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B5234FT
Brolly Dolly



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PostPosted: 08:49 - 07 Jun 2016    Post subject: Surface dressing Reply with quote

This stuff

https://rnsurfacing.co.uk/surface-dressingMEDIA/SurfaceDressings.jpg

It's awful for the first few weeks in any vehicle, seems to be permanently awful on a bike as the loose cravel doesnt clear outwith the car/lorry tracks and lasts about 6 months before it needs done again.

Why do they do it? How do you ride on it?
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P.addy
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PostPosted: 08:50 - 07 Jun 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

You ride as normal, just less heavy on brakes.

Reason, quicker and cheaper.
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doggone
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PostPosted: 08:55 - 07 Jun 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

The thing is they mostly do it in fine weather - when you are more likely to be out.
It really needs a cool spell or some rain to settle down fully.
Try to follow car tracks for best experience
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B5234FT
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PostPosted: 09:05 - 07 Jun 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah I tend to try and go slower, more upright and less braking to avoid loading up the tyres, and then follow the car tracks which never feels great. It's hard to see whats fixed and whats loose until the fixed stuff gets covered in tar and changes colour.
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trevor saxe-coburg-gotha
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PostPosted: 09:32 - 07 Jun 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Restrictions should be placed on using this method so that it can only normally be done in winter and cooler times of year when the tar will set quicker, and there'll be more rain to wash the excess chippings "away" (i.e. down the drains to clog them and cause more issues in flood prone areas).
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Llama-Farmer
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PostPosted: 09:57 - 07 Jun 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

It would be absolutely fine to use this method, if they just fucking pressed it in with a roller.


The vast majority of "sealed" urban roads in New Zealand were made using this method (although a massive amount of urban roads were unsealed gravel), by laying tar, sprinkling gravel, and then rolling it flat. It worked a treat and was usually really grippy. Because they actually prepared it properly and then only opened the road once it was ready.

In the UK in an effort to save money it seems they've done away with rolling it and let the traffic do half the job for them. But that means lots of loose chippings everywhere which not only strip the paint from your car but are scary in the corners on two wheels.


I can't imagine a proper steam roller would make it a much more expensive process.
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Aceslock
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PostPosted: 09:58 - 07 Jun 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

AArgghh!!

They have done this on the A4059 on the Brecon Beacons, a lovely stretch of road to open up the throttle (watching for sheep!!), to which i am now scared to in case of the loose gravel..... Evil or Very Mad
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 10:24 - 07 Jun 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

I demand to pay more taxes!
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Kris
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PostPosted: 10:30 - 07 Jun 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:
I demand to pay more taxes!


If they laid roads correctly in the first place then we'd save a fortune in taxes. Unfortunately it's short-term thinking (and budgets) that mean we don't get value for money.

I once worked for a company that had the Kent Highways contract for maintenance and improvements planning and supervision (!) and once looked out the window to see the contractor empty a bag of tarmac into a pothole and 'smash' it roughly smooth with the back of his shovel. That particular 'road repair' took 30 seconds and lasted about the same.

[edit - just for you Scots]
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/council-spending/12188547/Council-redefines-potholes-to-save-money-on-repairs.html


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Aceslock
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PostPosted: 10:38 - 07 Jun 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

They have been using that method around here all winter..... 2 weeks later pothole is back!

A lot of resurfacing has been done lately (& properly) which is a good thing, but too little too late tbh
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B5234FT
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PostPosted: 10:53 - 07 Jun 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Llama-Farmer wrote:
It would be absolutely fine to use this method, if they just fucking pressed it in with a roller.


The vast majority of "sealed" urban roads in New Zealand were made using this method (although a massive amount of urban roads were unsealed gravel), by laying tar, sprinkling gravel, and then rolling it flat. It worked a treat and was usually really grippy. Because they actually prepared it properly and then only opened the road once it was ready.

In the UK in an effort to save money it seems they've done away with rolling it and let the traffic do half the job for them. But that means lots of loose chippings everywhere which not only strip the paint from your car but are scary in the corners on two wheels.


I can't imagine a proper steam roller would make it a much more expensive process.


The problem is you cant.

Done properly, you lay the tar and then roll the gravel in whilst it's soft so the gravel embeds and is solidly held. This is the equivalent of trying to glue pointy dusty gravel to an existing hard surface with an adhesive which melts in summer. Rolling it wouldnt really help as the road underneath is either existing highway which has hardened, or a repair done a week or more beforehand.
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ScaredyCat
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PostPosted: 11:10 - 07 Jun 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aceslock wrote:
A lot of resurfacing has been done lately (& properly) which is a good thing, but too little too late tbh


My local council have taken to doing it properly. I'm not complaining...
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The Shaggy D.A.
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PostPosted: 11:22 - 07 Jun 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

They've been doing it in the Northampton area for the last couple of months, one stretch they did twice, but stopped 20 yards from a pothole ridden roundabout :-

https://goo.gl/maps/YwyVaScUr172

Not very clear from the picture, but it's been like it for years. Has a bastard of a camber switch on the left hander, too.
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Kaya75
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PostPosted: 11:24 - 07 Jun 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

its a pain in the arse, they have done this on a main stretch of my commute, gravel slippage and cant filter cuz my filter "lane" now has 3 inches of gravel kicked out from the cars.

