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Gazz
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PostPosted: 19:21 - 27 Oct 2016    Post subject: Trailer laws Reply with quote

Finally got a car with a tow bar which will allow me the option to have a trailer if I need one, but I'm struggling to find all of the laws on towing with a trailer.

The GOV website is very vague.
https://www.gov.uk/towing-with-car/driving-licence-rules-and-what-you-can-tow

Do you need to insure a trailer?
If so, is it part of car insurance or home insurance or specific trailer insurance?
Do you need an MOT for them?
If so, how often do they get an MOT?
Do they need arches for covering the wheels?
And a lightboard (if you can see the rear lights of the car)?
Do you need an 'on tow' sticker?
Do you need to light for the number plate?

Any help muchly appreciated. Probably will look for something that is small but big enough to carry a decent supply of firewood (pallet sizes), or possibly an A frame dolly for towing other cars.

Will the laws be different for towing other cars on an A frame?
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duhawkz
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PostPosted: 19:40 - 27 Oct 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Do you need to insure a trailer?
No

If so, is it part of car insurance or home insurance or specific trailer insurance?
N/A

Do you need an MOT for them?
No

If so, how often do they get an MOT?
N/A

Do they need arches for covering the wheels?
Not sure, I would have thought so

And a lightboard (if you can see the rear lights of the car)?
yes

Do you need an 'on tow' sticker?
No

Do you need to light for the number plate?
Yes
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Gazz
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PostPosted: 19:52 - 27 Oct 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

duhawkz wrote:
Do you need to insure a trailer?
No

If so, is it part of car insurance or home insurance or specific trailer insurance?
N/A

Do you need an MOT for them?
No

If so, how often do they get an MOT?
N/A

Do they need arches for covering the wheels?
Not sure, I would have thought so

And a lightboard (if you can see the rear lights of the car)?
yes

Do you need an 'on tow' sticker?
No

Do you need to light for the number plate?
Yes


Very informative. Is there anywhere with a list of Needs/Don't needs for trailers?

I am not doubting what you have written, but I find it hard to believe that they don't need some sort of insurance or MOT.

For example, what if something happened and a bit fell off the trailer and hit someone else's car? And they claimed that the trailer was not fit enough to be on the road?
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doggone
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PostPosted: 20:00 - 27 Oct 2016    Post subject: Re: Trailer laws Reply with quote

Gazz wrote:

Will the laws be different for towing other cars on an A frame?


It would be over the 750kg(?) weight, you would need to take a test now., also what car is it - there will be a stated maximum for how much it can tow.
Could be up to 3.5 tons for big pickups and Landrovers but far less for more regular cars. It's related to the weight of the vehicle.
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J4mes
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PostPosted: 20:02 - 27 Oct 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the .gov were on about MOT's for trailers but haven't implemented anything.

Insurance, your car insurance *may* cover something being towed, but it's unusual.

It's a case of "on your head be it" with regards to road worthiness. I recently scrapped a home made trailer as the suspension units had seized up and the tyres were completely shagged. I only used it to take stuff to the tip less than 2 miles away, but considering if it did let go and cause a major accident or injury you'd be up shit creek, I decided to scrap it and buy a new one.



1. Vehicles that must take the 'annual test'
The annual test is for:

goods vehicles with a gross weight of more than 3,500 kilograms (kg)
vehicles that are built or have been adapted to form part of an articulated vehicle
semi-trailers
horseboxes with a gross weight of more than 3,500kg
‘A’ frame trailers and converter dollies manufactured on or after 1 January 1979
trailers with an unladen weight of more than 1,020kg with powered braking systems (instead of standard overrun brakes and as well as the required parking brake)
all public service vehicles with more than 8 passenger seats - not including the driver’s seat

The vast majority of trailers under 3500kg are overrun brakes. So it's N/A for you.
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Gazz
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PostPosted: 20:05 - 27 Oct 2016    Post subject: Re: Trailer laws Reply with quote

doggone wrote:
Gazz wrote:

Will the laws be different for towing other cars on an A frame?


It would be over the 750kg(?) weight, you would need to take a test now., also what car is it - there will be a stated maximum for how much it can tow.
Could be up to 3.5 tons for big pickups and Landrovers but far less for more regular cars. It's related to the weight of the vehicle.


