CBT Plus (2 day course) in Kent?

[TallPaul_S]

Hello all

I'm gonna be doing my CBT in the next month or 2 and have seen that you can do a CBT Plus course, which instead of the single day, morning on the training area then afternoon on the road, is split with the first day off road and the second day riding on road.

I quite like the look of this, I did an hour free ride last year through the get on scheme and loved it, but as a car driver of over 10 years I have a feeling the gears (and hand/foot co-ordination) may be a struggle for me! Plus I like the idea of having 2 days training before being let loose on the road, sometimes the single day isn't quite enough.

Problem is, the only place I can see which does this in Kent in BMW Motorrad, which is a bit far away for me to get to for 2 days in a row. https://www.cooperbikestunbridgewells.co.uk/world-of-bmw/rider-training/direct-access/cbt-plus.html

So, does anyone know of anywhere else in Kent which does the CBT Plus course? Had a google but couldn't find any really close to me (Maidstone area). The BMW one does have a the nice option of a go on an F650GS in their off road training area at the end of the 2 days too, which is tempting

Edit: Just realised the BMW rider training is done in Royston, Herts. So would need to stay overnight at a hotel, which is starting to get very expensive to do a CBT. £300 for the course, £100 travel and hotel... vs £110 locally within 20 minutes walk for the 1 day course.

[Rogerborg]

There's no such beast as "CBT Plus". I mean, they can offer what they like and call it what they like as long as they deliver at least the CBT content and hand out a DL196 at the end of it, but there's not really a competitive market for such courses.

That said, I think it sounds like a splendid idea. There's a lot to take in on a CBT, especially if you don't have the giddy overconfidence of a teenager. I went back to do my on-road on a second day and felt I really benefitted from the break.

So if you're prepared to budget for a 2 day course, you could just ask the local training schools what you'd get for the same money, and how flexible they'd be. For example, you could do the off-road part in the morning, then when the rest of them are off doing the on-road, you just keep practising by yourself in the yard. Since that's not part of the course per-se, they don't actually need to have any instructors there with you.

If you're intending to go on to a taught course leading to an A test with them, I can't see many places objecting to you having a go on one of the bigger bikes at the end of the day if you ask.

And if they do object, they might not be a great choice as a training school, so at least you'll find that out early.
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Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[pinkyfloyd]

Just to follow on from what Roger said. The CBT is an overload of info on the first day. There is so much to take in if you have never ridden before. That said though, if you listen to the instructor then you should "get it" in the first day.

That said, our place offer the full day and if you do not get the required standard by the end of the day you get an extra few hours to concentrate on what has been giving you issues. Never have we had to refuse a CBT after the extra few hours.

As for getting on a big bike. If the student is intending to do DAS with us I have permission to do a big bike conversion when I get back from road ride. Its always good fun watching the grin when they get on the bigger bikes.

Personally I wouldnt waste the money. It can be done in the one day. Go to a local well respected school in your area and book through them, get the single day one. It will be all you need.
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illuminateTHEmind wrote: I am just more evolved than most of you guys... this allows me to pick of things quickly which would have normally taken the common man years to master
Hockeystorm65:.well there are childish arguments...there are very childish arguments.....there are really stupid childish arguments and now there are......Pinkfloyd arguments!
Teflon-Mike:I think I agree with just about all Pinky has said.

[TallPaul_S]

Cheers. I'm just looking to do my CBT then have 6-12 months on a 125 before doing the full test, but it would have been a nice bonus to have a little ride on a big bike.

On the 1 hour free ride we did quite a bit, by the end I was comfortably doing ovals up and down the training area, pulling away & stopping, doing figure of 8's and slalom in control no problem. With having 12-odd years driving experience, reading the roads I'm good with too, and I'm confident filtering on a push bike through traffic, so lifesavers are already ingrained.

The only part which I can't get my head around is changing gears. At the start of the hour free ride I was having some problems making my brain cope with the combination of front brake, throttle, clutch and back brake, we didn't touch the gears apart from going from neutral to 1st when stationary. Probably doesn't help having ridden pushbikes either, although right hand front brake is natural to me, the rest is completely alien!

If someone was to do their CBT then not ride a bike for a month or 2, would you forget what you've learnt by then? A day isn't enough to get muscle memory ingrained, I'd gone for 18 months without driving a car but can jump back in and change gear no problem, but that's because of nearly a decade of driving. I can see that after a day on a bike, a few weeks gap and I might have lost what I'd learnt. I ask this because I might look at doing my CBT in the next week or 2, but then it would be a 1-2 months at least before I'd be able to get a bike.

[pinkyfloyd]

Once you have ridden a bike you never forget. What you will have to be aware of is everything on your CBT is geared towards teaching you how to ride and ride as safe as you can. It is the bare minimum needed to earn the DL196 form. After that you are on your own to take what you have learnt and improve your skills.

