Failed CBT..twice..technically?

[Kafei]

Hi. I don't know if this is in the right section or not, dunno if this is a rant or a depression article, but read on if you want.

Been reading on the forum for a few days now but finally decided to create an account.

I've been interested in getting a motorcycle for a few years now. A few weeks ago I decided to do a CBT test to get my license instead of doing my car lessons. I've got all the gear, gloves, leathers, helmet, boots, etc but just require the bike. Kinda dumb buying all that stuff without the bike, huh?

Any-who, I finally did it. Went to a CBT center, forked out £115 then had the lessons happen. It was the first time I've ever rode anything or drove anything as I usually take the metro/bus. At first I was excited, then when getting on the bike, my happiness just went to oh shit what. At first I was kicked off the geared as I couldn't' get the throttle-off clutch in right, so then I did the CBT learning on an automatic. I did that pretty good, but before the road my nerves hit me as I really didn't feel comfortable going out on the roads, specially how the traffic can build up hugely and grid-lock quite easily so I said to the instructors I'd come back whenever, so me and the instructor parted ways in good terms, he was happy that I decided not to go out as he could tell I was seriously nervous.

I returned a few days later, decided to have another go on the geared. I managed it all perfectly, the figure of eight, clutch control, everything. On the right/left turn I got confused and got the instructor pretty pissed off as instead of going straight up the courtyard and moving to the left, I kept moving right/left at the "junction" how you have it. Let's say after about the 3rd-4th time of being confused he started to get a little annoyed, which I got a little annoyed at myself for getting him annoyed for my own confusion and I didn't want to waste the instructors time, nor the group of 2 other guys taking their cbt.

I was moved onto the final part: the emergency stop. Figured it sounded easy enough. Start moving off towards the instructor, get to second gear and keep riding until he raises his hand. When he raised his hand I took my throttle off, applied front then rear break, clutched in then kicked down to neutral. Or atleast tried to. However, this is where I majorly screwed up, I couldn't do all of that straight away. The first few times, I did it fine however I stopped then kicked down, which the instructor wasn't happy about and after that, it went majorly down hill.

I pretty much failed doing a U turn as well, I kept looking down to the dashboard rather than looking where I was turning, I kept thinking I might lock the bike wheel and drop both the bike and myself and the instructor kept telling me to stop looking down. >.<

Since I was wearing motorcycle boots, I had no idea if the bike was kicking up or down to change gear, as a result, me going about 10 mph, then kicking up twice to 3rd, the engine chugged and kept stalling. I swear I stalled about 2000 times in about 10 minutes. As a result, instructor and the group got pretty annoyed at me and as a result my confidence was going from meh to why am I even doing this anymore, and as a result it kinda really screws your confidence. Specially if the instructors getting really annoyed and 2 other people are with you cause you can't grasp "simple" mechanics.

Anyway, after the instructor getting annoyed and group sitting there for about 15 minutes, I decided it was time to get off, apologized for wasting their time and after about a 10 minute talk to the instructor about nerves and stuff like that, we parted ways.

I've talked to a few friends and family about this, as I'm really interested in getting a motorcycle geared not an automatic, they've recommended me to get a automatic CBT done to get used to the roads, then buy a geared bike then do it that way. I don't want to keep handing out £115 every time I go cause my nerves keep getting the better of me. Just don't want to go out then majorly screw shit up or something.

But if I couldn't get an emergency stop done in a geared, chances are I don't really trust myself to ride it geared. Unless I could learn myself with not pissing people off in the class with learning slow. I don't know anybody with a motorcycle near me just to help me get better and not have a few pissed off people waiting for me to get moving. At my job theres a few motorcyclists that I know, however they all have 800 and 1200s and going from a 125 to a 1200 I'd probably flip the bike, haha.

So there I was, in full motorcycle gear and the typical moped tracksuit bottom kids were doing better than me

Thanks for taking the time to read this guys, I really appreciate it, don't really mean to sound depressive or a moron or anything.

tl;dr: took cbt, failed geared first time, moved onto automatic, didn't go on road, second cbt for free geared fine until emergency stop, too nervous.

[kerr]

If you have no road experience then it would be wise to just stick to an auto for the time being, you can try a geared bike say a year down the road when everything becomes second nature, then you can get used to gears and the clutch without having to think about all the other stuff.
Also go to another school for your next cbt, not saying the previous one did anything wrong, apart from maybe insisting you had to change back down to first on an emergency stop, just so you can at least start afresh.
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aprilia 125 Af1 Futura >> Suzuki gsxr 600 srad >> J1 zx6r >> cbr 600rr >> Speed Triple

[Nomad Z]

It sounds to me like your lack of confidence is coming from lack of familiarity with the machine. If you're not comfortable yet with gears, try and get through CBT on an automatic and either ride one of those for a while, or get a geared bike and practice in your own time (quiet roads and empty car parks, like an industrial estate on a Sunday).

