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Is Smoking beneficial to the UK
Yes
50%
 50%  [ 12 ]
No
33%
 33%  [ 8 ]
Don't know
16%
 16%  [ 4 ]
Total Votes : 24

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MCN
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PostPosted: 14:08 - 10 Dec 2015    Post subject: Smokes Reply with quote

Tobacco Giants go to the courts with the UK Gov.Org.

The Beef (fixed link)

Some Statistics

Some History
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Last edited by MCN on 15:12 - 10 Dec 2015; edited 1 time in total
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 14:19 - 10 Dec 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

And revenue from smoking is far in excess of any figure the BMA pluck from thin air. (and no, I don't smoke)

https://www.the-tma.org.uk/tma-publications-research/facts-figures/tax-revenue-from-tobacco/
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Ste
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PostPosted: 14:22 - 10 Dec 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

inb4 self righteous ex-smokers.
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PostPosted: 14:26 - 10 Dec 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ste wrote:
inb4 self righteous ex-smokers.


The very worst kind of ex...

..barring ex-atheists, perhaps.
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MCN
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PostPosted: 14:37 - 10 Dec 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

about 20% of UK population smoke.

Get them back inside the pubs then.

It is a democracy init?

Very Happy
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DrDonnyBrago
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PostPosted: 14:44 - 10 Dec 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Non smoker - yes.

Imagine how many old people we'd have without it, we'd need to introduce a winter fuel tax to keep the numbers down.

30 years of state pension costs a hell of a lot more than the occasional pneumonectomy.
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 14:52 - 10 Dec 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

MCN wrote:
about 20% of UK population smoke.

Get them back inside the pubs then.

It is a democracy init?

Very Happy


I hate that they have to go outside. It should be totally up to the landlord, not some hippy pc twat in government.

And smoking in cars with kids. OK, I wouldn't if I smoked but how do you enforce shit laws like that when you cant enforce a phone usage ban.
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 15:02 - 10 Dec 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Your hyperlinks "The Beef" and "Some History" both link to the same article.

I demand beef. You can't just promise beef then deliver history!
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MCN
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PostPosted: 15:08 - 10 Dec 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

mpd72 wrote:
MCN wrote:
about 20% of UK population smoke.

Get them back inside the pubs then.

It is a democracy init?

Very Happy


The smoking ban had a tiny bit to do with me giving up. It was puncturing my lung and spending a week in intensive care, which finally did it as it was incredibly painful to even try to smoke for weeks after.

I think cheap supermarket booze at around 6 times less cost has nailed a lot of pubs, not the smoking ban.

My local is trying to ban E Cigarettes now. I'm not sure it it's because I'm not used to seeing smoke indoors now, but some of them chuck out more vapour cloud than a coal fired power station.


Evidence suggest the vap system delivers 'the drug' in a less harmful way.

One of the main problems with cigarettes is the effect of more than 200 additives.
All the additives are non-toxic but that is only when tested on their own and not when combined and burned. That is where the harmful stuff is generated.

I don't like smelling other people's habit.
Go into shops today and the air is relatively clean. Walk outside and instantly your 'oldfactories' are then assaulted by tobacco smoke and its additives (mainly burned sugar).
This is objectionable.

Though I do sympathise (a little) with those who smoke.
I know they didn't all choose freely to smoke and many were subjected to tobacco ads. 'Be sexy, successful sophisticated when you use our smokes.'

There is no reasonable argument to promote the use of tobacco in order to fund society.

Although I am sure there are many arguments put up by the many unreasonable.
Very Happy
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MCN
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PostPosted: 15:10 - 10 Dec 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

stinkwheel wrote:
Your hyperlinks "The Beef" and "Some History" both link to the same article.

I demand beef. You can't just promise beef then deliver history!


Fucking internet's broken again.
Embarassed

Sorted.
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 15:36 - 10 Dec 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Beneficial to the people of the Uk or the balance sheet of the uk?
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MCN
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PostPosted: 15:43 - 10 Dec 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

stinkwheel wrote:
Beneficial to the people of the Uk or the balance sheet of the uk?


Both.

I know that the tobacco companies pay tax on the product they sell.

They (the owners) make massive profit for almost nothing.

There's aye a bit of fur rubbed the wrong way when it is seen that someone gets more than their fair share.

Why should they profit so much?


P.S. I hope, for the sake of simplicity of debate, that it's not necessary to list all the other businesses not tobacco related who profit. Very Happy
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 15:50 - 10 Dec 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

MCN wrote:
stinkwheel wrote:
Beneficial to the people of the Uk or the balance sheet of the uk?


Both.

I know that the tobacco companies pay tax on the product they sell.

They (the owners) make massive profit for almost nothing.

There's aye a bit of fur rubbed the wrong way when it is seen that someone gets more than their fair share.

Why should they profit so much?

P.S. I hope, for the sake of simplicity of debate, that it's not necessary to list all the other businesses not tobacco related who profit. Very Happy


Who? the government?


