So is this a feasible idea or another rainpal in the making?

[Jmoan]

I was looking around monkey bikes and stumbled on this "product".

[Polarbear]

I suppose someone would do it for the lulz, but I do have to ask why would you?
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[Beehive Bedlam]

I'd just buy an msx.

[dydey90]

Anybody got £415 plus shipping to find out?
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[Snowdonia Rider]

It would still be better to put a 160cc engine in it. Faster, cheaper and less obvious the bike is suped up.
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[Ste]

I see your DIY bolt on super charger kit and raise you a dragon dating simulator:

"You have been selected as one of the humans to travel to the world of dragons in a cultural exchange program. While you are only getting to know this strange, yet somewhat familiar land, it will be up to you and the friends you make to uncover a conspiracy that threatens this newly discovered world... and in the process, maybe even find love."

Now that is a feasible idea worthy of crowdfunding. Much better than anything Aaron your Adams could ever come up with!!

https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/dragon-dating-simulator-a-visual-novel#/

Should be awesome as long as the dragons have detachable wiper blades.

[G]

WHY?

When you can just get a bigger engine for not much at all and slot it in - a while ago I bought a complete pit bike with a 160cc 4 valve for £500.

Now, stick it on a 190cc and it might make sense - but these tend to be pushing the limits anyway I believe - certainly the gearboxes are often a bit fragile (which is why they only have 4 gears max generally.)

[V2]

I can see why!

Because if you don't change the cc of the bike its still a moped inittt

(yes I know its not)

[Ariel Badger]

Note that every illustration is in CAD and not RL, I doubt the product exists as anything other than a concept.
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[G]

The picture of the charger unit it's self seems to be real.

It's also referenced on a forum over two years ago, so not made much progress.

It should be noted that the monkeybike and CRF50 lot do spend their money on some pretty ridiculous tat, so could possibly have a market.

[stinkwheel]

Superchargers do work on small bikes. Italjet made a supercharged scooter that was a total flying machine.

Looks like a mechanically powered, pull-through supercharger they've designed there. If they make it, no reason it shouldn't work.

It's a better concept than the electric fan things people were (and probably still are) flogging to credulous teenagers.
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[chris-red]

I'm convinced.


https://s-charger.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/Page-04-Bike_06.jpg
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[chris-red]

[G]

[Teflon-Mike]

It looks like a very small screw or 'roots' type compressor. This is the 'traditional' type of 'supercharger' as used on the infamous Bentley 'Blower' in the 1930's, and beloved of American Drag racers since the 50's. It's a wonderful contraption, two screws with reducing 'pitch' rotate in close proximity to each other, sucking air into the gap between them and squashing it as its pushed down the gap between them..

Main virtue of the design is that it delivers as constant flow of air, and with just the shafts rotating, without rubbing do it without any great efficiency losses, as you would have in a 'reciprocating piston pump', working like an engine, sucking n the down stroke, quashing on the up, and the screw type blower doesn't necessarily need the 'valving' to control flow like a piston pump.

'Problem' with screw compressors is their range of efficiency; they rely on very close tolerances of the screws to stop compressed air 'back-flowing' past the 'lobes' of the screws. So, traditionally, they work best at a large scale, and in 'plant' compressors, operating over a very narrow range or screw speeds, can be wonderfully efficient for delivering very large volumes of air at very high pressure.

To supercharge a petrol engine, you don't necessarily want a particularly high pressure delivery; plant compressors mght be delivering 100's of CFM of air at anything up to maybe 180psi, or well over 10bar; you might only want 15psi or so to supercharge an engine.

So, on the American V8', they would use a small plant compressor but gear it down from crank speed, maybe 1/2 or 1/3, which lowers the screw speeds, and reduces the range of screw speeds proportionally, so that the blower runs at screw speeds much closer to a fixed speed, whilst taking air off it at much lower pressure than the screw could deliver, get the volume from the 'over-sizing' of the supercharger to start with.

This problem of 'scale' was always the bug bear of a screw type compressor; they work best on big, low reving engines, where you can over size the blower and gear down to get the required flow rate.

Heading through history then, few have ever got one to work well on engines under 1000cc or so, and even there, it's often been questionable. In the 1980's, in counter point to the vogue of turbo tech, a British company ISTR called 'Sprintex', took out patents on a 'new' type of screw compressor; that was supposed to get over a lot of the issues of 'scale', something to do with 'close tolerance 3d profiled screws'. I may be wrong, but I have a feeling that the Lancia Delta, rally car, used a Sprinted supercharger in its super-boost set up to over come lag from over size turbo's; and that the Spritex patents were what a begat the Mercedes Kompressors and the supercharged BMW mini... That aside, development of the screw type supercharger has made them more practical for smaller displacement engines, down to around..... oh..... 1.5l.......

SO! fifty years of evolution, and they can make them production car viable... but still cant really make them work on anything much under 1000cc still....

How big's this monkey bike engine again? 50cc its about as small as they get, and its a relatively high revving engine, makes peak power at about 9ooo rpm. almost the complete opposite of what has traditionally responded well to a screw type blower.

As a challenge for a screw compressor designer, its certainly taking the technology to the extreme & challenges are certainly there to be tackled. It's certainly 'viable', questions whether it would be practicable.

On that suggestion, as has already been said, you'd likely get a lot more bang from your buck just making the motor bigger, to pump more charge and make more power. The only major benefit of supercharging such a small motor would be to get round competition or legislative regulations, that limit engine displacement.

It would likely be far more practicable to use another type of compressor, either a turbine, geared directly off the crank (as Peugeot Jetforce scooter used AFAIK), or conventional 'Turbo'; or a positive displacement reciprocating 'piston' compressor, as commonly used in smaller 'plant' compressors, used in work-shop's that scale down as far as the tiny 'desk-top' compressors artists use for air-brushes.

It's an interesting concept, and certainly a challenging 'project', BUT.. ways to skin cats, its probably not got a lot going for it beyond the academic challenges involved in making it 'work' and work as effectively as just boring the thing out from 50cc to say 90!
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[Ariel Badger]

It does look like a Roots derived unit, a vane type like a Shorrocks would work a lot better with a small engine.
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[Hahadumball]

superchargerfriend is a scam
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[Ariel Badger]

It is a vane type, the bitt that looked Roots is just a plenum. https://s-charger.com/50cc-supercharger/
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[Teflon-Mike]

[dydey90]

[Ariel Badger]

[Polarbear]

[Codemonkey]

For what its worth, superchargers can be made to work with very small engines.

A Japanese company called O.S Engines used to make a 20cc four stroke glow (methanol) engine with what I believe was a roots type supercharger fitted. At the time I had a normally aspirated version of the same engine and I seem to recall it producing something like 2.01PS whereas the supercharged version delivered 2.5PS, so a decent improvement in power for not much weight gain.


A video of said engine can be seen here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2WybD_N8cSg
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