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Motorcycle gear manufacturers will be forced to comply CE

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Val
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PostPosted: 17:04 - 31 Mar 2016    Post subject: Motorcycle gear manufacturers will be forced to comply CE Reply with quote

Apologies if that has been posted. I just found it.

Europe decides that anything intended for bikes should meet standards.

Motorcycle gear manufacturers will be forced to comply with CE. No more games like CE certified armor only for your jacket. The whole jacket must be certified.

https://www.visordown.com/motorcycle-news--general-news/ce-marking-for-all-bike-kit/30754.html

Of course you can still wear what you want. Flip flops for example. But at least gear sold and marked as motorcycle gear will comply with the safety standards.
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Last edited by Val on 18:06 - 31 Mar 2016; edited 1 time in total
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RhynoCZ
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PostPosted: 17:22 - 31 Mar 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

That is good news, actually. Thumbs Up
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 17:39 - 31 Mar 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

A largely meaningless thing in and of itself. The CE standards aren't very high.

An M&S cheese sandwich passes the test requirements for CE approved body armour.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 17:57 - 31 Mar 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cheese and red cabbage.

Despite the attention grabbing headline and somewhat contradictory language in the article, they never actually state that the sandwich is up to CE standards and they eliminated it at the 50J CE 1 level.

Fixed link: https://www.visordown.com/motorcycle-news--general-news/ce-marking-for-all-bike-kit/30754.html

Interesting comment that if it's mandated then it should be VAT free.

Well, copypasta.

On VisorDown, Rogerborg wrote:
I'm in two minds about this.

First, it can be observed in the breach just by carefully wording your advert to not claim that it's PPE or specifically for motorcycle use.

Second, it'll result in some novelty-purposes gear having a fake CE label slapped on it. Who's going to enforce it?

If Brussels is going to mandate anything, it should be a system where end users (who may be buying 2nd hand, remember) can easily check that something that they're buying actually HAS been tested to the claimed standard.

Oh, and of course some countries will mandate full CE gear eventually, starting with the Vision Zero Scandies.

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Pjay
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PostPosted: 18:24 - 31 Mar 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's the first step to enforcing us all to wear CE rated gear at all times.
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RhynoCZ
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PostPosted: 18:42 - 31 Mar 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think there should be a law, that forces motorcyclists to wear some protective gear. The helmet law is not enough.
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Wafer_Thin_Ham
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PostPosted: 19:11 - 31 Mar 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

RhynoCZ wrote:
I think there should be a law, that forces motorcyclists to wear some protective gear. The helmet law is not enough.


The helmet is plenty thank you. If I would like to ride my R1 in a helmet, hoodie and jeans because I'm trying to get it running properly then I should be able to.
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Northern Monkey
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PostPosted: 19:41 - 31 Mar 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is nothing to stop anyone making motorbikestyle fashion wear, and not CE marking it.
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Wafer_Thin_Ham
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PostPosted: 19:43 - 31 Mar 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just read the first paragraph of the link. It's a standard Visor Down non-story (maybe they nicked it from MCN? Wink )
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Sable
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PostPosted: 19:47 - 31 Mar 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

RhynoCZ wrote:
I think there should be a law, that forces motorcyclists to wear some protective gear. The helmet law is not enough.


Stuff that. I wear flight boots and jeans so I don't have to spend time changing clothes if I want to walk about without crippling my toes. The more inconvenient it becomes riding a bike the less interested I would be in riding them.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 20:33 - 31 Mar 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

RhynoCZ wrote:
I think there should be a law, that forces motorcyclists to wear some protective gear.

Which motorcyclists, how much, and why?
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Val
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PostPosted: 23:07 - 31 Mar 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

RhynoCZ wrote:
I think there should be a law, that forces motorcyclists to wear some protective gear. The helmet law is not enough.


Agree to disagree. What about we leave the natural selection to do its work.

Last time I've checked the world population is 7 412 410 800 and still counting:

https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/

We need less compulsory safety and more wars. Few deadly epidemics. Possibly zombie war Thinking
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Pjay
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PostPosted: 23:15 - 31 Mar 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zackly.
I'm all for making things safer for pedestrians and other road users, but if someone is stupid enough to wearing flipflops and shorts, then so be it.

It's not like the human race is an endangered species, all this health and safety shit can fuck the fuck off away from my leisure activities.

Meanwhile I can be found in full protective gear almost always.
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MCN
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PostPosted: 23:48 - 31 Mar 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

RhynoCZ wrote:
I think there should be a law, that forces motorcyclists to wear some protective gear. The helmet law is not enough.


You are not welcome in our country Sir.

Take your opinion/s and ram them up your bahookie. Karma

We only need common sense.

We do not have laws that determine which of the gene pool are permitted to breed so we will NOT have more nanny rules to tell us how we can ride our bikes.
Anyone who want's to ride motorbike without proper gear is a phanny and is better out of the gene pool anyway.
I would suggest and promote that 'less gear is more' for that very worthy reason.
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talkToTheHat
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PostPosted: 23:58 - 31 Mar 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anyone know when this comes into effect? I'd hate to buy new kit and find out it was discontinued or substantially altered to get CE approval.

I note that CE certification on boots is currently a selling point on certain value boots, whereas a handful of years ago the choice was 200quid altbergs or a few much more expensive items.

