Big Euro Trip

[chickenstrip]

Got a few grand to blow and as much time as I want (and stamina permits) to do something in Europe this year. Planning on doing the Ardennes and then maybe B500 down through the Black Forest to the Alps, but then I'm having trouble with planning any further. From what the maps say, the B500 will get me somewhere close to Zurich. Where next?

My main motivations are some great riding (FZS1000 Fazer, so good tarmac, not rough tracks), and to see and photograph spectacular scenery, grand/interesting/historic architecture (castles, cathedrals/churches, monasteries, palaces etc), and I have an interest in military history, so museums and the like.

I have an idea of mixing camping with B&B/cheap hotels, and stopping in particularly nice areas for 2 or more days so I can explore with the bike unloaded.
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Chickenystripgeezer's Biking Life (Latest update 19/10/18) Belgium, France, Italy, Austria tour 2016 Picos de Europa, Pyrenees and French Alps tour 2017 Scotland Trip 1, now with BONUS FEATURE edit, 5/10/19, on page 2 Scotland Trip 2 Luxembourg, Black Forest, Switzerland, Vosges Trip 2017
THERE'S MILLIONS OF CHICKENSTRIPS OUT THERE!

[Enduro Numpty]

A multitude of great roads in Switzerland, Grimsel, Furka and Susten passes are only 3 of many and are all easily covered in a day. Switzerland is expensive so beware! If you want to venture into Italy then there's always the Stelvio (not my favourite but popular with most people). Grossglockner in Austria is great if you're in the area and some of the alpine roads in Slovenia are also superb.

If you've got time I would head for the Pyrenees possibly via Milau and Cevennes. The Cevennes National Park has some stunning scenery and great roads. The Spanish Pyrenees have some of the best roads I've ever ridden on and are not as busy as the Alps. Heading back there this year myself with the wife.

[chickenstrip]

[doggone]

[chickenstrip]

[mjn51]

If you stop near Konstanx on the German Swiss border, you get good roads all around the lake and handy for Switzerland, Austria, Lichtenstein , form there over the Gurkha pass and on to the South.
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[Oldie]

From Bastogne, I'd head into the hills of western Luxembourg. Some of the minor twisties are good, then Lac de LA Haute Sure and over to Vianden. Really nice biking area.

[Dave V4]

pm me an email address and I can send you route that me and a mate done last year, was around 3000miles and took in 7 countries. we rode, mont ventoux, verdon gourges, gorges de cian, col de la bonette, col de telegraph, col de L'seran, petit saint Bernard, stelvio, Grossglockner, col de madeline, nufenen pass, san bernadino pass, tremolo, furka, grimsel, susten pass, klausen pass and then into Germany for the 500 then try to find some nice roads to return to Calais. im sure I missed a few passes lol but its food for thought none the less. we did it the opposite way round to what your planning to get the shite motorway/toll roads out of the way to start with

[Dave V4]

sorry couldln't edit, just thought I would add, we stopped in cheap B&B's the whole time and spent just over a grand total, including fuel food etc. bare in mind we shared a room most nights or mate had free rooms if we managed to find a Best western due to his job. and yes I would agree with one of the previous posters that Switzerland is very expensive, we were paying around 40-50 euros for a room till we got there, then it was 140 euros each lol, fookin rip off imo

[Enduro Numpty]

I've never really used bases for touring, I've generally just travelled to destinations using what I consider to be the best routes so probably not the best person to advise on bases. If you're looking at hotels then most accomodation in the Alps and Switzerland in particular can be expensive.

[A100man]

What about the 'Eagles Nest' - Hitlers lair for a military buff. German/Austrian border. Tripadvisor rates it quite high which probably means it's cr@p however..
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[Matt B]

If you want to stay in Switzerland it's worth looking at hostels, much cheaper than hotels.

