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Britain's Modern Slavery

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Lord Percy
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PostPosted: 18:19 - 10 May 2016    Post subject: Britain's Modern Slavery Reply with quote
While we're here grumbling about immigrants coming here to take jobs, benefits etc all within their current legal rights, this is happening under our noses:

Vietnamese gangs trafficking people to work as slaves on UK cannabis farms.

Eastern European women coerced into prostitution.

People coming for what they believe is fair work, only to be treated like slaves by some half-Albanian cunt.

I'm sure many will argue this represents a stronger case for leaving the EU. I wonder how much it would really help to be honest. These guys are mostly under the radar anyway.

Just goes to show our country really isn't immune from some of the conditions we typically see in the Oxfam save-the-world propaganda.
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Robby
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PostPosted: 19:08 - 10 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Organised crime happens everywhere. This is it. Business without ethics or taxes.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 19:42 - 10 May 2016    Post subject: Re: Britain's Modern Slavery Reply with quote
Lord Percy wrote:
While we're here grumbling about immigrants coming here to [etc]

I grumble about them coming here and stealing local crimes from local criminals.

We've got a hard enough time cleaning up our native degenerates without importing more.
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grr666
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PostPosted: 19:53 - 10 May 2016    Post subject: Re: Britain's Modern Slavery Reply with quote
Lord Percy wrote:

Just goes to show our country really isn't immune from some of the conditions we typically see in the Oxfam save-the-world propaganda.

Just goes to show we are seen as a soft touch all over the world and you can come over and take the utter piss
and likely get away with it more like.
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Lord Percy
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PostPosted: 20:24 - 10 May 2016    Post subject: Re: Britain's Modern Slavery Reply with quote
grr666 wrote:
Lord Percy wrote:

Just goes to show our country really isn't immune from some of the conditions we typically see in the Oxfam save-the-world propaganda.

Just goes to show we are seen as a soft touch all over the world and you can come over and take the utter piss
and likely get away with it more like.


The working conditions in those video are fairly commonplace in other countries. Sweatshops etc.

True there may be some soft touch mentality for those who have a go, however. Vietnam still has the death penalty.
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grr666
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PostPosted: 20:39 - 10 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Thought this thread was about what they do in Britain?
I don't care about what they do in other countries, I don't live there. But the fact they can come to where I do live and stick two fingers up at the rules and do whatever they like pisses me off no end. I fail to see any legitimate reason to have them here at all. But thats me, racist to the core. I'm sure I'm doing them down and they are really a credit to our nation and true ambassadors of theirs. Rolling Eyes
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Polarbear
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PostPosted: 21:37 - 10 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Brexit - Kick out everyone who isn't doing an HONEST job.
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Lord Percy
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PostPosted: 07:34 - 11 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
grr666 wrote:
Thought this thread was about what they do in Britain?


Sure but you said we're seen as a soft touch the world over, which isn't necessarily true since you can get away with such things far easier in other places.

Though the UK may be seen as soft touch for punishments, I think we have a lot more in place to make sure these sorts of criminal activities don't happen in the first place. Rather than being entirely about the 'soft touch', I'd say the UK is seen as good money for the few who work the system and get away with it.

All that being said, I'm not entirely against the death penalty as far is the task of dealing with baddies goes. Since a lot of people see life as self-preservation regardless of human cost, it seems logical to tell them that some things will result in their life not being preserved.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 10:09 - 11 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Lord Percy wrote:
I think we have a lot more in place to make sure these sorts of criminal activities don't happen in the first place.

Such as?

Sure, we have laws against it. But we also have laws against beating a rug in any London thoroughfare (except door mats before the hour of 8am).

Laws without enforcement only bother the law abiding. What are we actually doing to prevent slavery happening?
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Lord Percy
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PostPosted: 11:06 - 11 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Rogerborg wrote:
Lord Percy wrote:
I think we have a lot more in place to make sure these sorts of criminal activities don't happen in the first place.

Such as?


You've got me there.

I was thinking in terms of business practises. Plenty of hoops to jump through before you can officially do what you want. Sure a crook can set themselves up as something and carry on, but they'll always run at a 'bottom rung' level because people with a brain in their heads will be able to weed out the shit. Unlike the comparably large scale operations in countries where it can almost be a norm.

Having said that, for those whose sole intention is to operate illegally, I guess they always will.

