Car, police and unlicensed driver

[open]

Hi,

Long story short, I got my car licence a few weeks ago (I have however known how to drive for a while). And I showed my friend how to operate a car in a supermarket car park. Police approached, told me it was a public highway & said I will get summons in post; now I wanna know what is gonna happen.

My friend is young and has just sent off for his provisional, looking to take an intensive course for driving as he needs to learn quick for a new job.

I live less than a minute walk from a large supermarket car park. I decided to take him in the car park and give him some pointers behind the wheel. He has never been behind a wheel before. I was showing him basic things like where indicators are, how to break, windscreen wipers, etc, just getting him comfortable for when he starts taking lessons soon.

So supermarket car park, after hours.

Anyway Police came up in a van, at first didn't even see it was Police, just thought it was a van that wanted me to give way, start moving the wheel for friend, and put it in drive (Automatic - have manual licence though). Feds now run up swing doors open shouting at us to get out of the car, taking key out of ignition.

Anyway explained, checks run, searched etc, Everything fine on that part. But he has no licence and no insurance.

Told that as public can enter car park it is a public highway, and that he is getting done for drivng w/out insurance/licence and I am getting done for "permitting an unlicenced and uninsured driver to use your vehicle"

Now needless to say we weren't playing real life GTA and most of the officers were sympathetic, apart from one lady who had it for us and was arguing for my friend to get arrested and taken to the station becuase "she couldn't prove his ID" - thankfully another officer convinced her to let it get processed without him getting taken to the station.

So, given all that is said - what is the likely outcome for both me and him?
____________________
"Calamity - A more than commonly plain & unmistakable reminder that the affairs of this life are not of our own ordering."

[s]Baotian BT49qt-9 --> Honda CG125 (4 speed) '51 plate ----- 03/11/2012 Mod 2 PASSED! --> Cb500s[/s] Revoked

[Kari-On]

TL;DR

You're fucked.

[open]

[Fisty]

You need a solicitor. ASAP.
____________________
Quietly and consistently taking the piss.
TL1000R | Hayabusa | ZXR400 | TL1000S | Bandit 400 V
Fatter and faster than Fret

[P.addy]

https://assets.diylol.com/hfs/ceb/284/c66/resized/chuck-norris-meme-generator-bro-you-re-fucked-ba580d.jpg

Next time, tell him what to do, let him loose on the main roads, they won't suspect it then

[arry]

6 points minimum for you so goodbye licence

[yen_powell]

I got 4 points for permitting back in 84 and it not only put up my insurance premiums, I actually had a policy cancelled when I eventually got a car a few years later.

I had disclosed the conviction when buying car insurance, it took a week for them to realise they didn't want me any more and I got a phone call telling me not to drive as they were cancelling with immediate effect. I had to do some frantic ringing round to sort out an alternative insurer.

My mate (the person I let use my bike whose insurance had lapsed) got a ban but never had any problems with insurance afterwards. He had ridden the wrong way on a motorway slip road, been spotted and stopped and had then given a false name.
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Blackmail is a nasty word........but not as nasty as phlegm!
XT1200Z and a DR350 in bits

[tbourner]

I thought supermarket car parks were private land?
____________________
Trev, now a biker?
Looking for first big bike.

[Rogerborg]

No, they are a public place, and the lanes between the bays are a road. Bowman v DPP 1991, May v DPP 2005 and doubtless many others.

How nobbed you are depends on the exact circumstances. Don't answer this, but if he was behind the wheel and the car was in the lanes between the bays rather than stopped in a bay when they arrived, then I would suggest that you go guilty and blub.

Your license will be revoked, which means that you will have to go through the process of getting it all over again.

If you want to avoid that, you should speak to a specialist motoring solicitor as soon as possible. Tell them exactly what happened from the moment that the police arrived on-site. The background doesn't matter, don't waste their time with it, just what the police saw or you were daft enough to admit to them.

But essentially:

tl;dr - you're fu​​cked.
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[jeddy11]

I like to think there is some sensibility left in the world, if what you say is true and there was no messing around and the car park was empty and out of hours ??? you could tell the truth that you lifted the barrier to get in which would then be a private car park..

Or tell your story it may be mitigating and you get let off with a fine ??

But then im a believer in sensibility which doesn't happen so often now ..
____________________
Fuelly My Z1000SX
cbt 06/08/11 mod1 (second go) 01/08/12 mod2 21/09/12
Varadero Viking YBR125>Varadero125>ER6F>Z1000SX !!!