Work you way down to Italy and Lake Como. We had a night there on the last Eurojolly in a fantastic hostel called In Riva Al Lago. Air conditioned rooms right on the edge of the town and a secure underground car park for the bikes. All you can eat breakfast in the morning was immense. It's somewhere I could have easily stayed for a few nights just to relax and explore. Short walk into the town in the evening and we found a great little restaurant in the main square for dinner.
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[Enduro Numpty]

Croatia is superb. The dalmatian (spelling? ) coast down to Dubrovnik is superb as is Dubrovnik itself. Some brilliant modern motorways through spectacular landscapes. If in Croatia crossing into Bosnia and Herzegovina is another option. Some spectacular scenery, many modern roads, very friendly people and some very sad recent history. Montenegro has some spectacular mountainous terrain but personally after going there I don't think I'd rush back. Bulgaria also worth visit. Has some beautiful mountains in the south and in 2012 when we were there was very cheap. All depends how much time and money you have. In 2012 we spent 2 months and 8k, stayed in nice hotels, ate and drank well and had a trip we'll never forget. 15 countries, 25 frontiers and it was worth every penny. Hope your trip is as good

[chickenstrip]

Ok, so I've been giving it a lot of thought, searched through numerous old threads here, been doing a bit of online research, much of which has been prompted by suggestions made here, so thanks to everyone who has contributed so far - keep it coming!

I now have a rough route planned that will (sort of) see me through Belgium, Luxembourg, Switzerland, Austria, Slovenia, Croatia, Italy, France and over to the Pyrenees (thus far...).

This is a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity for me, I hope I don't blow it!

@mjn51. Is Konstanz not a little too far from the central Swiss alps to use as a base, considering the type of roads (tiring high passes) that I hope to explore?

@Oldie. You're not the first person to suggest to me that Luxembourg is well worth some exploration time, so it's on the itinerary

@Dave V4. I have managed to find my copy of John Hermann's "Motorcycle Journeys Through the Alps", and together with a couple of places I have in mind for myself, I think I'm ok with the actual Alps exploration bit now, thanks for the route offer

@A100man. The Eagle's Nest would interest me, but I think I wouldn't make any specific detour to visit - just maybe if I happened to find myself near and had a few hours to spare.

@Matt B. Hostels sounds good, know a good site/source or two to research that a bit more? Also I'll consider campsites in Switzerland. I will have the funds to hotel/B&B it for a couple/few nights if I think Switzerland would be worth that expense, but no point blowing cash unnecessarily I suppose.

@Enduro Numpty. That sounds like just the kind of trip I'm looking to do, must have been fantastic! I take it the £8k figure covers two people? I was thinking £5-6k for one person, but could maybe stretch a bit further if it came to it. I have as much time as I care to spend on this One possible plan changer might be what the mate who hopes to start with me for 3-4 weeks might want to do, so although as noted above I have an outline plan, it could be that it will change as we go - he says he'll leave it to me, but only fair if I accept he might decide he wants to head somewhere off my route here and there.

I have in mind (provisionally at the moment) heading off in early June. My mate says August is out for him, and would I be right in thinking that things can get a little inconvenient (Italy, for example) in August due to local European holiday customs anyway?

Thanks again for all input so far
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Chickenystripgeezer's Biking Life (Latest update 19/10/18) Belgium, France, Italy, Austria tour 2016 Picos de Europa, Pyrenees and French Alps tour 2017 Scotland Trip 1, now with BONUS FEATURE edit, 5/10/19, on page 2 Scotland Trip 2 Luxembourg, Black Forest, Switzerland, Vosges Trip 2017
THERE'S MILLIONS OF CHICKENSTRIPS OUT THERE!

[Matt B]

https://www.hostelworld.com is a good place to start looking. They have reviews and pictures and it's where noobrider found the two hostels we used on that trip. one tip - the owner of the hostel in Como told us we would have been better off booking direct with him because it would have saved us the fee that Hostel World charge.

The other hostel we used was Hostel Feldkirch in Austria. Worth a look if you want to stay in that area. Beer vending machine, really nice kebab shop down the road, table tennis, garden, great place to chill out.

Have you read Matt's epic account of the 2015 Eurojolly? All the routes and lots of pictures in there for ideas https://www.bikechatforums.com/viewtopic.php?p=4160429
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[chickenstrip]

Nice one Matt, cheers

Still trawling through various old threads here, having another look at that one now
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Chickenystripgeezer's Biking Life (Latest update 19/10/18) Belgium, France, Italy, Austria tour 2016 Picos de Europa, Pyrenees and French Alps tour 2017 Scotland Trip 1, now with BONUS FEATURE edit, 5/10/19, on page 2 Scotland Trip 2 Luxembourg, Black Forest, Switzerland, Vosges Trip 2017
THERE'S MILLIONS OF CHICKENSTRIPS OUT THERE!