You could argue we have 'culture' on our side. We're more willing to name and shame the crooks and rogues, hence exposés like the videos I posted here. Apparently the Albanian car wash guy was dealt with quite swiftly after the video was released, as were the Vietnamese cannabis gang. Can the same be said of other countries?
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 12:11 - 11 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Lord Percy wrote:
You could argue we have 'culture' on our side. We're more willing to name and shame the crooks and rogues

We don't have a homogeneous culture any more though. We have entire sub-cultures of Them, multiple, which don't mingle with either Us or Other Thems, and which allow exploitation to continue for some time.

See Rochdale, 'travellers' and notorious racist Trevor Phillips.
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 14:42 - 11 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Polarbear wrote:
Brexit - Kick out everyone who isn't doing an HONEST job.


So being a slave isn't an "honest" job? Very Happy
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 14:44 - 11 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Rogerborg wrote:
Lord Percy wrote:
You could argue we have 'culture' on our side. We're more willing to name and shame the crooks and rogues

We don't have a homogeneous culture any more though. We have entire sub-cultures of Them, multiple, which don't mingle with either Us or Other Thems, and which allow exploitation to continue for some time.

See Rochdale, 'travellers' and notorious racist Trevor Phillips.


So what? People never really did mingle much with those outside of their societal sub group. The only time we do is during wars.
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Robby
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PostPosted: 17:59 - 11 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Lord Percy wrote:


I was thinking in terms of business practises. Plenty of hoops to jump through before you can officially do what you want. Sure a crook can set themselves up as something and carry on, but they'll always run at a 'bottom rung' level because people with a brain in their heads will be able to weed out the shit. Unlike the comparably large scale operations in countries where it can almost be a norm.

Having said that, for those whose sole intention is to operate illegally, I guess they always will.


Ever heard of a front?

The only way to stop organised crime is to find where it is happening, then put the people responsible in prison. This is tricky. Finding out about is tricky, because the people that know about it are either involved, or their family will be tortured if they talk. Once organised crime is found, the people running it maintain enough separation to avoid going to prison.

If these safeguards (from the criminal's point of view) aren't in place, it isn't organised crime, just plain old disorganised crime. Organised crime behaves likes a business, where the purpose is to make a profit and keep operating.

It isn't just drugs, prostitution and slavery either. Big money to be had in such mundane things as counterfeit perfume or repackaged parallel-import toiletries.
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Lord Percy
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PostPosted: 19:06 - 11 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Robby wrote:


Ever heard of a front?

The only way to stop organised crime is to find where it is happening, then put the people responsible in prison. This is tricky. Finding out about is tricky, because the people that know about it are either involved, or their family will be tortured if they talk. Once organised crime is found, the people running it maintain enough separation to avoid going to prison.

If these safeguards (from the criminal's point of view) aren't in place, it isn't organised crime, just plain old disorganised crime. Organised crime behaves likes a business, where the purpose is to make a profit and keep operating.

It isn't just drugs, prostitution and slavery either. Big money to be had in such mundane things as counterfeit perfume or repackaged parallel-import toiletries.


Quite an interesting point, cheers.

I suppose my mind was more focussed on those who want to do blatantly immoral things, primarily involving piss-take exploitation of other people. Those sorts of things are evidently more of a rarity in this country (thought the videos I posted show they do exist to a small extent).

Fair point about the other crimes though; the ones that can be made to appear legit. I guess this would be one argument for letting big fat multicorps take over the majority of trade in any country. It would make things easier to control as supply chains become less of a complex web.
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 20:18 - 11 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Robby wrote:


Ever heard of a front?

The only way to stop organised crime is to find where it is happening, then put the people responsible in prison. This is tricky. Finding out about is tricky, because the people that know about it are either involved, or their family will be tortured if they talk. Once organised crime is found, the people running it maintain enough separation to avoid going to prison.

If these safeguards (from the criminal's point of view) aren't in place, it isn't organised crime, just plain old disorganised crime. Organised crime behaves likes a business, where the purpose is to make a profit and keep operating.

It isn't just drugs, prostitution and slavery either. Big money to be had in such mundane things as counterfeit perfume or repackaged parallel-import toiletries.


