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| JackDanger |
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JackDanger
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ScaredyCat
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 Posted: 19:03 - 02 Nov 2015  Post subject: |
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DA as you call it, commonly known as DAS is "Direct Access". Basically as you're of an age where the state deems you to be responsible enough you get to go straight onto a big bike , if you want, to do your tests.
You do exactly the same tests and anyone else, mod 1 and mod 2 - just on a bigger bike.
btw, bigger bikes are easier to ride.
Mod 1 is the bit with the cones round an oversized purpose built tennis court. Hazard avoidance, emergency stop, figure 8, slalom etc.. This is what the mod 1 layout looks like, although note it might be mirrored on your test. So in reality you can't practice on the big bike.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/188253/general/mod1.jpg
Mod 2 is out on the road in traffic and is just to prove you're capable or riding without killing yourself or someone else. I found this the least stressful of the two.
My DAS course was 5 days - 2 for mod 1 training 1/2 for testing and getting to the centre, then 2 for mod 2 practice (just riding about really) 1/2 for test and wild sex party after passing...
DAS itself isn't a course but it can be done as part of one. Remember you can't just get on a big bike with L's on it and ride about, you have to have an approved instructor with you and he/she must be in radio contact with you.
Don't try and get round that by borrowing someone's bike and riding around in an empty Tesco car park either. People can and have been done for it as it is deemed to be part of the public highway (because the public have access to it).
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| Teflon-Mike |
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Teflon-Mike
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| Posted: 19:20 - 02 Nov 2015 Post subject: |
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DAS, the Direct-Access-Scheme, was by 'legacy', the laws that said you could go directly to a full unrestricted ;licence, if you were over 21, and took the bike tests on a 'big-bike' instead of a 125, and the 'provision' that let you ride such a big-bike under supervision of a qualified instructor, on a lesson, on L-Plates.
By default, DAS has become synonymous with 'intensive DAS courses' offered by schools, made possible by the scheme, rather than the scheme itself.
Since Jan 2013, the 'new' test laws mean you have to test on the class of bike you want a licence for; so strictly all 'testing' is 'Direct Access', whether you test on a 125 for an A1 licence on a 500 for an A2 or a bigger bike for an unrestricted 'A', when eligible to do so by age, with the 'Accelerated Access Scheme' introduced to allow A2 licence holders, who have held thier A2 two years to take full A-Tests 'early' f they haven't reached the age of 24 to be eligible via DAS.
Clear as mud? Good, that's the way they wanted it!
Answer to your question is basically that you don't have to do a course to get a licence, and never have done.... and schools offer training as they see fit; And a DAS course is just the training that a school might offer under the provisions of the DAS scheme, that let you ride something bigger than a 125 on L-Plates; there is no fixed syllabus, its not like O-Level History or something!
What training you might want, what training you might need, and how much, is for you to work out with your school IF you use one... BUT, if you think you know better than the teacher how much you 'need' before you begin... chances are you'll be wrong, because you wont be responsive to what they try teaching you, and impatient to get where you think you should be, ignore stuff you don't think is 'important'...
However... like I said, you dont need to take a course, you dont need to do an intensive course; to get a licence all you have t do is book the and pass the three tests; Theory/Hazard, Mod 1 practical and mod 2 practical.
You can do all that on your own 125, BUT you will only get an A1 '125 only' licence for the effort.
To get an A2 or unrestricted A, you have to test on an A2 or A 'standard' bike, as laid down in the DSA guidelines for what you can test on.... and find some means of getting your hands on such a bike, getting it legally to the test centre and legally riding it, ie having insurance on bike you have no licence for.. and passing the tests on it... presumeably having never ridden the thing before, 'cos no licence to have done so.. UNLESS you have done a 'course'.. which would make getting a test standard, test legal bike to a test an AWFUL lot easier.. of course you could try renting a bike ff a school just for tests, but unless you have done any training with them... chances it'll work out any cheaper, 'all in' given chances of not passing, might not make it any easier, qicker or cheaper in the long run.
But, bottom line is, you need to talk to a school; and you need to discus with THEM how much training you think you should need, and then let them tell you if they agree...
BUT, one day to go over CBT 'stuff' and get familiar with a bigger bike; half a day to practice the Mod 1 Maouvers, and half a day to go do the test; half a day of Mod 2 road training, and another half day to go do the test.... It would be a VERY able or Lucky student who COULD get a full licence, in three days, and five days of training is probably about 'average' for the more 'average' student, and then ONLY to get them a licence, and not go very far actually teaching them anything ore useful about how to ride and survive!
