First Big Bike...?

[Bally-]

Oh yes, ye olde firste bigge bike question.

Got my Mod 2 booked soon, if I pass and don't crash on the way back to the training school I'll want to buy my first bike. Been learning on a Gladius which I've got no complaints about. Second hand ones seem to be about £2500 upwards though, and I'd rather spend less if I can. I want a twin not a four so options seem to be:

Gladys: Bit pricey
CB500 (90s): Cheap. Might need more repairs?
ER6: Dunno.
SV650: More likely to have been thrashed?

Will be commuting sometimes (20 miles each way, mixed urban/rural) and fannying about on country roads at the weekend. Maybe the odd longer trip. I'm pretty crap at fixing stuff if that makes a difference.

[Cronik]

[talkToTheHat]

Why do you want a twin? Because sound? Because torque characteristics? Because easier to ride? Becasue more engaging to ride? Becasue lighter?

Fazer, xj6(00), hornet, bandit. All decent do-it-all bikes. Bandit is biggest and softest but that makes is a relatively laid back commuter.

if you're doing winter commutes, twin headlights over single and projectors are better than h4 dip and mains. A proper screen as per sv650s, bandit s, fazer, will keep you much more comfortable. Full faired will just cost you more at the garage and I'm going to assume that if doubt your fix-it skills then a garage will do most of the work.

You should at least get the hang of chain cleaning and oil changes if you don't do those already.

I'd have an sv650 if it had to be a twin, but i find them a bit cramped. Pannier racks available on wemoto for cheaps or from sw motech dealers otherwise if you want hard luggage on one. There are loads about so you'll have plenty of choice. Bikes are supposed to have been thrashed, suzuki engines are stronger than their pain. Corrosion kills suzukis. They are cheap, and bought by people with low budgets.

I seem to recall the SV being panned in ride magazine for eating cush rubbers (cheap) and rear tyres. However I think the valve clearence service interval is 16k, compared to 8 for a bandit, so I wouldn't worry too much about running cost differences.
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Bandit. does. everything.

[Beehive Bedlam]

Varadero 1000 can be made A2 legal.

[Rogerborg]

ER6 over SV650S for me because:

https://i.imgur.com/idYmP6L.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/BwglTGp.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/ERfh0eL.png

Keep an eye open for one of the few SV650 non-S models though, and if you're going really pov spec, maybe an NTV650. Although they may be heading into "appreciating classic" territory now.

Heck, there's a chap near me thinking he'll get £2500 for a 2006 CBF500. Bitches be crazy, and you can only buy what's being offered, so don't limit your choices too much.
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Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[Bally-]

[Bally-]

[talkToTheHat]

I'm not sure the twins on offer compare that favorably against the default range of 600 fours tuned for a nice fat midrange. SV and SFV look a bit peaky compaired to the bandit and gsx-f, whereas the common knowledge would have you believe the opposite. That said, a broad and flat torqe curve is both easier to ride and a less exciting than something that suddenly finds a big wad of torque at high rpm.

The SV-S is quite different in riding position to the SV-N and the gladius. I might fit one, really didnt like how close to me the bars were on the N though, but i'm 6 foot and all arms and back.
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Bandit. does. everything.

[Polarbear]

I like your comment about SV's. More likely to have been thrashed.

So what? It isn't the thrashing that's the problem, it's any modification. Bikes are designed to be thrashed
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Triumph Trophy Launch Edition

[Bally-]

[Matt B]

[Diggs]

Nothing wrong with getting a big, cheap, heavy bike for your 1st. You'll learn how to pick one up when you inevitably drop it, where and where not to park it (cambers...), how to counter-steer trying to keep up with lighter bikes, how not to wash it with Fairy Liquid (other salt-based detergents are available...) and a whole host of things you need to know before you spend money on a 'pride and joy'...
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Now - Speed Triple, old ratty GS550, GSXR750M
Gone (in order of ownership) - Raleigh Runabout, AP50, KH125, GP125, KH250, CBX550, Z400, CB750FII, 250LC, GS550, ZXR750H1, Guzzi Targa, GSX750F, KH250 x2, Bimota SB6R and counting...

[Bally-]

So in the spirit of keeping options open... (with 2 cylinders!)

Have the CB500 and CB500S got the same riding position? There were lots of CB500S's for sale last year.

How about the ER6N and ER6F? Same position?

Anything similar in the £1-£2k range? Did Yamaha have anything before the MT-07 type stuff?