I don't demand to pay more TAX I demand that the taxes produced from motoring are spent soley on the roads. Fuel TAX is £0.5795 per litre then add on 20% VAT on sale - nearly 70p a litre on each and every litre + Road Tax on a tiny island with too many people and too many vehicles. We should have the best laid roads in the world not some bastard botched up potholed gravel spreading mofo's of a path... grrrrrrrrr

Not only that but the dust kicked up is a nightmare on a bike too, makes my cigs taste like shite!

I want to hire a road sweeper and go sweep it all away then empty back at the council offices..
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ADSrox0r
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PostPosted: 12:14 - 07 Jun 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

They've just done it last week through my village it's a fucking nightmare. We have a blind junction blocked by trees and foliage that's a pain to take normally but now I might aswell get off and walk round the fucker.

That and the stone chips twanging off the fairings makes me cry, and one in the face yesterday. Mint.
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iooi
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PostPosted: 16:57 - 07 Jun 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

B5234FT wrote:
Rolling it wouldnt really help as the road underneath is either existing highway which has hardened, or a repair done a week or more beforehand.


Well it worked well enough for many years.......

Rolling it also means you do not get tracks where the most traffic runs removing the chippings and leaving the shinny tar underneath especially on corners.
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WULFSTAN
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PostPosted: 18:30 - 07 Jun 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

There seems to be a few myths here it's called tar and chip or surface dressing it's not designed to fill pot holes in anyway they should be filled before hand and it always gets rolled but there's always going to be some loose chippings come off which is why they put up 10 or 20 mph skid risk signs. It's designed to be quick cheap and once sweept to look good it also comes up with the first frost half the time. micro asphalt is better lasts longer fills holes with less loose and is almost as cheap which is why many councils are using it more and more.
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WULFSTAN
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PostPosted: 18:34 - 07 Jun 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

trevor saxe-coburg-gotha wrote:
Restrictions should be placed on using this method so that it can only normally be done in winter and cooler times of year when the tar will set quicker, and there'll be more rain to wash the excess chippings "away" (i.e. down the drains to clog them and cause more issues in flood prone areas).
You can't lay it when it's cool or wet in anyway which is why the tar and chip season is from April to September.
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andyscooter
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PostPosted: 18:38 - 07 Jun 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

As him above said I know a few lads who do this for a living

it's from April onwards as can't do it in winter



Lads I know did Yorkshire and are now in devon
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Last edited by andyscooter on 21:53 - 07 Jun 2016; edited 1 time in total
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Llama-Farmer
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PostPosted: 21:31 - 07 Jun 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

WULFSTAN wrote:
There seems to be a few myths here... ...it always gets rolled.



Can assure you it doesn't.

I have seen twice in two different locations (Derbyshire and North Yorkshire, so completely different areas of responsibility) that have tipped a lorry load of gravel and swept then opened the road. Crucially not pressed down.


Since they were only doing one side of a pretty remote and quiet road at a time, I don't see why they couldn't have kept each part closed for another hour longer and rolled it too.

Cost (and time-cost) are the only logical conclusions I can come up with... i.e. saving money by doing piss poor job.
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Silver_Fox
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PostPosted: 21:43 - 07 Jun 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aceslock wrote:
AArgghh!!

They have done this on the A4059 on the Brecon Beacons



Yes they bloody have. Made me nervous 2 up last weekend Evil or Very Mad
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ADSrox0r
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PostPosted: 05:51 - 08 Jun 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Llama-Farmer wrote:


Can assure you it doesn't.



Categorically agree with this, it doesn't. They didn't roll it last week and when they did a massive stretch of the A1079 the other year they never rolled it.

Chuck the slop on, launch the stones on and bugger off. Come back the next day (Or much later in some instances) and give it a pass over with the road hoover...then fuck it.

They even made a complete balls up of the A1079 causing massive ripples for half a mile that feel like you're riding over a cattle grid but when people complained they said in no uncertain words, "fuck it".
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WULFSTAN
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PostPosted: 06:25 - 08 Jun 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

All I can say is the two companies I've done it with in the past have always rolled it RMS and Eurovia. Can I ask how long you watched the process for as the roller driver can be miles behind in some cases.
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yen_powell
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PostPosted: 07:34 - 08 Jun 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's you, the great unwashed, doing the rolling, by driving over it spitting stones at the bike/car/lorry behind.
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New Sarum
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PostPosted: 07:38 - 08 Jun 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Highway Authority or its representative (i.e. contractor) should take reasonable steps to sweep away the excess chippings. If you feel that the chippings are a real hazard, write/telephone to the Highway Authority and make them aware. That may reult in the road being swept; due to constraints on public authority spending, a decision could be made to take the risk not to do so and that no one will have an accident.
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