Euro4, london emissions bollox

[Rogerborg]

No idea. Note that there are motorcycles pictured among the chargeable vehicles, so it may have been a last minute attack of common bloody sense.

Or I may be misreading it, or it may be deliberate deception to try and avoid objections (then, SURPRISE!), or just a rogue minion having a laugh.

I'd ask MAG, but they're saying they can't even get a meeting with the Assistant Deputy Backup bosses at TfL or Sadiq Towers.

Mind you, if all bikes do remain exempt, I'm sure they'll claim credit for it sharp enough.
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Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[Azoth]

[Rogerborg]

It is a puzzler. The words seem clear enough, but they explicitly contradict what we've been hearing. I certainly wouldn't rush out and buy a 2006 bike on the back of it.
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Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[Amber Phoenix]

Nah, nah, nah, you're mixing up the two charges...

So:-
Under consultation:-
The London Emissions Surcharge (ES charge, or formally called T-Charge).
https://consultations.tfl.gov.uk/environment/air-quality-consultation-phase-2/?cid=airquality-consultation#Emissions Surcharge
Possibly due to come in this year, covering same area as current congestion zone. Will run until ULEZ charge comes in (2019/20). Motorcycles will be except from this. Other non Euro4 vehicles will pay £10 (on top of current congestion charge).

Confirmed:
ULEZ, covering central London (current congestion charge zone). Begins 2020. Bikes registered before 1st July 2007 will have to pay £12.50 / day.
https://tfl.gov.uk/modes/driving/ultra-low-emission-zone

Also under consultations:
Starting ULEZ in 2019.
Extending ULEZ to area within North/South circulars, possibly in 2019 or maybe later on.
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Beginner Biker Adventures Blog
Yamaha FZ6 S2 2007

[grr666]

12.50 a day to likely come back and find your bike has vanished. Bargain.
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Currently enjoying products from Ford, Mazda and Yamaha
Ste wrote: Avatars are fine, it's signatures that need turning off.

[Rogerborg]

Aaaaah, that makes sense. It's hard to keep track of the number or sequence of dicks that they want to shove into motorists.
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Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[Kris]

"Sorry Officer, what was that? My number plate appears to have fallen off? Oh yes, but I have it in my jacket and will reattach it when I get to work.."

5 days a week @ £12.50 = £62.50
4 weeks of that = £250.00

What was the fine for no plate again?
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NSR125RR - ZXR750H1 - ZX9R E1 - GSF600S - GSF600SK3 - VFR400-NC30 - SV1000N - ST1100-R - CBR900RR-R - GSF1200SK5 - GSF600SK1 - VFR1200FA - GSXR1000K2 - ZZR1400 D8F
www.prisonplanet.com

[Amber Phoenix]

[M.C]

[Azoth]

Thanks for explaining that Arfa. You're right - the ES is just an interim charge that's being proposed in the run-up to ULEZ, probably as part of the same political tactic as the suggestion to bring ULEZ forward to 2019. The more of a sense of haste, the more of a hard-sell it is, the more irrelevant the 'consultations' are and the more of a foregone conclusion it seems to be. Whether it actually is such a foregone conclusion remains to be seen. However, there's no organised opposition at this time.

With regard to why this is being proposed, and the inevitable congestion problem on the outskirts of the ULEZ zone that M.C pointed out, it really does look like some powerful and influential group has some 'common purpose' here to phase out privatised motorised transport for all but the most elite of the elite. Motor cars and motor bikes (any sort, however old and polluting, as long as you pay) for the shiny-heeled pantaloon, and Easyjet holiday return flight charity collection box guilt-tripping over kitten deaths in Africa for the plebs. All amid a deluge of pseudo-science and a lack of evidence for the sum polluting effect of motorcycles in the city of London.

What really motivates all this? Without getting too political on the differing attitudes towards disposable income on the right and left sides of the divide, it's human nature, above all. Somewhere along the line it became incorrect to 'hate' - a sort of forced, lovingly pacifist tyranny became the rule, and this petulant, spiteful and vindictive anti-motorcycle measure is just one of many expressions of those energies that in earlier times used to find more natural and honest expression. You reach a certain age, and all you can handle is the truth. When you look at Youtube motovloggers weaving past the stationary, expensive cars of the rich and idle in central London, making a huge amount of noise and making cyclists and 'green' cyclist urbanite malcontents shriek and jump, you can see where this is all going. What people say and what people really think are two different things. If you ride a bike, especially a good one, they hate you, mostly because of envy. Their plan for you is to suffer on TfL buses and underground trains, getting sick, ripped off and delayed by strikes and overcrowding. In the future they want you to spend that £200 on your shoes rather than new shocks. That £500 on a Kashmir coat rather than a pair of new tyres. Your dirty bike doesn't have any business getting past their Rolls. Same old story as 20th century biking. The world didn't change.
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Safety in numbers

[Kal]

If it is registration based does that mean my early 80's q plate will be exempt?

I notice that my bug (should I ever get it finished) will be exempt under the 40 year classic ruling, and my Superdream will be exempt shortly afterwards. (Should I for any reason decide I want to ride all the way to London on my Superdream, and actually make it)

Engaging SMUG mode.


In all honesty my Volkswagen's emissions are pretty shoddy, we just don't lie about them.
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Kal...
I Like To Hoon It Hoon It I Like To Hoon It Hoon It I Like To Hoon It Hoon It Ya Like To (HOON IT!).
1984 GB250 Clubman,1983 CB250N Superdream, 1999 GPZ500S

[Azoth]

[Kal]

Damn it. It actually picks up my bike as registered March 2007 (grey market import) so not except by a matter of months. How rude!, However it assumes it was built then, which suggests any Q plate registered after June 2007 will be fine.

It is almost enough to convince me to reregister the bike under the year of manufacture.
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Kal...
I Like To Hoon It Hoon It I Like To Hoon It Hoon It I Like To Hoon It Hoon It Ya Like To (HOON IT!).
1984 GB250 Clubman,1983 CB250N Superdream, 1999 GPZ500S