It takes a while to build the muscle memory for the controls, and that can be harder to do if you're thinking about all the road and traffic stuff as well. So, either get a scooter and build some road experience, or a geared bike and hide away in quiet places getting machine practice. Once you've done one of those, either switch to a geared bike or get out on the road.

[Omega]

I should have failed my CBT. I was terrible. The instructor ticked the boxes and gave me my certificate though. 8 weeks later I was in the back of an ambulance after a car pulled out on me. Not my fault but with hindsight should have been easily avoidable.

Try another school and get some lessons straight after passing your CBT. You'll probably find things easier with the right instructor. Mine wasn't sympathetic at all and just wanted to tick boxes. Like yourself I kept feeling like I was holding people up. I changed to a different school and everything was much easier. I still sucked, but I didn't feel like I was getting in the way. After a few lessons everything clicked and I suddenly went from a useless n00b to actually being pretty confident doing all of the manoeuvres and watching the roads instead of focusing entirely on bike control.

TLDR: Change school, it'll suddenly click and you'll have the hang of things. Don't get put off.

[Polarbear]

Agree with all said - Change your school.

It's their job to teach and encourage you, not to make you feel a liability.
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Triumph Trophy Launch Edition

[pdg]

You can't 'fail' or 'pass' a CBT. It's not a test, it's a short training course that you either complete or don't...

If the instructor was getting annoyed then you need a different instructor. You are paying for training and obviously not getting trained - if the instructor is using the other students to justify making you feel like a time waster then he's as crap at the job as I would be.

On the first one, he shouldn't have been happy you decided not to go out on the road - he should have felt a failure himself.

Maybe the rules on the emergency stop have changed, but when I took my CBT and test the only thing that mattered was stopping in a controlled fashion (i.e. not falling off) - it didn't matter if you didn't hit neutral before you stopped, it didn't matter if you stalled the engine - it's called an emergency stop for a reason.
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Any and all advice given should not be followed - if you have to ask it means you don't know so get a man in to do it for you.

[Rogerborg]

Riding a bike is hard. Making it unnecessarily harder by telling you to go into neutral during an emergency stop is sadistic. It's an emergency: what matters is that you stop. You can stall it on the module 1 test and still past.

Have you ridden a pushbike on the roads? If not, I'd try that now. Get used to road positioning, junctions, and to being invisible and the lowest lifeform out there.

Then it's up to you whether to do geared or auto training. It sounds like you might just have performance anxiety - I don't like being observed either. Doing it on an auto then buying a geared bike will be fine - out on your own, you will pick up gears in short order.

And of course you're going to stall, we all did. It's nothing to worry about - it's Basic Training.

Deep breaths. You will figure it out.
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Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[skatefreak]

Agree as above but just want to say it sounds like nerve issues and a less than optimal instructor...
You can ride the darn thing as you said before, you had working the clutch and gears down pretty quickly but after a while, fatigue and nerves kick in and you start to lose it.
On my first CBT this is where the instructor insisted I come off for a ciggie and once I was done, got back on and was back to nailing it!
I was mortified going out onto the roads on a 125 tiddler, having driven a car for a good few years I was more than familiar with how roads worked (although this wasnt local) and almost, somehow flew into a ditch/hedge at a junction...

Instructor said he would fail me based on that however he had a feeling it was just nerves and gave me the cert. I took it really easy on back roads for a few weeks and am yet to have an off in 6 years. Passed full licence first time

I'm surprised your instructor was unhappy about your emergency stop, its hard enough when you start, why confuse such an important manoeuvre by insisting on being prepared to move away?

The auto may be a good idea however but I appreciate it involves the expense of finding/buying a ped that isnt a sh*tter, not destroying it and then trying to sell it and find something else etc etc etc.

Try a different school, I found Cam Rider excellent over here in Cambridge, they sat us down in the morning, walked us through all the road theory (which I hadn't every been through and it was my 3'rd CBT!), took the time to deal with us individually and were very very insightful. Did my full test there after and it was an excellent experience. The school can make all the difference

Best of luck!

-Jvr

[Stalk]

We where all a bit shit when we started, it gets easier. Just a lot to take in in one day. Take it slow and think about what you are doing, maybe even talk yourself through it as you are riding. " Roundabout coming up, turning right, indicator,lifesaver, move over........." sort of thing. The thing with bikes is that they are just too much fun, so keep going. You will get there.
For more inspiration, check some of the pictures in touring and exploration

[bugeye_bob]

as I always seem to suggest, find one of these motocross hire and ride places, work out how to ride a bike before you even get close to a road,
I see they are all blaming the riding school but if you dont know if your own foot is going up or down your on to a looser straight away.

[Rogerborg]

[Copycat73]

which training provider did you use to do the CBT ?
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Whatever I post I have no citation and no intention of providing one..
caveat emptor

[Baffler186]

I'd do one more CBT at a different school, on a twist and go. I'm sure with a good instructor you will be fine. Once you have passed, buy a cheap geared bike and learn the gears etc at your leisure (in a deserted area if you like). You will probably be twice as confident after a couple of hours.