Your call, but start talking to a school...
____________________
My Webby'Tef's-tQ, loads of stuff about my bikes, my Land-Rovers, and the stuff I do with them!
Current Bikes:'Honda VF1000F' ;'CB750F2N' ;'CB125TD ( 6 3 of em!)'; 'Montesa Cota 248'. Learner FAQ's:= 'U want to Ride a Motorbike! Where Do U start?' |
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| ScaredyCat |
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ScaredyCat
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Posted: 19:52 - 02 Nov 2015  Post subject: |
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| Teflon-Mike wrote: | DAS, the Direct-Access-Scheme, was by 'legacy', the laws that said you could go directly to a full unrestricted ;licence, if you were over 21, and took the bike tests on a 'big-bike' instead of a 125, and the 'provision' that let you ride such a big-bike under supervision of a qualified instructor, on a lesson, on L-Plates.
By default, DAS has become synonymous with 'intensive DAS courses' offered by schools, made possible by the scheme, rather than the scheme itself.
Since Jan 2013, the 'new' test laws mean you have to test on the class of bike you want a licence for; so strictly all 'testing' is 'Direct Access', whether you test on a 125 for an A1 licence on a 500 for an A2 or a bigger bike for an unrestricted 'A', when eligible to do so by age, with the 'Accelerated Access Scheme' introduced to allow A2 licence holders, who have held thier A2 two years to take full A-Tests 'early' f they haven't reached the age of 24 to be eligible via DAS.
Clear as mud? Good, that's the way they wanted it!
Answer to your question is basically that you don't have to do a course to get a licence, and never have done.... and schools offer training as they see fit; And a DAS course is just the training that a school might offer under the provisions of the DAS scheme, that let you ride something bigger than a 125 on L-Plates; there is no fixed syllabus, its not like O-Level History or something!
What training you might want, what training you might need, and how much, is for you to work out with your school IF you use one... BUT, if you think you know better than the teacher how much you 'need' before you begin... chances are you'll be wrong, because you wont be responsive to what they try teaching you, and impatient to get where you think you should be, ignore stuff you don't think is 'important'...
However... like I said, you dont need to take a course, you dont need to do an intensive course; to get a licence all you have t do is book the and pass the three tests; Theory/Hazard, Mod 1 practical and mod 2 practical.
You can do all that on your own 125, BUT you will only get an A1 '125 only' licence for the effort.
To get an A2 or unrestricted A, you have to test on an A2 or A 'standard' bike, as laid down in the DSA guidelines for what you can test on.... and find some means of getting your hands on such a bike, getting it legally to the test centre and legally riding it, ie having insurance on bike you have no licence for.. and passing the tests on it... presumeably having never ridden the thing before, 'cos no licence to have done so.. UNLESS you have done a 'course'.. which would make getting a test standard, test legal bike to a test an AWFUL lot easier.. of course you could try renting a bike ff a school just for tests, but unless you have done any training with them... chances it'll work out any cheaper, 'all in' given chances of not passing, might not make it any easier, qicker or cheaper in the long run.
But, bottom line is, you need to talk to a school; and you need to discus with THEM how much training you think you should need, and then let them tell you if they agree...
BUT, one day to go over CBT 'stuff' and get familiar with a bigger bike; half a day to practice the Mod 1 Maouvers, and half a day to go do the test; half a day of Mod 2 road training, and another half day to go do the test.... It would be a VERY able or Lucky student who COULD get a full licence, in three days, and five days of training is probably about 'average' for the more 'average' student, and then ONLY to get them a licence, and not go very far actually teaching them anything ore useful about how to ride and survive!
Your call, but start talking to a school... |
Congratulations, only 6 spelling mistakes. You've been practicing haven't you?
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Honda CBF125 ↳ Speed Triple |
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JackDanger
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Rogerborg
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| Posted: 19:58 - 02 Nov 2015 Post subject: |
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DAS only refers to the tests. You can do weeks, days, hours or no training beforehand.
What Mike said, talk to the local training schools as de facto you need access to their bikes.
Although the best way to practice the tests is to do the tests. You can book them online and do them on your own 125:
https://www.gov.uk/book-driving-test
Sure, it won't get you a useful license, but it will prove that you can do them, and do them the hard way on a 125. Then you can just do them again on a training school bike, badda-boom, badda-bing, bish-bosh, etc.
