Traffic cop entrapment (?)

[nitrosurf]

Hello all,

Out with some mates today doing a Blackwood (SW) to Aberystwyth and back run. Had a good time except for this:

Between Llangurig and Aberystwyth there's a section of road with some lovely bends, actually more between Llangurig and The Red Kite Cafe. I had lead a lot of the way and had buggered off a fair bit, so by this point i felt a bit guilty and thought I'd bring up the rear (oo-er) for a bit. There was this rider on a fancy sports machine with lots of red paint in front of our five man convoy with what I initially thought was a stupid helmet attachment (like one of those w##k Mohawks) but was later informed it was a fancy lid-cam. Anyway, the speed limit went up to national and the bends opened up enough to see a decent way into the distance making higher speed/overtaking easy. This person sat at around 35mph for a goodly while, and as the guys I was with are too polite/gentlemanly we sat behind him for awhile. I grew a little impatient as the whole point of us being out was to enjoy the roads. So I opened up, cleared my mates and this bimbler and gave it some stick. A quick check of the mirrors showed my buds were following suit and going around The Bright Red RoadBlock. Long story short, I get to the Red Kite Cafe and find I'm alone. Eventually one of my mates turns up, so we grab a hot beverage and wait. We worry after a bit and head back the way we came, and bump into two of the others going the other way. They said they were pulled by a uniformed officer on a marked police bike. Apparently he said he'd followed us for 3.6 miles (no one saw a cop bike behind, and it's something I'm sure at least one out of five of us would have spotted) and had recorded speeds varying from 100+ to 75mph in a 60 zone. He told the lads that he had hoped to 'bunch us up' in the next 30 zone, but i'd gone off like a scalded cat and two of the other guys had gone off after me. The officer told my friends that we had 'been lucky', as although the nearby traffic cam (big tall black pylon with a camera facing either way) would have got our plates he would have needed to pull us to prosecute. He told the two he had caught that as we had been riding safely (but illegally) he would only do them for 75 in a 60 despite apparently following us at much higher speeds.

I think the Red Road Block was part of the whole thing, like a plain clothes cop riding in such a way as to 'encourage' riders to go around him at a clip and subsequently get done... And I think uniform plod was laying in wait for when his lure bobbed and told him he'd had a bite...This isn't a winge as such, because I could have just methodically overtaken reach rider one by one, then brought it back to 60ish. I didn't, I nailed it and so did my mates. Although not quite as hard obviously... Neither of the guys that got NIP's have any previous, and the chip told them they're likely get the speed awareness course rather than points. Apparently he seemed like a nice chap, but if I'm right (could just be paranoid) it's a hell of a way to get prosecutions...

In short then, keep your eyes peeled; sneaky bugger time is in full effect!
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"Multiple exclamation marks," he went on, shaking his head, "are a sure sign of a diseased mind."

[Ariel Badger]

Who informed you that the rid bike's rider had "A fancy lid-cam"?
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Bikers make great organ donors, get 115 on your licence today.

[nitrosurf]

Some of the lads, we were having a natter about it all and I mentioned the silly helmet; three of them said it was a camera-doobery.
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"Multiple exclamation marks," he went on, shaking his head, "are a sure sign of a diseased mind."

[CaNsA]

That wall of text has less formatting to it than a wall of teffers splurg.

[Pete.]

Why was this entrapment exactly? If you were speeding you were speeding, it's not like he goaded you into it.
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a.k.a 'Geri'

132.9mph off and walked away. Gear is good, gear is good, gear is very very good

[nitrosurf]

Hence the (?) in the title and what I said regarding my actions. Regardless though, if it was set up it's a cat and mouse game rather than a straight up 'i caught you speeding' thing. I'm not looking for justification/retribution/cuddly toy, just thought I'd write down what I experienced in case something similar crops up for anyone else.

I were quite lucky by the seems of it.
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"Multiple exclamation marks," he went on, shaking his head, "are a sure sign of a diseased mind."

[Tdibs]

[Pete.]

[Gone but not forgotten]

FFS guys, back up a fellow biker & stop giving him shit!

Yes, you are right, the NW plod do still go out to entrap as many motorcyclists as possible because they're easy targets even though they agreed to stop pinpointing speeding motorists & get on with catching sheep rustlers!!!
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Mick

[ScaredyCat]

It's not entrapment unless he encouraged you to ride faster than you would have.

If plod with cam observed you going over the limit that's not entrapment. Plod lying in wait with a camera is not entrapment. Plod riding slower than you wanted to ride is not entrapment.

Summary: Poor Obs.
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Honda CBF125 ➝ NC700X
Honda CBF125 ↳ Speed Triple

[kramdra]

Poor obs, pay the fine and enjoy the good value for money

Annoys me a bit they dont target actual bad driving other than speeders. At the same time I wish there were 10x more fixed speed cameras to punish those with shit awareness.

