12934 |
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| Copycat73 |
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Copycat73
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| Derivative |
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Derivative
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| Robby |
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Robby
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| Posted: 15:31 - 02 Feb 2014 Post subject: |
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| Rogerborg wrote: | Quick note, the country is "run" by the civil service, councils, police forces and such.
If we released some rabid badgers into the Palace of Westminster and bricked up all the doors and windows, how long would it be before we noticed any change, for better or worse, in our daily lives? |
We'd be able to get things a lot more quickly without having to explain everything in terms the top-floor dribblers can comprehend (short words, big pictures).
That said, the Lib Dem bunch have been useful recently. They seem to have realised that they'll never be in power again and started choosing the option that will work, rather than playing politics.
I'll miss them. Hope we don't get Labour back in, utter shower of morons. At least most of the Conservatives have enough money that they won't starve if they get kicked out of politics for making the "wrong" decision. |
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Old Thread Alert!
The last post was made 12 years, 30 days ago. Instead of replying here, would creating a new thread be more useful? |
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