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike |
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Copycat73
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| Teflon-Mike |
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Teflon-Mike
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| Posted: 02:30 - 03 Nov 2015 Post subject: |
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| Copycat73 wrote: | well he hasn`t been ridin bikes so what else has he to do ? |
Eh-hum!
ACTUALLY!
No, I did get out on the bike yesterday; dang daughter demanded a lift, so I went and scared the natives... venturing into cul-de-sac culture, on a Sunday, to pick her up from her B/F's.. net curtains twitching, I could hear the tut's of disapproval through the double glazing! Scared? Like fuck I was! An OVLOV ready to SMIDSY me every thirty fucking feet! One on every drive!
Still, it was a break from trying to get the central heating to work...
After a new mid-position valve, and a new pump, the radio controlled thermostat is stuck on an unfathomable error code.. and I might have to re-plaster the living room ceiling....
Now, where's that Super-Dream saddle I keep meaning to finish re-covering?.. Ah, yes, the sponge I wedged over the wall speaker when the flood happened... I know, I'll just leave it on top of the Radi-a-t-OR alternatively!?!....... I think I have a 'problem' six-seven..... 
JUST out of interest, though, does any-one else get random strangers knock on their door, holding carburettors off Chinese pit-bikes or the chain off a Lexmoto asking questions like, "I don't suppose you have a spare main jet, for this?" or "You don't happen to have a tool to take a link out of this, do you?"
Snowie told me the other day, some random lad had been loitering at the end of my drive with the bottom end of a CG engine in a card-board box!?!?!?!
Like I haven't got enough knackered old scrap really interesting 'project bikes', of my own to keep me occupied till a week-past dooms-day, and if I don't, Snowie will do her damnedest to make sure I do!
And a bit of ceiling, that's sagging slightly, under a boiler making clonking noises.....maybe I should move that wall-speaker..... 
____________________
My Webby'Tef's-tQ, loads of stuff about my bikes, my Land-Rovers, and the stuff I do with them!
Current Bikes:'Honda VF1000F' ;'CB750F2N' ;'CB125TD ( 6 3 of em!)'; 'Montesa Cota 248'. Learner FAQ's:= 'U want to Ride a Motorbike! Where Do U start?' |
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Teflon-Mike
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| Posted: 04:10 - 03 Nov 2015 Post subject: |
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| JackYorkshire wrote: | How long is it expected to take? |
Its expected to take.... as long as it takes! Peace of fucking string question that, innit!?!?!?
| JackYorkshire wrote: | Can it be done in a few days |
The tests, take about 15 minutes for Mod 1, and about 45 minutes for Mod 1. The Theory/Hazard, takes about an hour...
In theory, it's possible to do it all in a day... though you'd have to be a bit cute with the bookings, and getting between sites, as theory is often done at a different location to the Mods, and even they aren't always offered at the same test office.
But start at the beginning.. Have you got your Theory/Haz-pep in the bag yet?
If not, then get a practice DVD and get practising for it; it's probably the biggest hurdle to the whole scheme.
Theory has been expanded umpety times since to was introduced, and where it USED to be basic highway-code knowledge and a bit of common-cocum; there's a shit load of crap in the test now, of Politically-Correct indoctrination, and 'appropriate attitude' as well as a chunk of first aid, worthy of a first year medical student's mid-term! You have either read the book and committed it to memory to give the 'approved' answers, or you fail!
Hazard-Perception, meanwhile is a lottery; any-one who has actually ridden or driven a motor-vehicle on public roads for more than, oooh.. a week... is likely to watch the clips and never spot a 'hazard' in them.... 'cos its what we deal with every day, and have just 'dealt' with, almost by instinct... OR after realising that the DSA idea of a 'hazard' is actually a lot different to what we do... you click the thing s damn early, the system doesn't register... so you click like crazy, and they fail you for 'over clicking'.... it bears very little resemblance to the real world, and is a computer game, only teenagers who know what 'aps' are, and what Flappy-Birds do... I though they were ladies of loose morels in a slightly inebriated state, I have to confess... I could even give you a few names, at a push, but no, apparently its something to do with a smart-phone.. maybe a virtual lady of loose morels in an inebriated state.. possibly Buzby's girlfriend, since he's slipped from stardom.. I STILL don't really know... B-U-T folk who do, seem to be the only ones able to 'ace' these hazard tests....
£31 self booked; DSA offces that do them I think stick closely to regular office hours, so plan time out to get that one n the bag.
