Why is there no Triumph Daytona 1050?

[Az]

I don't understand why Triumph don't sell a Daytona 1050? A bike similar to the much praised 675 Daytona but with more power and torque, surely their would be a demand for it?

Also, every super bike I can think of has a bigger capacity variant…
zx6r/10r, GSXR600/750/1000, R6/1 etc, so why don't Triumph do the same with their Daytona?

Am I missing something here?

[henry hoover]

I think possibly in the next couple of years you might see one.

It's a question i asked a friend today actually while browsing at the London bike show.
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Cbr600rr 2010 Sold
Zx6r 636 2006 sold
Gsxr 750 L1 current

[Wafer_Thin_Ham]

The 955 didn't go well.
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[Mario_Kempes]

Financially is there a big enough demand for one? I don't mean a demand for people to look at pictures in magazines and on the internet.

The big Jap factories have calmed down on their R & D. No more overhauls every 2 years.

Triumph have been going great guns at a relative level but they're completely dwarfed by the likes of Honda.

If those manufacturers aren't bringing out new sooper dooper superbikes it's for a reason and if they can't do it then I'd be surprised to see Triumph do it.

[G]

Because it'd be incredibly uncompetitive.

BMW and Kawasaki have spent a load on R&D to make their bikes pretty powerful.
Honda spent a load to makes their's easy to ride (loads of midrange).
Yamaha spent a load to makes their's slow but sounding nice for the v-twin crew (cross plane crank).

The 600 market doesn't get the same investment, which is partly why the 675 has stayed around for so long - for the same percentage capacity advantage the big triple would have to be 1125cc. Have a look at Ducati - to try and get close to the BMW in peak power, their 1200cc twin has a similar power curve to a 250cc 2 stroke!

BMW have a BIG R&D budget to back them up - and likely they can justify it being used for other motorsport R&D and so on.

Triumph doesn't have the budget to be competitive.

The 675 offered a decent alternative to the 600 4s and 750 twin - I don't think they'd be able to do the same at the top class - remember MV and Aprilia have also got their own Superbikes that mostly seem to sell on name rather than ability.

[smithyithy]

Financially it wouldn't be justifiable. Which is a shame because it could be pretty awesome!

[Bendy]

The 1050 engine is pretty weighty, the Speed Triple is basically an engine with a seat and a pair of headlights - it's a heavy bike. To be on par with the competition there would be a lot of engine work to do - more power and less weight (and as G pointed out, technically more capacity).

I had a Speed Triple and a Sprint ST. If they could put that engine in something the size (and weight) of a Daytona I'd be waving my credit card at Triumph in a heartbeat, but in reality they don't need to do it. Rumour's been rife for years, I don't see it happening.

[Groove]

One could pose the question of a 600cc sports bmw...
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|| Past: 1991 Kawasaki ZXR 250 ~ 2003 Honda CBR 600 F Sport ~ 2004 Kawasaki ZX6R B1H 636 ~ 1999 Yamaha R1 ~ 1999 Kawasaki ZX6R J ~ 2004 Kawasaki ZX6R B1H 636 ~ 1998 Honda VTR1000F Firestorm ~ K1 GSXR 600 Track bike ~ K6 GSXR 1000 ~ 2006 Speed Triple 1050 || Current: 2005 R1 https://www.adrucore.co.uk

[G]

Would be interesting if they did; but there's a bit of a question of the justification - for most people, they could just get a GSXR 750 if they wanted more than a 600.

I suspect one of the reasons we haven't seen so much improvement in the 600 class is that if they start to pump them up with a load more power, they're going to need more weight to cope with the power - at which point, might as well just have a bigger bike anyway .

Also, remember the S1000RR is probably the worst of the superbikes for engine reliability.

It could be interesting if someone tried to go really light - but again that gets expensive - NCR does some very nice Ducati based bikes, but at a cost that would never be justifiable for most that won't be any faster than a normal bike anyway probably.

[leighz]

not sure why manufacturers are still making 1000cc sport bikes for the road? No one can use them - hence all the electronics to make it rideable. If anything I would hazard a controversial guess that they're putting people off.

750cc makes much more sense

Think there's a strong argument for triumph to build an 800 version of the 675. Lengthen the stroke of the 675 (like MV did with their 675 triple) and you're there.

[G]

No one can use a c90 to it's full ability, so might as well stick to a c50 .

Triumph already has a 800 version of the 675 I thought - in the 'adventure' or whatever bikes.

I rather suspect the electronics are for lap times and letting people go faster if they WANT. In the end, I doubt it's that much easier to get a S1000RR than an older early-fugl fireblade to let go, maybe harder.

[leighz]

triumph don't have a circa 800cc sportsbike

think the electronics are about stopping riders from hurting themselves. A lot.

[G]

[andys675]

they haven't got the bus fare, and that's why the existing speed triple still has the old motor in an entirely new rolling chassis

sports bikes are the most expensive to R&D, and their sales across the world are in the biggest sales decline, so it's cheaper to develop adventure bikes which are in the biggest growth market

the 1050 is the old 955 bored out, they have bodged it to get it past newer emissions laws for years, so no point sticking it in a new model as it won't pass the next lot of EU regs

if they did build it, sure they'd sell to triumph enthusiasts but it would go undeveloped, incomparable to other marques in performance terms and sales would stop

IMO, their next step is a daytona 800, the tiger 800 has been fitted and tested at the factory in a daytona frame, but due to being the wrong bore/stroke for a sports engine they couldn't get it any faster, so the 2013 daytona has changed bore and stroke, and now has the same bore and stroke as the MV, which has a more powerful 800cc version, next logical step big bore the new 675 engine to 800 to replace or run alongside the 675
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[stevo as b4]

As the 1050cc could not be developed into a competitive litre bike even probably at 1125cc, I am more surprised why Triumph canned the almost ready for sale Daytona 1300 project?

It must surely be easier to build a competitive Hayabusa, K1300S rival than it is to aim for the top of the litre sportsbike class.

I also think a pretty sporty tourer with high spec fully adjustable suspension and another 300cc or more to make the same 200bhp as litre bikes, would make for a much nicer and better road bike overall too!

[Polarbear]

It's totally too expensive for Triumph.

They have just built a new motor for the 1200 adventure and tourers. Honda & Yamaha would have built a different motor for each. Triumph can't afford that so they manipulate them with the ECU, compression, exhaust etc to make the characteristics pretty good for each class of bike.

However it is a compromise. I have both the Trophy and Explorer. I love them and the engines but the triple in my Trophy isn't a patch on the flat six in a Goldwing for smooth touring and the Explorer isn't an off road adventure bike, it's a sit up touring bike with the ability to ride over a field. A big twin would probably be a better option.

The 675 Daytona engine was developed for the Daytona sports bike. I bet though that Triumph have made more money with the Street triple and that was purely by chance (wasn't it? )

Remember, Triumph are tiny compared with the Japanese companies. BMW has it's car department to assist with whatever it requires. Ducati has Audi's money now. Harley Davidson have the tractor division to fall back on for new models and Laverda used to make combine harvesters.
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[G]

[Polarbear]

[G]

4 cylinder in line on the FJR going to be a bit wide for a wannabe dirt bike, while a parallel twin probably a bit lacking for the market they are aiming at.

With the CB500 and 700 thingies etc, Honda seem to definitely be going for the whole cost saving by just bolt on a few different bits and selling it as a different bike.