[Gone but not forgotten]

Am I on a bikers forum here or a fucking knitting circle?????

FFS girls, grow a fucking pair!
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Mick

[Pete.]

Come back when you've gained some credibility shitabroad. Most of what you post is trolling so shove your righteous indignation where the sun don't shine.
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a.k.a 'Geri'

132.9mph off and walked away. Gear is good, gear is good, gear is very very good

[Gone but not forgotten]

[Recluso]

Like the folks say, it's only entrapment if you were made to act in a way you wouldn't normally. Not to mention even unmarked police bikes are fairly easy to spot as they're usually rigged up with masses of tech.

Bimbler was likely some innocent bystander and bike Officer had probably been assigned to the area for most of the day if it's a well known bike route and was tucked up in an area that you and your mates didn't see him in waiting for people to shoot by.

Concur with the above, bad obs and a dollop of bad luck.
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'Just erotic. Nothing kinky. It's the difference between using a feather and using a chicken.'
Honda PS125i > Yamaha YBR125 > Yamaha XJ6 Diversion > Yamaha Tracer 900

[Pete.]

[V2]

FWIW: I thought shitabroad was pretty funny

[nitrosurf]

Luckily for me I didn't get pulled, so unless they have camera footage as evidence they can use I should be okay (but who knows). As far as my observations go, I saw all the traffic around me and passed everyone with a decent gap and without cutting in. No oncoming traffic was affected and no one had to adjust their riding because of mine. What was possibly a fail on my part was not thinking "hang on, why is he going so slow...?"

There was no obvious tech on the guys bike, so maybe you're right and he was just a bimbling bystander.

I am fully aware that any kind of riding outside what the law expects/allows us unacceptable, and those who ride in such a fashion do so at their own risk. I was only describing something I had experienced that I thought was a bit odd is all.
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"Multiple exclamation marks," he went on, shaking his head, "are a sure sign of a diseased mind."

[UncleFester]

If he's unmarked, he's probably in radio contact with another unmarked ( but with more cameras / calibrated speedo) or another 1 or 2 cars that can wait for you down the road.

Bit of a sticky point because any police biker will agree that the least amount of time you spend on the wrong side of the road is good and decisive overtakes are safer / better than dawdling past. Just for clarity, i suspect doing it on the back wheel would be frowned on.

If he was doing 30 in a NSL and the overtake was a safe one then crack on and if you do crack on and they ain't following .... don't go back and find out why!

"i thought you were going a bit quick" is a whole different ball game to "i have you on camera and calibrated speedo doing 105mph average for 3.7 miles with 34 suicidal overtakes".

Noisy exhaust they might nab you for an S59 if they are really bored .....
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2017 Z1000SX

[Vracktal]

"I'll just accelerate from 35mph to 60mph and stay there on this twisty, open road" ...said no biker, ever.
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2007 BMW R1200R: On road
2009 BMW G650X Challenge: On road
1975 Norton Commando 850: Off road, awaiting recommissioning

[Teflon-Mike]

I think we need the resident law-borg on the case, BUT, as far as I understand we have NO specific 'entrapment' laws in this country, that is a peculiarly Yankee bit of the peculiar american legal system.
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My Webby'Tef's-tQ, loads of stuff about my bikes, my Land-Rovers, and the stuff I do with them!
Current Bikes:'Honda VF1000F' ;'CB750F2N' ;'CB125TD ( 6 3 of em!)'; 'Montesa Cota 248'. Learner FAQ's:= 'U want to Ride a Motorbike! Where Do U start?'

[Kentol750]

Think that it's Dyfed Powys police and not NW in that area, and they are well known to use unmarked vehicles on BH weekends/sunny Sundays! A44 and A40 policed for 'safety'!
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Some bikes.

[iooi]

[nitrosurf]

I'm not really one to show off, as my attention was fixed on the road and what I was doing; not whether my mates were looking at me. And although I gave it some stick I wasn't in race-mode-loony-brumbrum. I was hoping the lads would join me in some spirited riding, but if whenever I tickled the throttle and found they weren't coming I'd fallen back into convoy. It's how I ended up at the back by the time of the incident.
As I said, I'm not trying to get anyone to say anything in particular; I'm just sharing an experience. Whether my riding was good/bad isn't what I'm trying to highlight, it's the perception I had of what happened regarding the police's actions. I'm not even bawwing about what they did, it's just the first time I've seen this kind of thing happen.
The two lads that did get nabbed were very grown up about it, and were grateful that the '75 in a 60' is as far as the uniformed gent was going with it.
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"Multiple exclamation marks," he went on, shaking his head, "are a sure sign of a diseased mind."

[ScaredyCat]