Schools wont often do ANYTHING for you until you have the Theory/Haz-Pep in your pocket; 'cos they cant really teach you much for it, other than offer you loan of books/DVD to bone up with, and you cant take the Mods without the pass cert.
Might also give you some more clue as to how close to test standard you really are, cos chances are there's as many holes in your riding as there are in your road-lore.
| JackYorkshire wrote: | I've been riding pretty much every day in all weather since I got my CBT. |
Great, so you are well 'practised'... whether you are well practised in doing what you need to pass tests? Well, that remains to be seen....
I have to confess, every time I ride through or past road-works I DO have the compunction to start doing a slalom and figures of eight around the cones... I mean why ELSE would they ask you to do that on CBT and on Mod 1? B-U-T apparently not, and I'm told that it could be construed as a failure to obey road-markings!?!?
So, Mod 1? Unless you have succumbed to the compunction to slalom through road-works, you wont have practised much if any of the Mod 1 manoeuvres, in 'normal'' every day riding; and what you might have done on CBT was only scratching the surface. Demands of Mod 1 expect a slightly greater 'aplomb', and there IS a right way and a wrong way to wheel a bike in and out of a parking bay....
Of the two tests, Mod 1, is the one that most find 'hard', even with training and plenty of practice on a 'mock' mod-1 course.
The Mod 2, essentially IS a typical daily commute; half an hour, round the houses, out into the city snarl, and a leg up the by-pass, and all you have to do, is avoid breaking any laws, causing 'hazard' (Remembering DSA have very different ideas about that than we usually do!), and not hurting any-one!
It's probably not a lot different to what you are doing every-day... BUT... on test you probably WONT do what you do every day... and your devilled either way... ride it like you probably do 'normally', and there's almost certainly stuff that you do as a matter of routine that would raise eye-brows, and be deemed a 'hazard'; and plenty of points of technique that are probably 'sloppy' or missing entirely, that could start cranking up 'minors' as repetitive faults.. but more likely, you'd turn up and try riding it COMPLETELY different to how you would if you weren't being followed by a chap with a clip-board for a personality, and put on a 'show ride' for him.. and dong what you 'think' he wants to see, rather than what he does.. and something like over-slowing and crossing the white line to give extra space passing a row of parked cars, you'll get a major for causing 'hazard' making oncoming traffic slow or steer for you, or be minored up for repeatedly not 'making progress'...
Its possible to get a an almost utterly incompetent student through tests, almost entirely on such points of 'test technique'.. its almost impossible to get a perfectly competent student through tests without it, JUST because under test, they 'do it different'.
And THAT is where training pays for itself, as far as 'buying a licence'.. but unfortunately that is ALL many want to pay for, and resent even that.
Training is for LIFE not licences......
Want a faster bike? Fit a better rider!
Better rider, gets there 'sooner' without necessarily going any faster. In doing, they use less fuel, they put less wear and tear on the bike, and they GET THERE WITHOUT CRASHING!!!
Go faster, save money, save pain, its ALL win!
Works on any bike you fitted to; doesn't have to be declared to the insurer; doesn't dent the bikes resale value, and it NEVER wears out... In fact, gets better, the more you use it! how much fucking WIN do you want for your money!?
And it starts with training... and the 'trouble' is that we don't count crashes we DON'T have..... very easy to appreciate the value in a £300 crash helmet after its bounced down the road with your bounce in it... "oooh! Worth every penny THAT was!"
Slightly HARDER to appreciate the value in a £150 'lesson' where you learned that ONE thing, that SAVED you bouncing down the road to skuff up a skid-lid..... possibly many many times!
| JackYorkshire wrote: | or should I just stop being cheap and ask for more tuition? |
Do I REALLY need to answer that? - What do you want, life or licence?
If all you want is a licence? Go for it. Try and be as skin-flint as you can; 'cos you WONT get the 'value' from any training you take,if THAT is all you think its about....
Go get the theory/hazard in your pocket then go book your training.. NOT to get a licence, but to become a better rider.... forget the licence... get the value from the training, get the know-how in your head, the stuff that is REALLY worth the money you are paying for it; the stuff that takes you away from 'just getting away with it'... most of the time... so far... and actually helps you AVOID it ever happening....
Do that, get that value, the value in crashed you DON'T have to count, the near misses that become rare occurrences rather than regular frights....
AND.. the licence will come of its own accord as a by-product, NOT the sole product....
