Azoth
Brolly Dolly
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msob
Derestricted Danger
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Azoth
Brolly Dolly
Joined: 07 Jul 2016
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 Posted: 00:39 - 08 Dec 2016  Post subject: |
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I went by the fact that it's an MC06, while the Rebel and the CB were MC05. This list says it's from the CM:
https://www.motorcyclespareparts.eu/honda-parts/honda-model-prefix.aspx
There were some CMs in Britain, but the CB was more common.
I would get on the blower with David Silver with the engine number to be 100% sure. It's possible that this engine was fitted in several Honda bikes made in the UK, and that its fittings mean that even though it's different from MC05, you might be able to fit it to other Honda 250 bikes.
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Teflon-Mike
tl;dr
Joined: 01 Jun 2010
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Posted: 05:48 - 08 Dec 2016  Post subject: |
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It's a Benley Engine.
233cc denotes it's out of a 250 model. CD, CM, CB.
CD200 wasn't supplanted by the CD250 until about 1990, when the CB 'two-fifty' came along, so if it's any earlier, it'll likely be from a CM, not that it matters much.
All have 360 timed cranks, both slugs up and down together, with single trigger, lost-spark ignition; which on a 233, should be 12v and CDi; 'square' 53x53mm bore & stroke OTMH, with low compression pistons and soft timed cam. (all common across all the 53mm bore 360 Benley engines, which is all of them!)
It will almost certainly have run on a single carb on branch manifold; probably a PD26 slide carb, and it will deliver about 18bhp, if the bores aren't buggered and the cam chain slack as a tarts nicker elastic.
YES, you could fit twin-carbs... Only the CMX250 and CD250U, of the Benley family ran twin carbs; 26mm CV's, whch are still available from China off e-bay.... and are cheaper than an overhaul kit from DSS... but you better take a deep breath before asking how much the manifolds to mount them are!
Dont expect any more power for the effort though; they still only made about 20bhp!
Trying to mix and match and make something work on it from the small honda parts bin..... good luck!
They can be mounted with twin Kehin PD slide carbs... but you will struggle to get manfolds to mount them. Best 'bet' (though I have done it, so not such a bet!) would be to use CB125T manifolds.... good luck finding a pair of them!
If you get them from a 125 mono-shock (Super-Dream), they angle the carbs 'in' from the center line, and may 'foul' on a T-Shock spine frame. Earlier T-Shock manifolds splay the carbs out fro the center line to clear the frame spine.. even better luck trying to find a pair of them! And you'll need the matching carbs for the manifolds; Super-Dream carbs have a flexible choke link; splay them you wont get the choke to work, and flapping choke flap on the disconnected RH carb will likely screw any attempt to set them up!
You really are best off mounting a single carb on branch manifold, they are easier to source, easier to set up, and you can more easily adapt the flange to mount alternative carbs.
Engine mounts, are the generic benley pattern; the motor will fit into... err.. CB125T mono-shock, CD125, CM125; CD175, CD185, CD200 CM200, CD250, CM250 & CB 'Two-Fifty' frames, bolt for bolt. As well as the Chinky Benly copy twins, like AJS. Any of the 12v e-start models, really.
CB125T 'twin-shock' that was a 6v kick-start model, wont take the e-start benley motors without a bit of met-fab to the down-tube adapter bracket to clear the starter; AFAIK, so likely could be persuaded to slot into earlier 6v models of other variants in similar way, or by ditching the e-start.
Patern's the same as the bottom end of most of the small singles; it would likely slot into a CG125 frame, a CB125S, XL125, & XL185, XR125, 125 City fly, etc etc etc, as well as many many Chinky chassis; intended to accept Benley, CG or XL derived engines;
Again, some adaptation around either the front adapter bracket and or cylinder head stay may be required, most hassles likely to be found around carb mounting / clearance and matching electrics, and the afore mentioned carb angle/clearances.
They are not a particularly eager engine; peak power is delivered at only about 8,500rpm or so; though they do have quite a lot of low down tractability.
I stuffed the 200 motor, with Twin carbs in a 125 super-dream chassis; it was a bit more 'brisk' off the line, but without much if any more power, and a lower rev limit, it wasn't much f any quicker up top; was nice to be able to 'drive' out of corners though, and not have to keep the thing on the boil to make it move, like the 125 motor that revs to 13K+.... and which can make as much or more power as the 233 motors with the hotter 305 cam from the orignal t-shock model.. which is even rarer than decent coditi carb rubbers, and wont work in a 233 motor due to being 180 (one up one down) timed.
Hardy little engines they can return impressive mpg on a sigle carb; and they are reasonably robust... they dont really make enough power to do themselves any damage! But the 360 crank versions do shake a bit. Cam chain arrangement is a bit wampy; its a 'self tensioning' manuall adjusted thing... prone to jamming. You do have to adjust it, by winding off the lock nut thats a ball ache to get at with teh carb(s) on, and is 'supposed' to tension itself whe you release it.. but usually doesn't. begging some wiggling of the bladed from the rocker housing! Often neglected, or worse, not neglected and muggered up leading to rattles and loss of power as valve timing retards.
Bore wear is common niggle; most of thee have either been run into the ground as miser mile commuters by now, or they have sat derelict for years n a shed with the piston rngs corroding nto the piston grooves, and or, one pair of valves half open and the seats rusting.
If you intend pressing it into useful service; a top end rebuild is probably on the card.. before, during or after... if you dont do it before, murphey will rub his hands in glee to get his cut and see you chasig anomolouse carb and ignitio problems for weeks, and never be able to bottom them, and then the blue fugg wll start to follow you, as it starts burning oil.
Chinky barel kts for the 125's are commonly available at not bad prices, about £120 on e-bay; 233 kits I have seen, and don't think they were much more money; but not as common.
Add that to the cost of carbs, then whatever you do about exhausts, and electrics to make it a 'runner'..... and then what you have to pay to find a rolling chassis to stuff it in..... err... that gives me an oy-dee-ya..... I MIGHT just have one of them!...pm me! ..... but, you are likely NOT looking at an insignificant amount of money to make anything out of it...
And I WOULD suggest, its a bit like Irshman's directions... I'm not so sure I would be wanting to be starting from here! As to whether it would be worth the effort!
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Current Bikes:'Honda VF1000F' ;'CB750F2N' ;'CB125TD ( 6 3 of em!)'; 'Montesa Cota 248'. Learner FAQ's:= 'U want to Ride a Motorbike! Where Do U start?' |
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