Why arent old bikes like old cars

[Doomsnite]

Brand new bikes are cheaper than brand new cars but their prices hold so well. Im window shopping for when i pass my test and most bikes in my budget are from the previous century whereas i wouldnt consider a car of that age, would usually be a right shitter.

Are they just usually in a better condition as not used as often or what?
____________________
Triumph Street Triple-R
Sold: Honda Hornet CB600F-Y / Yamaha YBR125

[trevor saxe-coburg-gotha]

Yes.

Being a leisure thing rather than a utilitarian affair they survive far, far longer. Remember - a lot see neither rain nor winter.
____________________
"Life is a sexually transmitted disease and the mortality rate is one hundred percent."

Mobylette Type 50 ---> Raleigh Grifter ---> Neval Minsk 125

[yen_powell]

Twenty bazillion bazillion cars about and only 12 actual second hand bikes available at any one time. This causes the price holding difference.
____________________
Blackmail is a nasty word........but not as nasty as phlegm!
XT1200Z and a DR350 in bits

[Doomsnite]

Yeah guess i didnt think of that. Guess im getting disheartened that chopping in my 2009 125 may only get me a 98/99. Better get saving!
____________________
Triumph Street Triple-R
Sold: Honda Hornet CB600F-Y / Yamaha YBR125

[TheCatSatOnTh...]

You also have to consider just how expensive modern bikes are. 10 years ago or so and the GSXR600 was £6000, it's now £9000 and I'm willing to bet wages haven't increased by half in that time. Mine certainly haven't.

10 years ago I could afford a brand new bike, but there's no way I can justify that sort of money, which means there are probably more people like me looking for 2nd hand.

[J.M.]

[arry]

[chickenstrip]

The situation was made worse in the last ten years or so as many second hand bikes were shipped off to the continent. I've seen guys come over from Europe in an artic, go in a showroom - yep, we'll have that one, that one, that one.....and those bikes disappear from the UK for ever. Why? Partly it has to do with the cost of new bikes in Europe compared to the UK. At one time not long ago, a new R1 in Denmark cost something like twice the price of one in the UK (can't remember exact difference, but you get the picture), so demand for good second hand bikes there was high.

So we lost a lot of our good second hand stock when not many were buying new bikes (in 2010 for instance, at High Beach, a popular bike meet, I think I saw about 2 2010 plates in the whole year). This will take a while to turn around, but bike sales are up by a nice amount this year, so the situation should improve in the next couple of years - fingers crossed.

[slowlydoesit]

[G]

Different market.

Also, consider milages - the bikes you're seeing are at very low mileages compared to the cars.

Car technology has arguably moved on a lot more than bikes too.

There's a pretty significant difference between a 20 year old fiesta and a brand new one for the driver sitting in it.
A 20 year old 500cc commuter and a new one (without optional ABS)? Sure, you get FI, but for the rider, not much has really changed.

If you have a look at sports car and higher end prices over similar times, you'll see a more-similar percentage of depreciation.

[Teflon-Mike]

Here in the UK we are obsessed with how old cars are; which was why when they changed the registration coding, they retained the 'year' identifier, and even refined it! In other bits of Europe, they don't identify age on registration and folk buy and sell cars on their condition.

Bikes ENT cars. Share a few common features; they are both means of transport; they both have an engine... but after that, they are as different as Birds and Bees.

Cars are domestic appliances; almost every-one has one; there's 60 million people in the UK, and approximately 30 million cars; with an average 'service life' of about 10 years, 3 million new ones sold every year, changing hands about once every two and a half years; about 10 million cars are sold each year.

There's a lot about, and there's a lot changing hands; the market is pretty much 'saturated'; whilst they all get used pretty similarly, like a washing machine or dish-washer... some might get used a bit harder than others, but within usual limits, 'wear and tear' is pretty much proportional to age.

Bikes? ENT cars. They are more like leisure equipment or sporting goods; a multi-gym or golf clubs, or fishing rods.

So first of all, take away that cultural prejudice associated with CARS, in the UK. It's not particularly helpful to valuing cars, let alone anything else!

Now; as a bit of sporting equipment, would you be worried how old a Multi-Gym was, as long as it had the features you wanted, did the job and was in good condition? Or a set of golf-Clubs, or a Fishing Rod?

As Sporting goods, a bit of hobby Equipment; might have been bought in a pique of enthusiasm, used three times and stuck in a cupboard when novelty wore off. Alternatively, could have been bought by some-one who's enthusiasm grew rather than dwindled, and has been very very hard used.

Use bikes get varies hugely; you get bikes that don't do very many miles; some of them low miles bike might have been ridden very gingerly by less confident rider; other's might have been thrashed mercilessly by one determined to get their thrills on the one Sunny Day off work they have had this month. Some bikes might have cranked significantly high miles; again; some by riders who treat them gently, perhaps touring maybe every week-end; or thrashed, every day, taking the long way to and from work!

CONDITION IS ALL.

While, there is aproximately only one bike on UK roads for every 30 cars... 30 million cars? Less than a million bikes.... That means that there's fewer bikes in the UK in total, than there are cars on sale each year in the UK!