You wont forget the riding. May forget the life savers a few time and rest or safety position but it all comes back.
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illuminateTHEmind wrote: I am just more evolved than most of you guys... this allows me to pick of things quickly which would have normally taken the common man years to master
Hockeystorm65:.well there are childish arguments...there are very childish arguments.....there are really stupid childish arguments and now there are......Pinkfloyd arguments!
Teflon-Mike:I think I agree with just about all Pinky has said.

[ficedula]

[marsden1967]

After doing the CBT my first solo trip out was an absolute disaster. I forgot everything that I had done and was an absolute gibbering wreck.
The second time I went out it was at 5 o' clock in the morning when there was no one else on the road. I also still regularly go onto industrial estates to practice u turns, figures of 8 etc.
I am now getting ready to (hopefully) take my test in a month or so.
Just take your time, stay calm and go at your own pace.Iif I can do it, anyone can
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Ooooh Matron!
current bike(s) YBR 125, ER6 N

[Northern Monkey]

Training when you've just started to ride is a good idea.

It will stop bad habits forming, which can be difficult to get rid of, and IMHO, 45 minutes riding around an industrial estate isn't enough to then ride about on your own safely.

You don't say how much extra the second day of riding is, however, most schools will charge you around £25 to £30 per hour for training. If you're paying about £100 for at least 4 hours on the road, then it's a good idea.

[gbrand42]

My school do what they call a Roadrider course, which can be taken the day after after CBT and aims to give you more on road time with an instructor and fills the gap between CBT and Mod 1&2 training. You can do it on their bikes or your own. And can be half day or full day depending on your preference.

Won't say which school this is in case it looks like advertising, but they are a great school have been established for 30 years and are in Cheriton near Folkestone. Let me know if you need their name.
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Yamaha RD50M, Honda C90, Yamaha RS100, Yamaha RD125LC, Honda XL125 V9 Varadero, Honda NT700VA, Honda VFR800X, Honda CRF1000L, Honda ST1300 Pan European

[pinkyfloyd]

Having a think about the OP my main issue is the first day being off road. There is only so much you can do on the CBT in the yard and it surely wont take all day. The CBT is made up of 5 elements. They comprise of 2 classroom where the instructor talks to you. One static bit in the yard where you are introduced to the bike, controls, starting the engine, basic maintenance without riding the bike and walking the bike.

The 2 practical parts are the yard work and the road ride. Fair enough for the road ride you can spend a good bit of the day riding around with the instructor but how do you make element C in the yard last all day?

The yard part goes as follows (some schools vary the order of parts but I will give the list of our school.)

Pulling away.
Riding around to get used to the bike. circles, large figure 8's
Slow control.
U turn.
Braking both standard and emergency stop.
Gears (we like them to be able to stop properly before we let them go faster)
junction work.

Even the most incompetent rider who struggles, and I have had a few, could master all of that within an hour or 2. The longest I have spent is 2 hours before offering the guy a completion of the ped because he couldnt get to grips with the gears and clutch control. (turned out his 125 was a ped anyways!)
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illuminateTHEmind wrote: I am just more evolved than most of you guys... this allows me to pick of things quickly which would have normally taken the common man years to master
Hockeystorm65:.well there are childish arguments...there are very childish arguments.....there are really stupid childish arguments and now there are......Pinkfloyd arguments!
Teflon-Mike:I think I agree with just about all Pinky has said.

[TallPaul_S]

Did my CBT today, thought to myself that I may as well get it over and done with, after all I might have hated it!

I didn't.

Went really well, the hour on a bike that I had nearly a year ago (7th May 2013), helped loooooooads. Slow speed clutch control was ok at the start, and towards the end of the off-road part was getting I was getting really comfy with it. So long as there wasn't 20 other things to do at the same time like indicating, lifesaver, positioning, rear brake, looking where you're going, phew!! When out on the road though, with more time to plan, it's a lot easier.

So the morning went well, time flew by, gears (the bit I was was worried about) just well... clicked. Only issue was getting my thick soled hiking boots under the gear lever just after pulling away, shifting up after that was easy once I had located it.

Downshifting was great too, and shifting into 3rd/4th/5th on the move was nice and easy and pretty smooth. Only I kept wanted to change into 6th at 35mph... On a YBR with 5 gears

So yeah, if that 1 hour on a bike a year ago made me be able to pretty much jump on the bike and pull away pretty smoothly, do tight U turns (only put my foot down once over the course of about 20 U turns, and that was only because of the damn camber in the road!) then I'm pretty sure what I learnt today in the CBT will stay with me well.

Thanks again for the advice, now just the agonising wait until I can afford to buy gear and a 125 to get to work and back on

PS : even got a nod from 2 bikers as we were waiting at a T-junction for traffic to pass. Good guys not only nodding a learner, but a learner with an instructor behind him

[pinkyfloyd]