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CBR400 engine into CB-1

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Iain.
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PostPosted: 11:55 - 23 Sep 2015    Post subject: CBR400 engine into CB-1 Reply with quote
Don't suppose anyones got any details on the swap? The CB-1 motor was often upgraded using CBR400 cams so the engines ought to be simmilar.

As for why;

https://i.imgur.com/3O9QK1P.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/k9n3WYc.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/W9R7xLK.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/FKGvjMJ.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/tL0v0mf.jpg
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nowhere.elysium
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PostPosted: 13:25 - 23 Sep 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
How the hell did you manage that? Laughing
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RhynoCZ
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PostPosted: 14:44 - 23 Sep 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Check with lads here: https://www.hondacb1.org/forum/index.php

But I'd say it must fit, the clutch covers and cam-shafts from a 400RR and CB-1 are interchangeable. Thumbs Up
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'87 Honda XBR 500, '96 Kawasaki ZX7R P1, '90 Honda CB-1, '88 Kawasaki GPz550, MZ 150 ETZ
'95 Mercedes-Benz w202 C200 CGI, '98 Mercedes-Benz w210 E200 Kompressor

Last edited by RhynoCZ on 15:00 - 23 Sep 2015; edited 1 time in total
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wr6133
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Joined: 31 Dec 2013
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PostPosted: 14:48 - 23 Sep 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Vincent wrote:
The first CBR600 engines fit without too much trouble Wink


Define "trouble"

Random internet guy wrote:
Rear long bolts inserts as the original. Front and upper holes need to be modified. And exhaust, radiator, airbox and fuel tank have to be modified also.


https://www.400greybike.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=32&t=11154

I've seen CB-1's advertised for sale claiming to have NC23 lumps in them so that would suggest possible (or advertiser potato).

You could probably get a definitive answer on the grey bike link above.
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Iain.
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PostPosted: 15:02 - 23 Sep 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
nowhere.elysium wrote:
How the hell did you manage that? Laughing


I needed to get somewhere in a hurry and diddn't make it Laughing

Rod let go, piston jammed at near enough TDC and it bounced an exhaust valve off it till it bent. Poorly adjusted clearances don't really break rods. If anything they smash holes in pistons, but the valvetrain seems to die before that happens on the most of the chinese engines I've seen it happen on. Piston took many, many hits with a hammer to make it come back out of the barrel & had rotated 45 degrees judging by the alignment of the valve pockets.

CBR600 engine isn't at all an easy swap. First off, front and top engine mounts on the CB1.5 pictured are one off items & the rear upper isn't connected to anything. Forgetting that for a second, I'd need a loom, ignition module and such off the donor bike to make it run. Then it wouldn't fuel propperly due to the ram-air setup, and the airbox wouldnt fit under the tank assuming the carbs fit between the frame rails. The headers on that were also one off custom items.

The forum posts that say you can "Just bolt one in" also claim theres three engine mounts, not four & they all use the CB-1.5 as an example - and that ran an F3 600 engine anyway....so I'm a little suspicious. As a budget fix, it's just not worth doing.
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RhynoCZ
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PostPosted: 15:04 - 23 Sep 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
I was pushing my CB-1 to the limit all the time. I'd say neglecting oil changes could cause what happened to yours or it was fecked before and poorly fixed. With the gear driven cams, it can't really skip a tooth and mess up the timing. Which can happen with chain/belt driven heads. Thumbs Up
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'95 Mercedes-Benz w202 C200 CGI, '98 Mercedes-Benz w210 E200 Kompressor
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kramdra
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PostPosted: 19:25 - 23 Sep 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
How many have you killed now?
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Iain.
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PostPosted: 23:11 - 23 Sep 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
NKVD fan wrote:
How the hell do you blow one of these up unless you've stamped it down 4 gears in temper?

Really?


If you did that it'd spit you off and over-rev badly. Nope, just let go after a hard ride Laughing

In answer to does it fit?

Sort of.

Needs the CBR manifold, also needs the CBR loom as the CDI and ignition pickup setup is very different. Im currently hashing two looms into one. The engine is in on the back two mounts, the front needs a few alterations. Top mounts need re-making entirely.

I think the forks and twin disc setup may also fit. Swingarms pretty cool on the donor bike too, so I may try and fit those if I can make it run.
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sickpup
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PostPosted: 06:33 - 24 Sep 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Off the top of my head and keep in mind its been a long time since I played with these it is a straight forward swop except you have to use the CBR oil cooler. Although the CB engine has the same NC23 number it doesn't have the oil ways drilled for the cooler but the CBR does.
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Iain.
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PostPosted: 18:43 - 24 Sep 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
Far from a straight swap as I'm finding out.

So far the only bit that is straight is the two rear engine mounts, clutch cable and the gear selector.

So far from the CBR;

Engine, loom, electrical boxes, rev counter, ignition barrel,killswitch, water inlets/outlets, fuel pump, downpipes, various bolts, speedo drive.

Modified from CB1;

Front cradle, loom, mounts, hoses, coolant bottle

Lots of work. Lots. I wouldn't attempt it if you don't have both bikes that are fairly fucked to start with. CB1 loom is doing starting, and lights....cbr loom is doing charging, sparking and rev counter.

Will post some pictures if I can make it work.
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cb1rocket
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PostPosted: 14:28 - 27 Sep 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote
its a royal pain the arse!

The worse bit is the frame mount in the middle, there is no where to attach them and omitting that particular mount can stress the frame! Lots of frame cracking mind you. Shocked
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