This year the government takes 77.9% of the price of a pack of cigarettes in tax and VAT. On a £5.30 pack of 20, this amounts to £4.13

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MCN
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PostPosted: 16:32 - 10 Dec 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Polarbear wrote:
Who? the government?


This year the government takes 77.9% of the price of a pack of cigarettes in tax and VAT. On a £5.30 pack of 20, this amounts to £4.13


The government tax the bahookie off tobacco primarliy because of it's harmfull effects on 'everyone's' health. 'Sidestream' is a killer too.

As soon as the gov.org. coffers (there's a pun there) run low from smoke tax they will re-aim and take from something else.
It is economics.
Taking tax and profiting from smokers is rank immoral but the only one's allowing that are those who smoke.

Don't smoke and live longer and richer. No brainer.
And we don't really need the anecdotalisations 'Oh my granda smoked 60-a-day rolled them whilst on horseback in between branding cattle'.

They cause sooooo much harm, hurt and sadness to anyone affected by them.
Unless you are a ****wit who doesn't worry about themselves or others.
Which is also a bit anti-social.
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mentalboy
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PostPosted: 17:15 - 10 Dec 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Does uk.gov.coffers take more in tobacco tax than they lose to NHS costs and unproductive workdays?

I don't know about the benefits to the UK as a whole but it's nice not to wake up with a mouth that tastes like an ash tray and the whole coughing up blood every time I got a chest infection was getting to be a tad tiresome.
Whilst I was in the UK, post-quitting I think uk.gov.coffers probably took more from me in tax from chocolate bars than they ever did in rollies. Now I am just a fat bastard ex-smoker Laughing
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skatefreak
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PostPosted: 17:17 - 10 Dec 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

*ding ding ding ding*
Sugar tax!
If that gets through, give it a couple of years an we'll be paying in notes for a cheeky boost bar Sad
Its hard to fathom how much money the government is raking in when they are pledging to give away billions in foreign aid, of which they know a lot is going to be pissed up the wall...

Just bleeding taxing everything. Getting a bit silly really....
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Jmoan
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PostPosted: 17:44 - 10 Dec 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

MCN wrote:

Evidence suggest the vap system delivers 'the drug' in a less harmful way.

One of the main problems with cigarettes is the effect of more than 200 additives.
All the additives are non-toxic but that is only when tested on their own and not when combined and burned. That is where the harmful stuff is generated.

I don't like smelling other people's habit.
Go into shops today and the air is relatively clean. Walk outside and instantly your 'oldfactories' are then assaulted by tobacco smoke and its additives (mainly burned sugar).
This is objectionable.


Only after the stink of diesel and everything else floating around.

It's not only additives that are in tobacco but chemicals created depending on the curing process and radioactive particles according to info like this. https://www3.epa.gov/radtown/tobacco.html

Then there is the way tobacco is used. Shisha pipes looks to be less dangerous than burning smoke when used at the same rate of cigarettes.

Onto vaping, while it may be safer at face value there doesn't appear to be any testing to check if the basic chemicals are pure and uncontaminated before we get to flavours and additives which may be harmful to inhale.
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Wafer_Thin_Ham
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PostPosted: 18:06 - 10 Dec 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

skatefreak wrote:

Its hard to fathom how much money the government is raking in when they are pledging to give away billions in foreign aid, of which they know a lot is going to be pissed up the wall...

Just bleeding taxing everything. Getting a bit silly really....


That that foreign "aid" comes with many strings attached. Afterall the politicians penions/trust funds aren't going to pay for themselves are they. Wink
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smegballs
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PostPosted: 18:11 - 10 Dec 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Regardless of whether smoking is "beneficial" or not, I don't think the govt has the right to say what you can or can't put into your body. Which is usually the next question after "is it beneficial" is asked - should it be allowed/banned....

I actually enjoy smoking the odd fag, as in less than 10 a year, on a night out now and again. At the same time though the thought process of "I fancy a smoke, let's go buy some fags" just isn't in my brain, it would never occur to me as a thing to do.

I like that smoking kills off oldies and lowers the pension bill, that's gotta be a good positive right there.
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PostPosted: 18:15 - 10 Dec 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

Polarbear wrote:


Who? the government?


This year the government takes 77.9% of the price of a pack of cigarettes in tax and VAT. On a £5.30 pack of 20, this amounts to £4.13


Where can you buy cigs for £5.30?
You can add at least £2 per 20 at today's prices.
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MCN
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PostPosted: 20:38 - 10 Dec 2015    Post subject: Reply with quote

smegballs wrote:
Regardless of whether smoking is "beneficial" or not, I don't think the govt has the right to say what you can or can't put into your body. Which is usually the next question after "is it beneficial" is asked - should it be allowed/banned....

I actually enjoy smoking the odd fag, as in less than 10 a year, on a night out now and again. At the same time though the thought process of "I fancy a smoke, let's go buy some fags" just isn't in my brain, it would never occur to me as a thing to do.

I like that smoking kills off oldies and lowers the pension bill, that's gotta be a good positive right there.


I hate your sort.... Never think to buy a packet of fags. Rolling Eyes

Got the smoking habit but hee-haw else that goes with it.

Smile
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