Emergency stop - did they specifically tell you to change down to neutral during the e-stop? All you need to do is stop hard with the brakes and don't skid with either wheel. With a geared bike, as Roger said it's best to pull in the clutch at the end but not mandatory for a pass.
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Current: 2009 SV650 S, 1990 Kawasaki GT550
Previous: 2009 CBF125, 1998 GSF600, 2004 FZ6 Fazer, 1978 CB400a Hondamatic

[Doovy]

As said (and how I was taught for the old-style road test) emergency stop should just be:

- Roll off throttle
- Apply front brake
- Apply rear brake
- Apply more front brake
- At last possible second pull in clutch (not too early or could lock back wheel)
- You well be in Second gear at this point; kick it down to 1st and back up to Neutral
- Do some mirror / shoulder checks (then wheel bike to side of road - N/A now)

With regards to throttle and clutch control, it's just practice.

For the U-turns, look where you want to go, and the bike will follow.
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Yamaha RXS 100 > Honda CD 250 > Honda Hornet 600 > Honda CBR 600RR > Yamaha RXS 100 > Kawasaki ZX6R J2 > Yamaha FZ1

[talkToTheHat]

As stated above, cbt is not pass/fail but keep going until you get it right. I planned to split my training over 2 days (becasue health or lack thereof) and came back for some extra sessions. It gets frustrating when you are nearly there. The instructor needs you to not be a liability when you take to the roads. Are you getting "nope, fail" or "no, keel practcing that until you have it right" from your instructor?

Changing gear should not be clutch in, wave foot at gear lever, clutch out. Try putting your toe under (or over to change down) the lever, touching it with just enough pressure to feel it. Then throttle back, clutch in fast and the gear lever should click into the next gear becasue you were already pressing on it lightly, then clutch out smoothly.

You will need to ride in motorcycle gear, so there is every point in having it. Unless you have wildly inappropriate kit it should not interfere with control.

I wear altberg boots which are on the chunky side, my getting to know a bike ritual before i ride involves finding where i can put my feet so they are out of the way of the foot controls and stands, and leaning to find this place on the pegs by feel, then finding how to get over the brake and over/under the gears by feel. It takes a couple of seconds now, but there is some brain training involved in this ritual. Particularly as I ride everything from cruisers to sportstbikes and tend to have my pedals set differntly to factory spec becasue huge boots.
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Bandit. does. everything.

[pinkyfloyd]

[Doovy]

I learnt how to ride a motorbike with gears by reading up on it, visualizing doing it whilst riding my 50cc Yamaha Jog R, and by the time I got on a geared bike I knew exactly what to do.
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Yamaha RXS 100 > Honda CD 250 > Honda Hornet 600 > Honda CBR 600RR > Yamaha RXS 100 > Kawasaki ZX6R J2 > Yamaha FZ1

[Stalk]

[techathy]

Banging the gears down on an emergency stop? On my CBT I was told to release the throttle, apply the front brake & pull in the clutch at the same time then rest my foot on the rear brake.

[Wonko The Sane]

Where are you based?

You say using the Metro - if you're North Manchester Focus Rider Training in Bury are patient, friendly and helpful.

Might be worth doing CBT on the auto and getting out on the road - get the certificate in your hand and feel good and confident about it.

Then do a half day 'conversion course' to be taught how to ride a geared bike now that you've got the basics sorted.

But a good bike school will assess and advise better than us keyboard monkeys on a forum!
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Looking to pass your CBT / Bike tests in Bury Lancashire? try www.focusridertraining.co.uk Would recommend.
They're also on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/pages/Focus-Rider-Training/196832923734251

[rubyhorse2]

hmmm well i'll say thats some poor training, i know they have to teach others at the same time but its a general rule of thumb to go at the speed of the slowest person. If they were showing annoyance thats just not the right type of person to be teaching if you ask me.

The reason the chavs found it easy is because they've been stealing mopeds for the last few years.

Get to a new school and keep trying. If you have any friends that are riders then maybe ask them to spare a few hours, its amazing how quickly you can pick things up when your not nervous and worrying about other learners and instructors waiting on you.

Anyway, chin up and keep at it, you'll get it eventually and wonder why you found it tricky at all

Got to say i would happily spare an hour or so if you happen to be in manchester, obviously you'd be practicing on a SDR which might not be the best starter bike but its a private road network near me so would be legal.

[Evil Hans]

[M.C]

[Wonko The Sane]

[pdg]

There seems to have been a bit about doing a CBT in an automatic...

Unlike a car driving test, there is no distinction in doing a CBT on a manual or an auto.

Do it on whatever, the certificate doesn't say what you used.
____________________
Any and all advice given should not be followed - if you have to ask it means you don't know so get a man in to do it for you.