Its in your approach, what you THINK training is all about what you THINK test are for.. sod the confidence or whether bigger bikes are easier to ride or more to manage, that's just detail... look at the bigger picture, and try and see what training is REALLY trying to do for you, or could do for you, approach with that open mind, ready to learn, with the object of becoming a better rider... and it will start to fall into place of its own accord.
| JackYorkshire wrote: | Yeah I think I'm trying to rush it a little bit |
DON'T RUSH, rushing is quick way to hurt on two wheels!
It aint how fast you go, its getting there in the end, but more, ENJOYING THE JOURNEY!
Its a metaphor, that translates to so much; not just getting from A to B by bike.
| JackYorkshire wrote: | The problem is I pretty much have to do it in intervals of a day at a time due to my work commitments |
That's not a problem. That's logistics. every one has to fit stuff into time constrains and budget constraints...and end of the day you are paying some-one to train you, if they wont offer their services when its convenient to you... pay some-one else who WILL.
Chap that signs your pay cheque is the boss, and they tell you what to do, so when YOU are the one signing the cheque YOU should be the boss.... you might have to pay a bit more for your convenience, but.. its starting on the right foot, and thats a step in the right direction to get the 'value' you might hope for from your money all told.
| JackYorkshire wrote: | I'll speak to the instructor on Wednesday. |
That's where its got to go.... so get on with it 
____________________
My Webby'Tef's-tQ, loads of stuff about my bikes, my Land-Rovers, and the stuff I do with them!
Current Bikes:'Honda VF1000F' ;'CB750F2N' ;'CB125TD ( 6 3 of em!)'; 'Montesa Cota 248'. Learner FAQ's:= 'U want to Ride a Motorbike! Where Do U start?' |
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Rogerborg
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| Posted: 10:04 - 03 Nov 2015 Post subject: |
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What's a cheque? 
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Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike |
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Doovy
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| Posted: 10:30 - 03 Nov 2015 Post subject: |
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Mike has almost become a parody of himself 
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Copycat73
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| Posted: 11:34 - 03 Nov 2015 Post subject: |
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| Copycat73 wrote: | you need to get out more to improve your view on life..  |
Have you ever ridden through Camp-Hill?
I live in Nuneaton.. a town created round an Abbey founded by Lady Godiva, a days walk away from the debauched Monks in Coventry that letched at her riding naked through the streets.. a 'Hospice' Abbey, granted immediately to ecclesiastic authority, by Billy The Bastard in 1066 in recognitions of his debts to the church, it became a Sanatorium for unwanted Village Idiots the length and breadth of Saxon England, right up till Harry Eight, decided they had too much money, and dissolved them, and sold off the Abbey lands.
New Land-Lord, evicted the 'patients' who moved to the next field, a bit of waste-land the other side of the flooded brook.. the dry bit becoming known as 'Squatters Camp' or 'Camp Hill'.. where unwanted village idiots have been BREEDING for the last half millennium....
NOW.. I am NOT a pessimist..
I get out, FULL of optimism.. my faith in human-kind brimming with good will.. but I rarely return with my out-look 'Improved'
I am a merely a disillusioned optimist.....
What was it Churchill said on the topic?
I face disappointment with almost the same enthusiasm each and every time.. it just helps not to have too much to begin with!!!
____________________
My Webby'Tef's-tQ, loads of stuff about my bikes, my Land-Rovers, and the stuff I do with them!
Current Bikes:'Honda VF1000F' ;'CB750F2N' ;'CB125TD ( 6 3 of em!)'; 'Montesa Cota 248'. Learner FAQ's:= 'U want to Ride a Motorbike! Where Do U start?' |
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Copycat73
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| Posted: 12:29 - 03 Nov 2015 Post subject: |
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winz
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c_dug
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| Posted: 13:50 - 03 Nov 2015 Post subject: |
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So mod 1 is basically MotoGymkhana only if you go too quick you fail too?
The picture above looks a bit bit fun to be honest, I'd like a go on my VFR
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| Rogerborg |
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Rogerborg
nimbA
Joined: 26 Oct 2010
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| Posted: 15:39 - 03 Nov 2015 Post subject: |
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Urgh, don't encourage him.
| JackYorkshire wrote: | I can't really practice everything |
Of course you can.
How do you think I and tens (hundreds?) of thousands of others passed our tests on our own bikes with no training beyond a ropey CBT, if that?
The tests aren't hard. You'll only make them so by turning them into a big deal or believing that you need to pay to have some esoteric knowledge shouted into your brainpan.
