nsr 125 electric start wont engage

[david451]

Hi guys, my problem looks as follow: i push the electric start button,it seems to work fine but doesnt seems to engage the motor.

The battery looks fine and the bike starts normally if i push it, where should i start to look? im completelly clueless about where is the starter motor or how does it works.

[jaffa90]

Try jump leads from a good battery.

[david451]

the battery voltages are all ok...

[neptune8]

The battery voltage may look fine, when battery is not under load. 12.8 volts or higher=fully charged. What matters is what that voltage drops to during starter operation. Lower than 10 volts = duff battery. As advised above try jump leads from a car battery. If no better, instead of connecting negative lead to battery terminal, hold it directly to starter motor case, and try again. If it works like that, you have a faulty earth connection to starter. If non of the above works, and starter motor spins without turning engine, likely suspect is starter clutch.
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[david451]

"and starter motor spins without turning engine, likely suspect is starter clutch."

This is exactly what is happening, im sorry i have some troubles explaining myselft in english , the starter motor spins fast but looks like it isnt engaging whereever it must engage, i measured the battery voltages just in case and they are all ok.

My problem is i dont know where that "starter cluth" is, ¿its on the left side or on the right side of the bike? i checked the service manual but cant find exactly what im looking for

I have read that there is somekind of wheel that engages with neutral by inertia, so if this wheel isnt moving it doesnt engage with neutral and bike doesnt start....

[neptune8]

Do not worry about the starter clutch until you have completed other tests described. If the battery is faulty, as in not supplying enough amps, the starter will turn at less than its normal speed, and so it will not cause the starter clutch to engage, even if the starter clutch is OK. I am not familiar with your particular bike. The starter motor is a cylinder shaped object [ not being sarcastic]. One end [ often the one where the cables connect] is clearly visible. The other end has a shaft coming out [not visible]which engages with the starter clutch. Do not go there without a workshop manual and/ or some experience. Hope this helps.
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[skatefreak]

Battery on there first as it's much quicker/easier...

As its a centrifugal pinion, if its not spinning fast enough the starter will not catch the flywheel so it may be turning but not fast enough.

If its still not catching then the starter has to come off.

Its a common problem with the NSR starters, they are right in line to get drenched by water coming off the front wheel and if one of the seals on the electrical connectors goes (unlikely but can happen), you get water in there and it rusts up.

Alternator cover off (no oil in this side, might be water though ), two bolts below the flywheel and the starter will come out. From here you can oil she sh*t out of it and try free it off or undo the 3 long bolts to disassemble the starter (not to bad, just a little fiddly holding the brushes in whilst re-assembling, may be worth throwing some now ones in if they are getting low) to get better access.

Certainly a job I've done more than once but nothing to tricky

Let us know how you get on.

[david451]

I cant get my hands on the bike untill tuesday, dont have the right tools here atm.

"Its a common problem with the NSR starters, they are right in line to get drenched by water coming off the front wheel"

Thing is that latelly i have been trapped into rain more offen than not....

"Alternator cover off (no oil in this side, might be water though )"

So thats the left side of the bike i believe?

Well now that i have further clues i will take another look at bike service manual, ill put my hands dirty on tuesday or wednesday, will update this acordingly

[skatefreak]

Do you have a service manual for the bike?

The only reason I say there may be water in there was when I originally bought the bike, first winter and the starter crapped out on me, when I got the alternator cover off (gear lever side) there was a fair bit of water in there.

The starter had been fitted and the electrical fitting gasket was missing so water was dribbling in there, filling the starter which then started to flood that side of the engine. .

I spent a fair while trying to save the starter itself but I eventually had to get another as the corrosion was just to extensive .

I did wait almost a year until I found one on ebay, £15, just needed new brushes and it was as good as new! I got bump starting it down to an art *grins*.

[david451]

Yea i have a the service manual plus other documents, alains tips,electrics...let me know if u want any.

Man your water tale is scaryng the fuck out of me, i was forced to ride under rain a lot latelly and maybe the same happend to me.

Thing is i cant get the cover off untill i ride back to my home(35km) and now im scared to do further damage to alternator or so...that electrical parts with water doesnt sound good to me.

In ur bike the water started to get inside the gearbox? cause i changed my gearbox oil a little time back and it didnt have water inside.

Anyway, one last thing, which wheel is the one that moves by inertia when i push the start button? thx for the help btw!

[skatefreak]

Don't fret to much, the alternator section is sealed from the rest of the engine and the stator windings are sealed so not much harm will come of it... I neglected to sort it for a while and the whole flywheel was rusty ...

The final drive cog (smallest at the end) in the starter is the one that jumps out to engage the engine. The torque as the starter starts to turn pushes it forwards which engages it with the flywheel, when the starter stops pushing it moves back and disengages. It's fairly straight forward when you get it apart

[david451]

Ok guys, this is how it looks like:

mmm how to insert images?

https://postimg.org/image/3pp8ff2t9/

https://postimg.org/image/795991vf5/

well i dont get how to upload images so i will just place the urls...

it looks like there is no water inside after all, i need some guidance from here since i never did this before and dont wanna break anything, next step is to take alternator out? i need a special tool to take it off right?

Btw ichecked the battery again with engine off it measured 13.00 v

[alains]

everything looks perfect . do not listen the song of the sirens
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the worst day fishing is better than the best day working

[RhynoCZ]

[david451]

ahah guys are u serious? of course that the kill switch is "on"!

and alains, everything looks perfect but obviously its not! otherwise the engine would start

Okay i will try to extrat that small pinion below the alternator, god help me...

[RhynoCZ]

Well, you would not be the first nor last to forget the switch.
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'87 Honda XBR 500, '96 Kawasaki ZX7R P1, '90 Honda CB-1, '88 Kawasaki GPz550, MZ 150 ETZ
'95 Mercedes-Benz w202 C200 CGI, '98 Mercedes-Benz w210 E200 Kompressor

[neptune8]

Just a thought. As I said, I am not familiar with your bike, but it looks as if your starter pinion may work in the same way as one on a car. This type uses a bendix pinion. If this is the case, then before stripping the bike further, try soaking the starter motor pinion[cog wheel] in WD 40 or similar. You have nothing to lose
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Enjoy yourself, its later than you think

[jaffa90]

[david451]

Well i found the culprit, below the alternator it is the starter motor, i took it off the bike and pushed the start button, it had a lot of trouble moving back and forward.......

I oiled the pinion the best i could, i was going to dismantle the whole piece for oiling it but one of the screws was glued like cement, so at the end i oiled and greased just the visible part of the pinion.

Good news is its working again, bad news is the pinion wasnt bouncing back and forward very well even after oiling it, so i guess it just at the end of its lifetime, what scared me off is the posibility of it not disengaging the flywheel and destroy the engine...

[jaffa90]

I use to clean them with wd40 because oil/grease attracts dust and then sticks again.
Nowadays you have dry lube after cleaning it.

[RhynoCZ]

Does nobody use copper grease anymore?
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'87 Honda XBR 500, '96 Kawasaki ZX7R P1, '90 Honda CB-1, '88 Kawasaki GPz550, MZ 150 ETZ
'95 Mercedes-Benz w202 C200 CGI, '98 Mercedes-Benz w210 E200 Kompressor

[alains]

that's the most intelligent thing i've heard since this post is open !
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the worst day fishing is better than the best day working

[jaffa90]

Well go on then but only a thin layer.