The Bandit being sold at bike school doesn't look like it was a school bike, it's very shiny and neat looking. I think they used GS500s (?) and maybe XJ6s before the Gladiuses. Just doesn't grab me though - will still ask about it.

[Rogerborg]

[talkToTheHat]

There's no denying the bandit is difficult to push around compared to something decently light, and if you lean it over a bit whilst pushing it around you feel all of its weight. The physical size means it's quite roomy though. Footpeg position makes it hard to paddle, adding to the feeing of weightiness. Really easy to get on the centrestand though, so it can't be that much of a beast, however much i refer to my bandit as a fat bitch. (Mostly to induce paranoia in girlfriend who knew that i used the terms filthy bitch and virago to describe both her and the bike thereabouts interchangably)

The centre of mass is higher than a cruiser and lower than a modern mass centralised sportsbike. It's also got bigger moments of inertia than such. Depending on the generation you may find mass dampers in the tail and under the tank. Footpegs are mass damped.

A low centre of mass makes a bike easy to push about but hard to turn. The lower the mass, the more lean needed for a given corner and speed. Hence a virago scrapes pegs where a bandit is almost upright. Yes, cruisers with their comical lack of lean angle need more lean. What was the GP bike with the fuel tank under the engine and exhausts over the top? It was an epic disaster becasue the designers didn't understand this. Agile bikes are tall bikes with the weight up high. This is why supermotos are made of win on tight tracks and city streets.

Moment of inertia is how close to the centre of rotation the mass is. A kettlebell has a low moment of inertia compared to a barbell. It's a measure of how easy to rotate something is. Keeping the mass central and reducing moment of inertia means a bike changes direction faster. This is why tankbags have less detrimental effect on the handking than tailpacks. It's also one of the major obsessions in sportsbike design.

Weighted footpegs and other such mass dampers are a cheap and easy way of making a bike with a slightly vibey engine more comfortable to commute on. A bit of a tingle here and there on a sportsbike is permissible. It's a bitch if you are touring. My hands used to get proper numb on my 125s with 10krpm tingle.

All that said, the bandit is very stable feeling once rolling and i quite like filtering and trying to complete a trip without putting my feet down. It's easy to keep upright. It's not got razor sharp handling by any step of the imagination, but neither do i need to push the bars with appreciable effort to get the bike banked over. Brakes need a bit of a squeeze compared to something with yamaha blue spots but aren't likely to catch anybody out by being agressive.
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Bandit. does. everything.

[Tdibs]

SV or cb500 out of those imo in terms of fun bike.

Sv650s (fairing) for a 20 mile commute is fine and is decent for filtering (narrow + folding mirrors) but obvs bad turn circle due to clip ons. The naked version is actually quite different in terms of ergo and gearing.

I think you will be more likely to find a low(er) miler SV650 than a cb500 in tidy condition and low miles.

For Sv, aviod 2003 models and it was a one-off year with some incompatible bits. Buy either side of that year and you should be alright. Basic things, look for tyre wear,brake pads, loud ticking engine, corrosion, service history etc etc.

Sv is fun for blasting backroads on weekends too imo over cb500 coz sik race bik m8. They are fairly hardy things, with ok finish quality i.e if you dont wash it now and then you will go through factory paint as its a budget bike. Grab one if you get on with the seating and enjoy, sometimes those restrictors on the carb models have a habit of falling out and making a fun bike

Edit: as first big bike, look for a model potentially with frame sliders as drop probability is higher.

Double Edit. I was in the same boat, although I already had a A2 restricted naked divvy, wanted a bit more fun, bought a 2002 36k Sv650
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Previous : 09 Vanvan 125| 02' Sv650s || Current: 1999 Xj600n | 1992 DR650 RSE | 2005 Fazer 1000

[Snowdonia Rider]

I'm a touch over 6 foot and don't find an SV650S cramped, in fact I found it just right. Don't worry about the weight of a bike, you'll soon get used to it.
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I want your clothes, your boots and your motorcycle.
Suzuki GP125 Suzuki GSX600F Suzuki SV650S KTM EXC250F SkyTeam Bongo 125
My YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/SnowdoniaRider

[Rogerborg]

[Bally-]

[Rogerborg]

[Matt B]

[Rogerborg]

[Bally-]

[Rogerborg]

Oh, then Fireblade.
____________________
Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[talkToTheHat]