And unlike cars; 'trade' in bikes isn't the same. Cars are big lumps of metal; they tend to get sold or scrapped when people don't need them any-more, as they take up too much space, and aren't much use for anything, and can be a bludy liability with the SORN laws!

Bikes? Old Bikes dont Die... they become 'Projects'! They dont take up much space; they get stuck in the back of sheds, or pulled top bits in garages with ideas of making a cafe-racer or chopper or something. Meanwhile, there are riders who will buy a new bike every year, but there are just as many, who will hang onto bikes for many many years; they dont have such predictable, 3-year ownership periods.

So, answer is, that bikes ENT cars! There's fewer about. Fewer changing hands; and not being such 'disposable' consumer goods, they don't start disappearing after thirteen years!

Disengage 'CAR' thinking, and look at the BIKE not the number-plate.
____________________
My Webby'Tef's-tQ, loads of stuff about my bikes, my Land-Rovers, and the stuff I do with them!
Current Bikes:'Honda VF1000F' ;'CB750F2N' ;'CB125TD ( 6 3 of em!)'; 'Montesa Cota 248'. Learner FAQ's:= 'U want to Ride a Motorbike! Where Do U start?'

[Doomsnite]

Yeah as long as the technology hasnt changed much then i dont really mind. With a car, the smoothness of driving a newer car against a 10 y old one can be significant so nice to have that. Plus i do like the design of mid 2000 onwards bikes with the exception of the hornet so i just better get saving!
____________________
Triumph Street Triple-R
Sold: Honda Hornet CB600F-Y / Yamaha YBR125

[unluckyluke]

Supply and demand plays the biggest part but I think reliability and safety are other key factors. A much higher percentage see a bike as a toy rather than a necessary form of transport to take them to work. If you can't get to work you can't earn money and so it needs to be reliable whereas if the bikes off the road for a couple of weeks it's not really a problem. Plus you don't send your kids out on your bike whereas you do in your car and therefore you want them to be as safe as possible and so as new models become safer more people switch to a newer car creating a larger used market. When you think about it the question should really be why are used cars so bloody cheap?

[Ayrton]

Maybe it has something to do with how few miles bikes generally do compared to cars.
like tef said as well, most old bikes become 'projects' or 'barn-find' and then sell on ebay for stupid prices.

When i was looking around for a 125 i spotted a CG that was from the 90's. My parents being car people said that it was too old and would be covered in rust. Bikes are far more different to cars than people think.

[stevo as b4]

Pretty much agree with a lot that has been said here, but I wish we could trip up over mint 25year old cars everywhere in barns etc, as the old and rare cars would not be too expensive now, and there'd be parts everywhere.

I disagree in a way with what G said about new car's have come on so much in 20years though. I don't see it sorry?

I've just borrowed a 3month old Corsa 1.4SXI to go on holiday in, and despite it driving ok and doing the job ok, I could not see where it has really advanced from my 94 Rover 220 turbo?

1, Still start it with a key
2, Remote central locking hasn't changed
3, ABS and PAS havn't changed

Basically if technology has moved on that much I don't expect to be doing things like 20 years ago. Using key ignition, handbrakes, manual gearbox's etc etc. Driving still feels the same, needs the same inputs and in the example of car's I have used they both don't really work any differently, look unrecognisably different or run on different fuels etc.

Progress? Huge advances? I don't really buy all that bullshit I'm afraid. The only thing with new car's that amazes me is the improvement in fuel economy with modern engine technology. In 1994 a 2.0 petrol engine in a typical family car would get you 25mpg on average at best, and 30mpg on a steady motorway run maybe?

Now you have 2.0 TSFI engines with up to 260-270bhp doing an easy 40mpg and more in favourable conditions etc.

p.s. Off topic, but what happened exactly to make brand new £6000-8000 litre bikes in say 2001-2004 now cost £9000-10000 now? Did they get that much better?

[Copycat73]

[i.p.phrealy]

[c-m]

[Copycat73]

[Kickstart]

[stevo as b4]

Maybe the claims are a step too far, but for emissions and mpg it does seem that direct injection turbo petrol engines can achieve a lot more than old school motor's.

My Rover as std gets to 9-10:1 AFR at times and always stinks of fuel. You can have modern turbo petrol's running very lean due to DI and no detonation hence much better fuel economy.

Id like to compare MPG between say an Audi A4 TFSI Quattro and a Mitsubishi Lancer Evo8 for example. I bet the Audi is way better on fuel, but the downside is complexity IMO.

[Al]

[Kickstart]

Hi

Possibly, but the Lancer Evo was a small production performance car running low gearing, rather than the upmarket 4wd version of a rep mobile. Not really equivalent cars.

Your Rover was a fairly pokey turbo when new, while now for most cars turbos are bolted on to give acceptable performance while being able to dribble along slowly for the emissions tests.

[Al]

Me too but other people now claim they wouldn't buy a car without certain aids. My friend loves his electronic handbrake but I've used one once and hated it.
____________________
Yamaha FZR400RR 3tj
My Instagram Thingy

[clancy]