[Enduro Numpty]

The 8K that I mentioned was for both of us and we really didn't go out of our way to do it on the cheap. I'm sure we could have done it far less expensively or went for a lot longer if we had tried. It was also a once in a lifetime thing for us and it took a lot of saving to be able to do it. We spent a fair proportion of our trip in Eastern Europe and the Balkans and it was undoubtedly less expensive there.

One thing to be wary of is tyres! If you need to change them when you're away it can be very expensive. I left UK with new tyres and they were pretty much shot by the time we got to Istanbul. Cost us nearly £500 to get them replaced. Had to replace them again in Austria close to the end of the trip and was nearly 500 euros. All in all to do around 8000 miles cost me close to £1000 in rubber. Scary!! I never get decent mileage from tyres and the bike was carrying 2 non-skinny adults - maybe you'll do much better?

Here's a link to the report on our trip, I would love to do it all again, maybe give you some ideas. In any case enjoy your trip

https://www.bikechatforums.com/viewtopic.php?p=3381827&highlight=#3381827

[chickenstrip]

Let's clear this up once and for all

B500/Black Forest or Route des Cretes/Vosges? (Heading south to Switzerland).

Reasons for your choice?
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Chickenystripgeezer's Biking Life (Latest update 19/10/18) Belgium, France, Italy, Austria tour 2016 Picos de Europa, Pyrenees and French Alps tour 2017 Scotland Trip 1, now with BONUS FEATURE edit, 5/10/19, on page 2 Scotland Trip 2 Luxembourg, Black Forest, Switzerland, Vosges Trip 2017
THERE'S MILLIONS OF CHICKENSTRIPS OUT THERE!

[arthurmo]

You mentioned you were into military history last time I went down to the alps I spent a couple of days in Verdun,the trenches just south of there at St. Mihiel were some of the best I've seen. googlefu trenches of the bavarians. I then headed to down to the Vosges, thoroughly depressed myself at Natzweiler Struthof concentration camp and then headed over to Bodensee and had a go in an air ship before stopping in Landeck at as good bikers hotel.

I did the 500 on the way back and stayed in some weird place with a watermill and got lashed up with a german midget/dwarf/short arse/small person.

Whatever you do good luck
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[Matt B]

The B500 for me. It's a fast, wide, open road with great views and is often quoted as one of the best biking roads in Europe. You can carry on down to Lake Constance which is a nice place to stop and have a rest for a while. It was quiet when we did it, really quiet with hardly any other traffic apart from a few bikes.

We did roads that were a bit more challenging - like the Stelvio Pass that was crowded, hard work and relatively dangerous due to the number of muppets throwing motorhomes round corners on the wrong side of the road, or others where the bends were all blind. In comparison the wide open B500 was a joy.

It's not a fair comparison though because I've only done the Vosges route in the car, never on the bike. Stunning views of the gorges that way though. Why not do them both, one on the way down and the other on the way up?
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stinkwheel: He had an animated .gif of a cat performing fellatio. It's not socially acceptable. It can have real life adverse effects on other people.

[chickenstrip]

[Aff]

From riding with you in Wales, I can tell that you would very much enjoy the B500.
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[spnorm]

I've ridden the B500 several times and much prefer the Routes des Cretes in the Vosges, but as suggested by other folk, just ride one on the way down and the other on the way home.

If you're into military history, the Auto und Technik Museum in Sinsheim is spectacular, especially if you also like planes, trains and automobiles The sister museum in Sinsheim is also very interesting.

I stopped in Brienz in Switzerland in June last year. It's cheaper than Interlaken, Grindelwald and Lauterbrunnen, but is very picturesque and has easy access to the Furka/Grimsel/Susten etc. passes and the Jungfraujoch and Pitz Gloria (ski station on the Bond film "On Her Majesties Secret Service")

[chickenstrip]

[arthurmo]