Lithium prescription, am I a mentalist?

[Hong Kong Phooey]

After not riding the CBR for 5 days, it decided to let me down on Tuesday morrow morn. After slow cranking for 5 seconds the battery decided it was a little bit cold and too early to put a shift in, wrapped itself up in its duvet and told me to cease and desist making any further efforts.

A quick jump from a booster battery meant it only had to be told once, and a away we go. It decided it best not anger me and kindly started for the return journey that very same evening.

I've been monitoring the voltage since, and it's around 12.4v to 12.6v.
Time for a new battery methinks, I know the Yuasa lead acid unit has been in situ for 2 years minimum, and the reg rec is newish and tested Ok.

So what's the point of this waffle? Well since Li-ion has almost become de riguer in total loss race bikes, and the price is now less eyewatering, I'm pondering if these 2 options are viable for a daily commuter:

JMT
https://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/Honda-CBR-600-F-1987-2000-Superlight-LITHIUM-Li-Ion-Battery-save-2kg-/272175866807

Shido
https://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/SHIDO-LITHIUM-ION-LIGHTWEIGHT-MOTORCYCLE-BATTERY-HONDA-CBR600F-1987-2000-/152122304593?nav=SEARCH

I'm edging towards the JMT due to balanced charging and on board management. Anyone used either, good or bad input taken on board?
Both offer 2 full kg lighter, adding extra lightness to an already lightweight (~200kg wet) bike.

In b4 buy what you want, you'll die in exploshun, shave 3/10ths off your commute.
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'81 CG125, '97 FZS600 : '99 CBR600F4, '09 KTM RC8

[Itchy]

Pretty much same price as the Motobatts. I've used a motobatt in every one of my CBR600s and they've outlasted the bike.

OTOH this could just mean that motobatts cause bike destruction!

There is a massive thread here:

https://advrider.com/index.php?threads/motorcycle-batteries-agm-gel-wet-lithium-iron-phosphate-lifepo4.757934/
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Spain 2008France 2007Big one 2009 We all die. The goal isn't to live forever, the goal is to create something that will. In the end, your life will flash before your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching.

[stinkwheel]

Personally, there is no way I'd be putting a lithium battery directly under my arse.

When reg-recs fail they go one of two ways. They either stop rectifying (no charge) or they stop regulating (overcharge).

Once had a charging system failure that overcharged a sealed lead acid bettary. It had bulged to the extent I had to cut down the side of the battery box to remove it then (wearing gloves and goggles) carry it to the end of the garden and administer a coup de grace on it from beyond minimum safe distance with my airgun.

Overcharge a lithium battery...? I'm happy with my arsehole the size it is thanks.
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“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.”
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.

[Hong Kong Phooey]

[ADSrox0r]

Lithiums are fine for a garage queen but not so great for an all year rounder, they don't do well with cold starts.
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Current bikes: '08 VFR 800 VTEC(yo) , '07 ZZR1400 Winter hack: '95 Aprilia 650 Pegaso Currently lusting after: RC30

[nitrosurf]

After doing a fair bit of searching around my next battery for the Duc is going to be one of the Motobatt lead acid jobbies. The prices are very fair and judging from the raves on here their claims seem honest. Unless you're looking for ultimate weight saving (RaCeBiKe) I personally don't see the point of an over sized laptop battery.

And as Stinkwheel said, should it overcharge there's a chance it'll bonfire your bike!

🏍
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"Multiple exclamation marks," he went on, shaking his head, "are a sure sign of a diseased mind."

[G]

I would hope they come with a BMS that prevents such issues. I've got a JMT in my track 675 and doing fine so far. If I total-loss it, will probably just stick in a RC battery.

On track losing a few pounds here and there can start to add up, especially on already quite light bike like the 675. Not sure I'd bother on others.

[hmmmnz]

ive got a lithium battery in my vtr1000, its about the only thing that will start the bike if it doesnt catch on the first push of the button,
the other batteries ive had in it just dont have the cranking amps, to turn it over for more than a couple of seconds.

and there is no bump starting that tank, also the vtr sits for long periods with out being started, so a lithium battery is perfect for that bike,

i use motobatts in all my other bikes
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the humans are dead
I kick arse for the lord
Wiring Diagrams BIDNIP it bitches

[G]

[Hong Kong Phooey]

After much reading, I've decided in the pioneering spirit upon this:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Upgrade-to-LITHIUM-battery-Honda-CBR-600-F-2011-YTZ10S-/272351858260

Yes, it's rated at 48Wh, the recommended one for a '99 CBR600 is 36Wh.
After researching it's best to go for the highest capacity you can physically afford / fit. I'll update this thread over winter to indicate how the cold starts are going.

This is an Li-Iron Phosphate unit, much more resistant to fire and death than the other Lithium chemistry type batteries. BMS is not deemed necessary, well we'll soon find out.
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'81 CG125, '97 FZS600 : '99 CBR600F4, '09 KTM RC8

[Wafer_Thin_Ham]

[Wafer_Thin_Ham]

[G]

The issue with chargers is that some lead acid ones may spike high voltages for maintenance reasons.

Cheaper 'basic' chargers should be fine.

You can buy a decent hobby charger that will do lithium, lead acid and others for under £20 (or £10 if you're powering it from 12v).

LiFePo4 is generally 'safer'. It typically can handle a lot more more cycles (fully charged to empty) than LiPo/Li-ion, but for the same weight generally won't have as high 'cranking' amps.

[Wafer_Thin_Ham]

[G]

Unless the charger is faulty and would also damage a lead acid battery, it shouldn't be able to damage a lithium battery.

Lithium batteries can generally be safely charged at a much higher C rating.
LiPo and Li-ion batteries aren't fully charged at the cut off voltage for lead acid, so even a bit of over-charge they can handle ok.

£60 is way over the odds for a lithium charger.
https://www.hobbyking.co.uk/hobbyking/store/__58285__IMAX_B6AC_V2_Professional_Balance_Charger_Discharger.html
You can get copies that also should be 'good enough' for £22.
About half that if you've got a 12v supply to use (for instance a car battery with a lead acid charger).

Any examples of someone damaging a battery with a basic charger that isn't broken?

(Unless we're talking so basic it's constant current not voltage - but you only really get those for trucks or they are really, really old.)

[Hong Kong Phooey]

[stinkwheel]

So what would happen if I put 17v into one?
____________________
“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.”
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.

[redeem ouzzer]

[jjdugen]

As above. Stupidity. Lead acid, cheap, available, rugged, more than enough precious amps to do the job.
For God's sake, Lipo has just wiped out Samsung!
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The CBR900RR has been sold. Aprilia Falco worms its way into my heart.
Try Soi 23 on Amazon for a good read.... Self promotion? Moi?

[Fisty]

[G]

[Hong Kong Phooey]

[G]

[Wafer_Thin_Ham]

[Wafer_Thin_Ham]