Ford Mondeo mk3.
Got trailers on my licence.
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J4mes
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PostPosted: 20:11 - 27 Oct 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

And you don't "need" a licence to tow over 750\KG anyway, you need to have an outfit where the kerb weight of the towing vehicle is more than the gross weight of the trailer and the combination gross weight is less than 3500KG.

so an 1800KG kerb weight car could tow a 1699KG gross weight trailer without the need to take the B+E test. Obviously providing the vehicle allows that type of train weight or weight combination.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 20:55 - 27 Oct 2016    Post subject: Re: Trailer laws Reply with quote

Gazz wrote:
Do they need arches for covering the wheels?

Yes.

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1986/1078/regulation/63/made
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techsnap
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PostPosted: 21:08 - 27 Oct 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

J4mes wrote:
And you don't "need" a licence to tow over 750\KG anyway, you need to have an outfit where the kerb weight of the towing vehicle is more than the gross weight of the trailer and the combination gross weight is less than 3500KG.

so an 1800KG kerb weight car could tow a 1699KG gross weight trailer without the need to take the B+E test. Obviously providing the vehicle allows that type of train weight or weight combination.


Not quite...

Without B+E, you can tow a trailer over 750kg where the following apply:

- Kerb weight of car is higher than the Maximum Permissible weight (MTPLM) of trailer, AND
- Combined MAXIMUM vehicle weights (ie GVW of car and MTPLM of trailer) is below 3,500kg

Also, you need to be within the 'gross train weight' specified by the car manufacturer.
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Copycat73
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PostPosted: 10:02 - 28 Oct 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

I found this which maybe of some use ...

DVLA INF30
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MCN
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PostPosted: 17:16 - 28 Oct 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

You get a load of info on towing caravan site too.

You cannot use the lane nearest the central reservation of dual carriageways or motorways
Speed limit is 50 in A roads and 60 on Dual carriageways and motorways.

YOu need to ensure the load is secure or you may get a tug and a fine for insecure loading. And you might loose some valuable junk too
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weasley
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PostPosted: 08:57 - 29 Oct 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

MCN wrote:
You cannot use the lane nearest the central reservation of dual carriageways or motorways


You can not use the right hand lane on a 3-or-more laned dual carriageway or motorway.

MCN wrote:
Speed limit is 50 in A roads and 60 on Dual carriageways and motorways.


The national speed limit is 50 on single carriageways, regardless of their category.
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tarlott
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PostPosted: 09:03 - 29 Oct 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

When adding a tow ball you are modifying the vehicle, so you are required to advise your insurance company. Generally, in doing so, they are then aware that you may be using it to tow with and will automatically cover what you are towing. Like anything else, if you don't advise them it could invalidate your vehicle insurance.
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Gazz
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PostPosted: 11:06 - 30 Oct 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

tarlott wrote:
When adding a tow ball you are modifying the vehicle, so you are required to advise your insurance company. Generally, in doing so, they are then aware that you may be using it to tow with and will automatically cover what you are towing. Like anything else, if you don't advise them it could invalidate your vehicle insurance.


Shit, thanks for posting that. I've told my insurance that it had no modifications. Didn't even give the towbar a thought until you mentioned it.
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groovylee
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PostPosted: 12:13 - 30 Oct 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

On the subject of a frames or towing dollies - be careful. It's a massively grey area when it comes to whether the towed car needs to be insured/MOTd/taxed or not.

I never dug far enough into it to get definitive answers, but tread carefully Thumbs Up
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B5234FT
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PostPosted: 10:01 - 31 Oct 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

You must tell your car insurer that you intend to use the car for towing - they cover the third party liability.

If you want to cover the trailer and its contents you're looking at "goods in transit" insurance, but that tends to be a commercial thing

A frames are total different as they are legal only for recovery to the nearest safe place and cannot be used for long distance towing at all.
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groovylee
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PostPosted: 11:06 - 31 Oct 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

B5234FT wrote:


A frames are total different as they are legal only for recovery to the nearest safe place and cannot be used for long distance towing at all.


oh they can...... but they have to have brakes fitted and other caveats - i.e overrun brake setup, you can buy these specifically for the purpose

otherwise, every single motorhome towing a smart car is breaking the law, and they're not.
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B5234FT
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PostPosted: 12:11 - 31 Oct 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

groovylee wrote:
B5234FT wrote:


A frames are total different as they are legal only for recovery to the nearest safe place and cannot be used for long distance towing at all.


oh they can...... but they have to have brakes fitted and other caveats - i.e overrun brake setup, you can buy these specifically for the purpose

otherwise, every single motorhome towing a smart car is breaking the law, and they're not.