Its deep in our society totally intergrated into every level we just choose not to look at it even though its under our noses. I wonder what would happen if one of those police and crime commissioners England has started pressing the local plod to get more active on these lot https://www.bikechatforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=311835

Personally I think they would be deaded in short order.
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Robby
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PostPosted: 14:33 - 13 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
I prefer to look at the positives, consider drugs and prostitution. If you run either as a business, then you can look to provide your clients with consistent cost, quality, and availability. Same as selling potatoes in a supermarket.

Organised crime can provide this, which leads to a stable market where the buyers and suppliers understand the local rules. This keeps the nasty side effects - like violence and overdoses - down.

Remove the organised criminals and let some amateurs run the show - because drugs and prostitution will still exist - and watch the local police and health services get very pissed off at having to deal with murders, beatings, overdoses and STDs.
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 14:50 - 13 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Robby wrote:
I prefer to look at the positives, consider drugs and prostitution. If you run either as a business, then you can look to provide your clients with consistent cost, quality, and availability. Same as selling potatoes in a supermarket.

Organised crime can provide this, which leads to a stable market where the buyers and suppliers understand the local rules. This keeps the nasty side effects - like violence and overdoses - down.

Remove the organised criminals and let some amateurs run the show - because drugs and prostitution will still exist - and watch the local police and health services get very pissed off at having to deal with murders, beatings, overdoses and STDs.


I've read some bolloks on this forum over the years but that is about the most ridiculous shite ever.
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iooi
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PostPosted: 16:29 - 13 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Robby wrote:
I prefer to look at the positives, consider drugs and prostitution. If you run either as a business, then you can look to provide your clients with consistent cost, quality, and availability. Same as selling potatoes in a supermarket.

.


Even better would be to legalise these in some way, so that the Gov could take their share in taxes.
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 20:16 - 13 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
iooi wrote:

Even better would be to legalise these in some way, so that the Gov could take their share in taxes.


You have to be careful though. Tax and regulate too much and you make it economic for organised crime to undercut the legit market. This has happened with cigarettes as they've become more expensive due to tax. Now people are smoking black market cigs that are probably more harmful than legit ones.

I always thought a way to undermine organised drug dealing would be to allow growing cannabis for personal use legal. As long as it was a limited number of plants and not super strong skunk hybrids.
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BTTD
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PostPosted: 21:37 - 13 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Robby wrote:
Remove the organised criminals and let some amateurs run the show - because drugs and prostitution will still exist - and watch the local police and health services get very pissed off at having to deal with murders, beatings, overdoses and STDs.


Laughing "Organised" criminal gangs don't have professional standards that they abide by. If you want that, then you legalise and regulate.
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Ste
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PostPosted: 23:32 - 13 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
If they don't abide by the professional standards expected of all 'employees' then they're not going to be part of the organised crime gang for much longer.

Organised crime is very organised. They're well managed, professionally run businesses.

Regulations provided by organised crime are likely to be more 'efficient' than what the police can provide. That keeps all the amateurs away and all the problems they bring with them that Robby described.

Legalise everything. Thumbs Up
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 06:22 - 14 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
If you think that the State isn't just the biggest mob around, you haven't put a lot of thought into it.

Try not paying your protection money, see what happens.
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Ribenapigeon
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PostPosted: 09:42 - 14 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Rogerborg wrote:
If you think that the State isn't just the biggest mob around, you haven't put a lot of thought into it.

Try not paying your protection money, see what happens.


The state doesn't kneecap you. Next someone is going to pipe up saying crooks are ok because they "luv their muvvers".
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Monkeywrenche...
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PostPosted: 10:16 - 14 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote
Robby wrote:
I prefer to look at the positives, consider drugs and prostitution. If you run either as a business, then you can look to provide your clients with consistent cost, quality, and availability. Same as selling potatoes in a supermarket.

Organised crime can provide this, which leads to a stable market where the buyers and suppliers understand the local rules. This keeps the nasty side effects - like violence and overdoses - down.

Remove the organised criminals and let some amateurs run the show - because drugs and prostitution will still exist - and watch the local police and health services get very pissed off at having to deal with murders, beatings, overdoses and STDs.


They're doing a community service really, it's better like this I suppose, oh hang on.....


https://police.community/topic/47921-daily-mail-mother-and-7-year-old-child-knee-capped-in-punishment-shooting/

Still I suppose they had it coming because it helps prevent overdoses or some bullshit?
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