I'm more concerned about the weeding out of very cheap or fashion items that aren't any good at all than anything else. If everything has to be fit for purpose, there's a good baseline and less worry about whether an item is rubbish. It will be interesting to see what changes and what dissappears.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 06:48 - 01 Apr 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

talkToTheHat wrote:
It will be interesting to see what changes

Well, I imagine we'll see a lot of cheap Chinese and Pakistani gear sporting CE labels.
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Piercee100
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PostPosted: 07:40 - 01 Apr 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would hate to be forced to wear full gear all the time. I have to wear shirt and tie for work so If I'm at a local depot (within ten miles) I usually just wear waterproofs over the top of my smart clothes with a High-Viz coat. Always wear my steel toe capped work boots with ankle support. My commute is all slow speed filtering stuff, so on my Suzuki 250 I save an hour on the rush hour traffic over the car. I feel relatively safe with what I wear- wouldn't want to come off though so don't push it.

If I'm out for the day or a longer trip it's always full gear. I could never do the two stripe and trainers thing out on the road though.
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andyscooter
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PostPosted: 08:00 - 01 Apr 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

always worn boots and jeans and my green ma1 army jacket so I would be fucked

also my parker Embarassed
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RhynoCZ
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PostPosted: 08:02 - 01 Apr 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not talking about full gear, but I'd make gloves and spine protector mandatory. If that would put you off, then it already works, as less riders on the road, less injured motorcyclists. Integral helmets only, so you can have open casket funeral, would be nice as well. Wink

But, I do understand the inconvenience of it. Motorcycle gear is like a seat belt in your car, you might not need it in 9/10 drives, but then you crash it and will regret it till the end of your days, if you survive.
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Last edited by RhynoCZ on 08:05 - 01 Apr 2016; edited 1 time in total
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 08:05 - 01 Apr 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Piercee100 wrote:
I would hate to be forced to wear full gear all the time.

You won't be forced to do anything of the sort.

Have you ever heard of any biker being done for wearing a non-compliant helmet? B-b-bad to the b-b-bone cruiserists ride in obviously non-compliant Nazi piss-pots without any problems. Pedbois wear their lids perched on top of their bonces (and yes, "securely fastened" is an explicit requirement). James May rode through London sans-lid with no more than a Tut Tut from Dibble.

Really, who's going to make you?
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Last edited by Rogerborg on 08:55 - 01 Apr 2016; edited 1 time in total
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BTTD
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PostPosted: 08:37 - 01 Apr 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

RhynoCZ wrote:
I think there should be a law, that forces motorcyclists to wear some protective gear. The helmet law is not enough.


Another disagree from over here.
If I'm riding the bike from my lockup to the house for a wash (approx 280 yards) then I'm not going to be putting on my leathers. Having to put on a crash helmet is annoying enough.
This may seem like a silly example, but it leads straight onto the question of at what point does full armour and abrasion resistance become necessary. Riding a moped across town on 20mph roads? Full size bike doing the same journey?
I think new riders should be made aware of the benefits of decent protection as part of the training, but we should all be allowed to decide for ourselves what the compromise is.

Also, Rogerborg has got a point with the CE label. If the standard is low, or just not enforced then all a label gives is a false sense of safety to those who want to protect themselves, but don't know enough to buy the right stuff.
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c-m
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PostPosted: 08:38 - 01 Apr 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good news in my opinion.

Yes CE level one armour isn't much, but the abrasion test will at least remove a lot of crap from the market.

Hardly any on the gear out there meets even the level 1 abrasion test requirements. Yes it's just an anvil and a pieace of rotating sand paper, but it's a step forward.
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DrSnoosnoo
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PostPosted: 08:49 - 01 Apr 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

c-m wrote:
Good news in my opinion.

Yes CE level one armour isn't much, but the abrasion test will at least remove a lot of crap from the market.

Hardly any on the gear out there meets even the level 1 abrasion test requirements. Yes it's just an anvil and a pieace of rotating sand paper, but it's a step forward.


We have to test our seating material for Jaaaaaags for abrasion resistance, motorcycle gear providers should do AT LEAST that. But I'm sure the bigger names do it anyway but just don't disclose it. If they say, x amount of wear resistance someone will end up going through it and taking them to court.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 09:02 - 01 Apr 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

RhynoCZ wrote:
I'd make gloves and spine protector mandatory.

Based on what evidence?

How big would the drop in injuries be?

How much State violence would you use to enforce a rider's safety? Recall that Fred Hill died of a heart attack after being imprisoned for the 31st time for refusing to wear a helmet. Still, at least he didn't die of a head injury.
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 11:01 - 01 Apr 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

RhynoCZ wrote:
I'm not talking about full gear, but I'd make gloves and spine protector mandatory. If that would put you off, then it already works, as less riders on the road, less injured motorcyclists. Integral helmets only, so you can have open casket funeral, would be nice as well. Wink

But, I do understand the inconvenience of it. Motorcycle gear is like a seat belt in your car, you might not need it in 9/10 drives, but then you crash it and will regret it till the end of your days, if you survive.


As far as I'm concerned, random chance is the biggest factor in your chances of injury/death in a motorcycle crash.

So if you're going to be fined for not wearing a back protector (which may or may not make any difference and could in some cases make things worse if badly fitted), the police should also be able to randomly stop you and toss a coin. If you guess wrong, you get a fine for being unlucky.

I am against mandatory use of safety gear on motorcycles. Or even wearing of seatbelts in cars. I would be comfortable for there to be a law stating you have to HAVE a helmet just as I think seatbelts should be fitted in cars but I don't think I should be fined for not using them.

In the same way, I like to light fires and poke them with a stick without having a fire extinguisher nearby, paddle my canoe without wearing a flotation device and stand on the edge of a cliff without a rope.
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