[Conzar]

https://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/masonry/000/024/961/chonglirape.jpg
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Current ride: ZX6R 636 ------- Previous:KTM EXC 450 Supermoto --- ZX6R B1H --Hornet 600--CBR 600--SV650
11:05:35 Rob Fzs: i just wanna own an rd350 valve before they send us to war with durkadurkastan

[wr6133]

Everytime I've been convicted of something they had to arrest, interview and charge me first....... this seems not to have happened here.

So no taped interview of you saying what the police claim happened, if they have no photographic evidence then it's you and your mates word against whichever of the coppers actually turns up to court. Not that I'd advocate making up a good story and hoping the burden of proof being on them swings your way.

[open]

I feel so shit right now.

For something as trivial as letting my friend sit in the drivers seat of my car in a car park, my life is fucked.

Could anyone give me a link to a recommended solicitor?

I really feel depressed now.
____________________
"Calamity - A more than commonly plain & unmistakable reminder that the affairs of this life are not of our own ordering."

[s]Baotian BT49qt-9 --> Honda CG125 (4 speed) '51 plate ----- 03/11/2012 Mod 2 PASSED! --> Cb500s[/s] Revoked

[open]

Spoke to a motoring solicitor just now - she said that yeah I could be looking at 6-8 points, but that court could be months away so to call them when I have a summons.

6 point = insta revokation of license. She said, outside of finding holes in the case, best thing would be to convince judge to disqualify me from driving for a short time instead of points. But that is considered a more HARSH penalty. So would have to convince them to do so.
____________________
"Calamity - A more than commonly plain & unmistakable reminder that the affairs of this life are not of our own ordering."

[s]Baotian BT49qt-9 --> Honda CG125 (4 speed) '51 plate ----- 03/11/2012 Mod 2 PASSED! --> Cb500s[/s] Revoked

[stinkwheel]

It's a level 3 fine and 3-6 points.

Take legal advice but I'd say go guilty, try for as much mitigation as you can and hope the magistrate likes the cut of your jib.

Realistically, the only "official" mitigation is that of a genuine misunderstanding.

Oddly. If your friend gets 6 points, he keeps his provisional. If you do, your licence is revoked.

A point to stress. Do NOT talk to the police again about this matter without legal advice. For example. They COULD try to hang the insurance thing round your neck if they were being a dick about it. Permitting an uninsured driver to use your vehicle is also an offence.

You could be put in the unenviable position of either claiming your mate was driving without your consent (in which case they do him for taking it) or having your licence revoked.

This happened to a friend of my Dads (who was already on six points) when his teenage son stupidly decided to borrow his car. He had a choice of a charge of permitting his son to drive without insurance (which is an automatic 6 points or a ban, they have no other option) and potentially losing his licence or having his son charged for taking without consent, which is a serious criminal charge. He took the former, got a sympathetic sheriff and had to suck up a short ban and sitting on 9 points.
____________________
“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.”
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.

[lihp]

The worse thing is you were less than 8 months away from new being clear of the new drivers act.

Also, when you get your bike license back it will probably be under the new rules so you won't have unrestricted license after 2 years, and will have to go through the farce of a test system with multiple tests 2 or do DAS if you're old enough

[lihp]

To follow on from Stinkwheels post, in my experience you don't have much of a defense with exceptional hardship as that is the punishment, that only works if it will have a serious hardship on somebody that relies on you.

I don't think he will be able to push the TWOC when he was sat in the car with him

[open]

[arry]

[lihp]

[arry]

[wr6133]

Do new driver laws apply from the date of the offence or from the date of conviction?

Ask a solicitor. If it's from date of conviction then ask them if there is anything they can do to stall and delay the case to the point you are clear of the new driver laws (though you may need a solicitor on the more shyster side of things for this).

8 months to court is possible I've gone 9 months from charged to court though that was on something a bit more complicated.

[Monkeypony]

No constructive advise to offer you, but this is really shit

I hope you don't get shafted too hard for what is really a nothing offence.

I didn't realise that normal 'rules of the road' applied in car parks either!

Best of luck chap!
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Current bike - 2018 H2-SX, 2004 SV1000s, 2016 Aprilia RSV4 RF, 2017 Sherco SERF 300, 2003 Suzuki DRZ400 (stolen - AY53 JUU)

[arry]

[wr6133]