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Carb balancing and meddling help

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andym
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PostPosted: 15:39 - 20 Feb 2015    Post subject: Carb balancing and meddling help Reply with quote

Yet again I took my bike in to college to balance the carbs and quickly learned that was a big mistake Sad

Since it's awkward to get a manometer fitted on the cbr (why they put the holes on the engine under the carbs I'll never know), I decided to try doing it with an IR thermometer to try balancing the header pipe temperatures (didn't know if it would work, but worth a try).

After much mucking about I finally set about balancing them and had something along the lines of: 1 235°c, 2 260°c, 3 280°c, 4 240°c, but one of the lecturers came over with a length of hose and said that only carbs 1 and 3 were drawing air in. After explaining that there wasn't anything to adjust inside them, then pointing out where the balance screws were he set about balancing them by listening down this length of pipe.

At points the idle ended up around 4k and screwed the idle adjuster out of the carbs trying to bring them down. After around half an hour of this it was getting too close to lunch time so I said that would have to do them Evil or Very Mad

I had about 10 minutes left to put everything back together by this point, after getting it all together I ran it and checked the temperatures and they were around: 245°c, 2 200°c, 3 265°c, 4 290°c and still 1 & 3 were the only ones that sounded like they were pulling air through the carb.

After college I decided to come home the long way and found when I came up to traffic lights the idle would bounce around between 1 & 2k rpm, the power felt about the same as it always has, but it was slow to respond when releasing the throttle.

So now I'm going to have to try making adapters and a manometer.... anyone know how to go about making adapters (and maybe something that can be taken to a more suitable location)
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eddypeck
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PostPosted: 16:18 - 20 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Do you not just need one of these?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Motorcycle-Carburettor-Carb-Vacuum-Gauge-Balancer-2-4-Cylinder-Set-Guage-/141403210395?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item20ec49c29b

It should come with a selection of adapters and lengths of pipe. Personally I've never owned a CBR, but had a few Kawasaki inline 4's can't imagine they're that different.
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mentalboy
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PostPosted: 16:26 - 20 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

eddypeck wrote:
Do you not just need one of these?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Motorcycle-Carburettor-Carb-Vacuum-Gauge-Balancer-2-4-Cylinder-Set-Guage-/141403210395?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item20ec49c29b

It should come with a selection of adapters and lengths of pipe. Personally I've never owned a CBR, but had a few Kawasaki inline 4's can't imagine they're that different.


The balancing bit is easy, getting the thing hooked up a Honda is a complete bitch (assuming the 600 is anything like the 900).
I seem to recall that I connected some rubber piping to mine and capped the ends so that I just had to fish the pipe up and hook it onto the control taps - but I'm blowed if I can remember what I used to cap each pipe and as I'm at least a fortnight away from the machine I can't even check how I did it.
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andym
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PostPosted: 17:25 - 20 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

eddypeck wrote:
Do you not just need one of these?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Motorcycle-Carburettor-Carb-Vacuum-Gauge-Balancer-2-4-Cylinder-Set-Guage-/141403210395?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item20ec49c29b

It should come with a selection of adapters and lengths of pipe. Personally I've never owned a CBR, but had a few Kawasaki inline 4's can't imagine they're that different.


It's a poor photo but if it was a clock face then this would be at 7 o'clock, which is easy enough for the first carb (if it does go from left to right, but add the carbs and it would be a lot of guessing to find the right place:

https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v320/andy36586/DSC_0386_zpsbb4fphip.jpg

Both my GPz and ZXR were very easy to balance (with my homemade manometer too), and only took a few minutes.

mentalboy, I was thinking of doing something along them lines, there is currently screws covering the holes in the engine (apart from 1 (or is it 4), obviously). If I could borrow the fittings then I would get it done and leave it at that as I've never had a bike long enough to need to balance them again..... and I begrudge paying for something that I can make for a fraction of the cost because Honda were being a bunch of c**ts when they designed this part
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Iain.
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Joined: 04 Dec 2014
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PostPosted: 17:33 - 20 Feb 2015    Post subject: Re: Carb balancing and meddling help Reply with quote

andym wrote:
one of the lecturers came over with a length of hose


Never ever let a college lecturer fuck with your vehicle.

EVER.

The head of motor vehicle technology at Canterbury College was that incompetent he found faults that diddn't exist with my H100 and tried to run an eBay claim against me.

The tutors at Mid Kent College tried to tell me that a car that locked up the wheels on the brake rollers had 0% braking efficiency because the gauges on the machine said so. 0% efficiency = no brakes, he got the arse with me when I questioned why the car wasn't rolling out of the workshop and why it'd been parked on a slope all day with no issues.

Another motor vehicle tutor diganosed a cracked crossmember as worn out brake pads on my Nova.

99% of motor vehicle tutors seem to be failed/incompetent mechanics, hence I dropped out of college. Rolling Eyes
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mentalboy
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PostPosted: 17:54 - 20 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

I seem to recall that when I set up the permanent extension pieces the only way I could do it and retain most of the skin on my knuckles/sanity was to remove the carbs. Ballache the first time but so easy every time thereafter.
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Copycat73
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PostPosted: 18:01 - 20 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

oh !! happy memories of carb balance on a Honda cbr motor..

on the cylinder head...

iirc.. the vacume pipe to the fuel cock is the first connection to the gauges... yes ?????

the other three are a simple blankin screw ... yes ???
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mentalboy
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PostPosted: 18:21 - 20 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Copycat73 wrote:
oh !! happy memories of carb balance on a Honda cbr motor..

on the cylinder head...

iirc.. the vacume pipe to the fuel cock is the first connection to the gauges... yes ?????

the other three are a simple blankin screw ... yes ???


Sounds familiar - simplicity isn't the problem though, it's finding a small child with ten inch long multi/double-jointed fingers!
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Copycat73
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PostPosted: 18:30 - 20 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

mentalboy wrote:


Sounds familiar - simplicity isn't the problem though, it's finding a small child with ten inch long multi/double-jointed fingers!


I ordered three of the adapter screws & rubber covers one already fitted for the fuel cock ..
removed the carbs fitted them after that balancing was not a problem.
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andym
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PostPosted: 19:25 - 20 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Copycat73 wrote:
I ordered three of the adapter screws & rubber covers one already fitted for the fuel cock ..
removed the carbs fitted them after that balancing was not a problem.


Have you got a link for the adapters?
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Copycat73
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PostPosted: 19:42 - 20 Feb 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

andym wrote:
Copycat73 wrote:
I ordered three of the adapter screws & rubber covers one already fitted for the fuel cock ..
removed the carbs fitted them after that balancing was not a problem.


Have you got a link for the adapters?


it was some time ago ... in the days when peeps went to their local dealer for parts ... but here is a parts diagram online

https://www.motogrid.com/pages/OemParts?aribrand=HOM#/Honda/CBR600F2_A_(92)_MOTORCYCLE%2c_JPN%2c_VIN%23_JH2PC250-NM100001_TO_JH2PC250-NM107517/CYLINDER_HEAD/CBR600F2-92-JPN-A/2Y14MV9MMV94E0200BB

items 16, 6 (5mm screw), 23, 7.

but you need to cross check wit your bikes equivalent part numbers
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