I won't say that it can't hurt to get trained because it can. For every decent instructor like pinkfloyd on here, there's a failed-failed-bike copper who just wants to ride his bike while yelling at people. You met them on your CBT.
DVSA want you to pass. There are some helpful videos available, and everything you need to know you can find out or figure out yourself.
https://www.youtube.com/user/dsagov/videos
In particular, mod 1 only costs £15.50 on your own 125; it's a no brainer to have a go to get past any test nerves.
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike |
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| Teflon-Mike |
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Teflon-Mike
tl;dr
Joined: 01 Jun 2010
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| Posted: 16:51 - 03 Nov 2015 Post subject: |
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| Teflon-Mike wrote: | Have you ever ridden through Camp-Hill? |
| Copycat73 wrote: | if it can be seen from the M1 then yes .. |
Only if they have knocked enough rocks out of Judkins together to set fire to some of the the nicked cars...... Its the length of the M69 from the M1...
| Copycat73 wrote: | you could always move to sunderland .. by the sounds of it you`ll be at home.. |
Err... I think I'll pass on that suggestion... I DID live in Doncaster for a year... that was bad enough... though I think the Geordie accent may be less abrasive than the South-Yorkshire.. or Sheldon.. especially from a girl...
I'm actually a refugee from Shakespeare-Land PLC otherwise known as Stratford-Upon-Avon & District Council.. us yokals were only welcome there if we wore linen smocks, chewed straw and went "oooh! Ahr!" over five bar gates at appropriate moments to the tourists.....
Nuneaton didn't look too-oo-oo bad in the estate-agents blurb.....
Five miles from the very middle of the country, 90 miles from three coasts; two minutes off the M6, the M42 & the M69, main-line railway Station, with a forty minute service to central London; excellent 'communications' they said (I call them 'escape routes'!); good local amenities.. they hadn't burned down the church hall, when I moved here! Two schools, one at either end of the street, and a 'traditional village feel'... yeah... CHRIST I was naive! Fact I could buy a three bedroom semi, with enough drive space to park three LWB Land-Rovers, for half the cost of a one bed 'starter hutch' in Stratford, or a two-bed back-to back in Brum.. OUGHT to have rang alarm-bells, really..
Some-one did warn me that the 'Mort' bit in Mortgage comes from the Latin for 'Bleed you till you die!' But I remained optimistic even to that suggestion!
| Copycat73 wrote: | but i`ll be off to the lakes on me bike so won`t see or care . |
Yeah, rain has that effect on me, too....
I can and do, use them 'communications' from here to get out and about and find my rain in Matlock, Bala, Malvern or even risk the mud in Weston... the natives swear by Skeggy, though.. so I tend to avoid that one!
I DID have a rather nice jaunt over to Red-Marley Hill-Climb back in the spring.. EVEN got sun-burned! Which managed to convince Snowie to try tagging along on the Bank-Holiday to Matlock on the Guzzi.. camping....
Bank-Holiday.. Camping.... GUZZI!
Now if THAT doesn't give you a clue to my innate stupidity 'optimism' nothing will!
Y-e-a-h.. I should have known better.. I REALLY should have known better.. Bank-Holiday, Camping, GUZZI! A-N-D 'Snowie'!
I STILL haven't heard the end of her grievances against the AA-Man's failure to diagnose a blown head-gasket, and attempts to fix it with gum-gum round the exhaust header, and not taking any notice of her 'cos 'woman'! (And me for buggering off to find bacon butties!)
Oh... And rolling up wet-tents! UN- rolling wet tents, and RE_ROLLING wet tents.. to find Bludi-Guzzi keys! And stupid twin tap petrol tanks that hold about three pints worth and don't have a functioning 'reserve'.. other than the plastic jerry can I acquired as a souvenir of the trip! Oh! and lack of smart-phone 'signal' from daughter unable to txt her B/F good-night, and a Pub-Food sign, outside the closest pub to the camp-site, where when we decided the open fire and a hot meal sounded appealing, announced that they really should take the sign down... 'cos the chef left with the previous Land-Lord eight years ago! Sending us on a wild Goose chase round the Peaks, to find the 'Pub-oop'rood tha'duz fud... onleee half'mile!" That was 'closed' as in derelict! And had been a very long time by the looks of it!Then MORE grumbling about 'phone signal' as daughter tried to direct us to a chippy she had found on google.....
