Lazy hardtail

[PT1989]

Always quite liked the bobber look, not as a main bike but for short local trips where practicality is unimportant.
I've seen a few cheap Chinese cruisers, and reckon I can have something good enough for a couple hundred. I'm not asking for advice on using a Chinese bike as the donor for this, it doesn't have to be reliable or fast, so that decision has been made.

I want to drop the back end, but obviously this causes clearance issues over the back wheel, so I'm thinking of a hardtail, but don't want to get into welding a hardtail to the frame.

Most of them are basic twin shock deals, can I just take these out and replace with a metal bar? If so what sort of metal/thickness will I need? I can't weld, and as this is a cheap toy I don't want to pay for welding either. It'll most likely just be a 125/250, and I weigh around 10st so wouldn't be a lot of weight on it. But obviously I don't want the metal to buckle the minute I hit rough ground.

Also, any advice on replacing twin shocks? Obviously the back end is going to drop as soon as they're off. So when putting new ones on is it a case of just pulling it back up with one hand and shoving the new ones on? Wouldn't have thought there's much weight on the back end? Or will I need jacks/a friend?

I've seen this, which seems to be the same set up I'm considering.
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/639RmVSoChQ/maxresdefault.jpg

[stinkwheel]

Replace the shocks one at a time, then it won't collapse.

Yes you can replace the shocks with a set of metal struts, seen it done many times. Make sure you use good quality bolts and torque them down correctly. A small amount of play will very quickly oval out the holes in the mountings.

HOWEVER. Consider carefully if you are confident a Chinese cruiser frame will be able to take the extra rattling/vibration. I've personally seen two in the flesh and have seen pictures of other Chinese frames which have cracked under normal use.

Other considerations include tyre clearance. You're going to want either a really sprung saddle or a big, soft rear tyre.

If you drop the rear end and nothing else, you will alter the frame geometry. You will effectively shorten the wheelbase and decrease the rake angle. This will make the bike twitchy and tend to turn in very sharply. When people build a proper chop they "chop" the frame off behind the headstock, cut a bit out of the top tube and weld it back on at a different angle to correct the rake angle. They often combine this with adding longer forks.

Another way of doing this without chopping the frame is to fit a set of angled yokes. There are two types, one of them has the holes drilled through them at an angle. The other has a special bearing so the yoke can be set at an angle to the headstock.

You could drop the forks through the yoke slightly to compensate for dropping the rear but you may find this makes it even twitchier by further shortening the wheelbase and you could land up with grounding out problems.

Or it might handle well enough. You just have to suck it and see. Just so you're aware it's not necessarily as simple as bolting struts on and rocking away before you do anything irreversible.
____________________
“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.”
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.

[PT1989]

Yeah, if I was replacing with stock shocks then I'd do one at a time, but if I'm dropping the back end, then I'll be using shorter ones, guessing about 2 inches shorter (haven't picked a specific bike yet so not exact). So how would I go about doing that?

I didn't think about the bolts actually, good shout, what metal would you (or anyone else) advise? As I'm hopeless at remembering the properties of each type.

I had considered the front end, at the minute I'm thinking either angled yokes or just lowering equal to the rear. Obviously this depends on the specific bike I end up with, as it's just ideas at the minute.

Seating has also been considered, I've got a few in the garage that might be suitable, but if not then there are plenty of options available on fleabay. I don't fancy the seat in that pic, even for short trips!

I'm really not fussed about how well it performs or how reliable it is, it'll just be for local stuff, so within about 3 miles, 20-40mph, Chinese will do.

One of the main reasons I want it, is I'm in a rented house, with no real parking or space, I've got a rented garage/workshop about half a mile away where the rest of the bikes are kept, so I might just use this one to drive to the garage and get on the bike I'm using that given day.
Might seem like a lot of faff, but honestly, I'd rather that than deal with wet cold rain covers, and chains and locks etc. And if it's stolen/disintegrates into a pile of rust, then so be it, it will die with purpose.

[wr6133]

The general consensus on the Pioneer Nevada Owners Club is that Nevs, torros, jinluns and other Chinese cruisers make for bad hardtail conversions. The frames don't handle it well apparently.

[stinkwheel]

I, personally, would splurge on a set of 12,9 high tensile bolts and matching grade 12 nuts for that application. Torque them up properly to the full whack they ought to be (you'll need to consult an engineering table to find the figures).

Once those bad-boys are screwed home, it'll be like a solid bit of metal.

I wouldn't in any case, use anything lower than and 8,8, mild steel bolt.

If you're going to drop out both shocks, support the bike on a stand (fitting the footpegs upside down and using a couple of axle-stands under them works on most bikes), remove the wheel and let the swingarm drop. Fit your new struts top-end first then lift the swingarm to meet them with one hand and slot the bolt in with the other. Do not put your finger in the hole, line it up with an old screwdriver (an engineer once told me, "Never put your finge rsomewhere you wouldn't put your dick.")
____________________
“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.”
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.

[69chris]

as above, watch out for piss poor metal around the rear shock mounts that'l crack when hardtail struts have been fitted.......i tried that

in the end it was easier, if not quicker,to make a whole new bolt on hardtail section.....

https://www.bikechatforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=293832

if it was only a little bit more speedy it'd be great