As fair as I know, and dont take this as gospel:

The use of Wheeled A frames for recovery is acceptable, but not otherwise, as the vehicle leaves an unbraked axle on the road. Doesnt matter if the A frame itself is braked in this instance. This sort of thing:

https://www.ripleyrecovery.com/Gallery_files/Dis-Dolly.jpg

The AA et al. have a dispensation for theirs as they arent counted as a 'trailer' due to being permanently coupled to the vehicle, which is why they are folded and stored inside the back of the van

https://www.bits4vits.co.uk/130316/DSCN2219.jpg

A frames as used by motorhomes use all four wheels of the car being towed and come with a system to activate the vehicles brakes, thus ensuring all axles on the road are braked (as all cars towed are generally over 750kg), but they require extensive mods to the vehicle

https://www.smart-tow.com/

https://www.smart-tow.com/img/2011/P10960s.jpg

As usual however, people dont do their research, see a campervan towing a car and go "must be fine then" and crack on without the proper braking etc, or use dollies to tow their trackday car around the country and this then gets propogated on forums with the "done it for years, it'll be fine mate" attitude to road laws.
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G
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PostPosted: 18:08 - 02 Nov 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Even if it was under 750kg, the car being towed would require a braking system I believe. I have wondered if you had a kit car and took the engine out and plates off, you could just claim it was a trailer.

There are some systems that require relatively little adaptation, but it's still not cheap.
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B5234FT
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PostPosted: 23:22 - 02 Nov 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think there is some regulation about max axle separation
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Copycat73
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PostPosted: 10:23 - 03 Nov 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

G wrote:
Even if it was under 750kg, the car being towed would require a braking system I believe. I have wondered if you had a kit car and took the engine out and plates off, you could just claim it was a trailer.

There are some systems that require relatively little adaptation, but it's still not cheap.


that would depend on the ULW of the towing vehicle .... a transit could pull 1000kg MAM trailer... un braked.
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G
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PostPosted: 10:34 - 03 Nov 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="Copycat73"
that would depend on the ULW of the towing vehicle .... a transit could pull 1000kg MAM trailer... un braked.[/quote]
Citation please?

https://www.gov.uk/towing-with-car/towing-equipment
Quote:

Quote:
Trailer brakes


Any trailer weighing over 750kg, including its load, must have a working brake system.

Some smaller trailers also have brakes, although these are optional.

Any brakes on a trailer or caravan must be in good working order.
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groovylee
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PostPosted: 11:38 - 03 Nov 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

B5234FT wrote:
correct stuff


totally agree with you mate, but this is where grey areas slip in, like the difference between a towing dolly, and an A frame.

personally, i wouldn't use either, i prefer a decent trailer Thumbs Up
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Copycat73
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PostPosted: 12:18 - 03 Nov 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

G wrote:
Copycat73 wrote:

that would depend on the ULW of the towing vehicle .... a transit could pull 1000kg MAM trailer... un braked.

Citation please?


The use of “dollies” is intended for the recovery of broken down vehicles, not for the transportation of a vehicle from “A” to “B”. Under Regulation 83 of C&U a motor car is permitted to tow two trailers when one of them is a towing implement and the other is secured to and either rests on or is suspended from the implement. When used for recovering broken down vehicles “dollies” are exempt from having an operational braking system fitted, provided that the towing vehicle is capable of meeting the minimum prescribed braking requirements for the combination.
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G
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PostPosted: 12:31 - 03 Nov 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh, sorry; I didn't realise you were talking about for the special case of recover, as opposed to normal towing.

Someone I know once towed a car about 200 miles from the address on the V5 to another location for 'recovery' purposes. They were passed by a traffic car that wasn't bothered.
I believe that the details mention 'to a safe location' for this exception.
Also often done by people collecting vehicles from auctions etc.
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