So you see I do get out and about, and I do try and approach each potential disappointment with equal enthusiasm... why else would I try restoring 125 Super-Dreams FFS! But BOY does that Murphy chap's law of Sod make it hard at times!
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My Webby'Tef's-tQ, loads of stuff about my bikes, my Land-Rovers, and the stuff I do with them!
Current Bikes:'Honda VF1000F' ;'CB750F2N' ;'CB125TD ( 6 3 of em!)'; 'Montesa Cota 248'. Learner FAQ's:= 'U want to Ride a Motorbike! Where Do U start?' |
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| Val |
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Val
World Chat Champion
Joined: 03 Nov 2012
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| Posted: 00:50 - 05 Nov 2015 Post subject: |
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| Teflon-Mike wrote: | | JackYorkshire wrote: | How long is it expected to take? |
Its expected to take.... as long as it takes! Peace of fucking string question that, innit!?!?!?
| JackYorkshire wrote: | Can it be done in a few days |
The tests, take about 15 minutes for Mod 1, and about 45 minutes for Mod 1. The Theory/Hazard, takes about an hour...
In theory, it's possible to do it all in a day... though you'd have to be a bit cute with the bookings, and getting between sites, as theory is often done at a different location to the Mods, and even they aren't always offered at the same test office.
But start at the beginning.. Have you got your Theory/Haz-pep in the bag yet?
If not, then get a practice DVD and get practising for it; it's probably the biggest hurdle to the whole scheme.
Theory has been expanded umpety times since to was introduced, and where it USED to be basic highway-code knowledge and a bit of common-cocum; there's a shit load of crap in the test now, of Politically-Correct indoctrination, and 'appropriate attitude' as well as a chunk of first aid, worthy of a first year medical student's mid-term! You have either read the book and committed it to memory to give the 'approved' answers, or you fail!
Hazard-Perception, meanwhile is a lottery; any-one who has actually ridden or driven a motor-vehicle on public roads for more than, oooh.. a week... is likely to watch the clips and never spot a 'hazard' in them.... 'cos its what we deal with every day, and have just 'dealt' with, almost by instinct... OR after realising that the DSA idea of a 'hazard' is actually a lot different to what we do... you click the thing s damn early, the system doesn't register... so you click like crazy, and they fail you for 'over clicking'.... it bears very little resemblance to the real world, and is a computer game, only teenagers who know what 'aps' are, and what Flappy-Birds do... I though they were ladies of loose morels in a slightly inebriated state, I have to confess... I could even give you a few names, at a push, but no, apparently its something to do with a smart-phone.. maybe a virtual lady of loose morels in an inebriated state.. possibly Buzby's girlfriend, since he's slipped from stardom.. I STILL don't really know... B-U-T folk who do, seem to be the only ones able to 'ace' these hazard tests....
£31 self booked; DSA offces that do them I think stick closely to regular office hours, so plan time out to get that one n the bag.
Schools wont often do ANYTHING for you until you have the Theory/Haz-Pep in your pocket; 'cos they cant really teach you much for it, other than offer you loan of books/DVD to bone up with, and you cant take the Mods without the pass cert.
Might also give you some more clue as to how close to test standard you really are, cos chances are there's as many holes in your riding as there are in your road-lore.
| JackYorkshire wrote: | I've been riding pretty much every day in all weather since I got my CBT. |
Great, so you are well 'practised'... whether you are well practised in doing what you need to pass tests? Well, that remains to be seen....
I have to confess, every time I ride through or past road-works I DO have the compunction to start doing a slalom and figures of eight around the cones... I mean why ELSE would they ask you to do that on CBT and on Mod 1? B-U-T apparently not, and I'm told that it could be construed as a failure to obey road-markings!?!?
So, Mod 1? Unless you have succumbed to the compunction to slalom through road-works, you wont have practised much if any of the Mod 1 manoeuvres, in 'normal'' every day riding; and what you might have done on CBT was only scratching the surface. Demands of Mod 1 expect a slightly greater 'aplomb', and there IS a right way and a wrong way to wheel a bike in and out of a parking bay....
Of the two tests, Mod 1, is the one that most find 'hard', even with training and plenty of practice on a 'mock' mod-1 course.
The Mod 2, essentially IS a typical daily commute; half an hour, round the houses, out into the city snarl, and a leg up the by-pass, and all you have to do, is avoid breaking any laws, causing 'hazard' (Remembering DSA have very different ideas about that than we usually do!), and not hurting any-one!
It's probably not a lot different to what you are doing every-day... BUT... on test you probably WONT do what you do every day... and your devilled either way... ride it like you probably do 'normally', and there's almost certainly stuff that you do as a matter of routine that would raise eye-brows, and be deemed a 'hazard'; and plenty of points of technique that are probably 'sloppy' or missing entirely, that could start cranking up 'minors' as repetitive faults.. but more likely, you'd turn up and try riding it COMPLETELY different to how you would if you weren't being followed by a chap with a clip-board for a personality, and put on a 'show ride' for him.. and dong what you 'think' he wants to see, rather than what he does.. and something like over-slowing and crossing the white line to give extra space passing a row of parked cars, you'll get a major for causing 'hazard' making oncoming traffic slow or steer for you, or be minored up for repeatedly not 'making progress'...
Its possible to get a an almost utterly incompetent student through tests, almost entirely on such points of 'test technique'.. its almost impossible to get a perfectly competent student through tests without it, JUST because under test, they 'do it different'.
And THAT is where training pays for itself, as far as 'buying a licence'.. but unfortunately that is ALL many want to pay for, and resent even that.
Training is for LIFE not licences......
Want a faster bike? Fit a better rider!
Better rider, gets there 'sooner' without necessarily going any faster. In doing, they use less fuel, they put less wear and tear on the bike, and they GET THERE WITHOUT CRASHING!!!
Go faster, save money, save pain, its ALL win!
Works on any bike you fitted to; doesn't have to be declared to the insurer; doesn't dent the bikes resale value, and it NEVER wears out... In fact, gets better, the more you use it! how much fucking WIN do you want for your money!?
And it starts with training... and the 'trouble' is that we don't count crashes we DON'T have..... very easy to appreciate the value in a £300 crash helmet after its bounced down the road with your bounce in it... "oooh! Worth every penny THAT was!"
Slightly HARDER to appreciate the value in a £150 'lesson' where you learned that ONE thing, that SAVED you bouncing down the road to skuff up a skid-lid..... possibly many many times!
| JackYorkshire wrote: | or should I just stop being cheap and ask for more tuition? |
Do I REALLY need to answer that? - What do you want, life or licence?
If all you want is a licence? Go for it. Try and be as skin-flint as you can; 'cos you WONT get the 'value' from any training you take,if THAT is all you think its about....
Go get the theory/hazard in your pocket then go book your training.. NOT to get a licence, but to become a better rider.... forget the licence... get the value from the training, get the know-how in your head, the stuff that is REALLY worth the money you are paying for it; the stuff that takes you away from 'just getting away with it'... most of the time... so far... and actually helps you AVOID it ever happening....
Do that, get that value, the value in crashed you DON'T have to count, the near misses that become rare occurrences rather than regular frights....
AND.. the licence will come of its own accord as a by-product, NOT the sole product....
Its in your approach, what you THINK training is all about what you THINK test are for.. sod the confidence or whether bigger bikes are easier to ride or more to manage, that's just detail... look at the bigger picture, and try and see what training is REALLY trying to do for you, or could do for you, approach with that open mind, ready to learn, with the object of becoming a better rider... and it will start to fall into place of its own accord.
| JackYorkshire wrote: | Yeah I think I'm trying to rush it a little bit |
DON'T RUSH, rushing is quick way to hurt on two wheels!
It aint how fast you go, its getting there in the end, but more, ENJOYING THE JOURNEY!
Its a metaphor, that translates to so much; not just getting from A to B by bike.
| JackYorkshire wrote: | The problem is I pretty much have to do it in intervals of a day at a time due to my work commitments |
That's not a problem. That's logistics. every one has to fit stuff into time constrains and budget constraints...and end of the day you are paying some-one to train you, if they wont offer their services when its convenient to you... pay some-one else who WILL.
Chap that signs your pay cheque is the boss, and they tell you what to do, so when YOU are the one signing the cheque YOU should be the boss.... you might have to pay a bit more for your convenience, but.. its starting on the right foot, and thats a step in the right direction to get the 'value' you might hope for from your money all told.
| JackYorkshire wrote: | I'll speak to the instructor on Wednesday. |
That's where its got to go.... so get on with it |
^^^ This.
Book the test for gawd sake you can do the DA for less time we have spent here reading all the posts
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Adrian Monk: Unless I'm wrong, which, you know, I'm not...
Yamaha Fazer FZS 600, MT09, XSR 900 |
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