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Worn Rear Monoshock Pivot

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MrCawdell
Derestricted Danger



Joined: 07 Apr 2017
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PostPosted: 12:09 - 15 Jun 2017    Post subject: Worn Rear Monoshock Pivot Reply with quote
Morning BCFers

I'm looking at picking up a new bike tomorrow but it appears from the old MOT of last year it had an advisory for a worn, but not excessively worn, monoshock pivot.

It's on a Kawasaki ER6F.

Can anyone advise on the cost involved and time involved to fix this, should it be an issue come the next MOT?

Thanks!
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Commuter_Tim
World Chat Champion



Joined: 09 May 2013
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PostPosted: 19:36 - 15 Jun 2017    Post subject: Re: Worn Rear Monoshock Pivot Reply with quote
MrCawdell wrote:
Morning BCFers

I'm looking at picking up a new bike tomorrow but it appears from the old MOT of last year it had an advisory for a worn, but not excessively worn, monoshock pivot.

It's on a Kawasaki ER6F.

Can anyone advise on the cost involved and time involved to fix this, should it be an issue come the next MOT?

Thanks!

Google suggests the pivot is structurally welded to the swingarm.
https://www.asianconnection71.com/ER6nSwingarmWeightSSR.jpg

So this noob would guess it's either replacement swingarm, or BodyGuard bodge.
Let's wait and see what the more educated have to say about welding structural frame parts.

Even I'm capable of swapping out a swingarm, so cost aside, the time that would take isn't a hugely significant concern.
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The above post is most likely nonsensical.

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sickpup
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Joined: 21 Apr 2004
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PostPosted: 21:58 - 15 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
The build quality on these is dire, there is to my mind excessive play from new. My 08 model had the top and bottom bushes on the rear shock replaced under warranty and there was still play.

Assuming the Bush is in decent condition the best thing to do is shim the through bolt with a steel beer can. I did mine for its first MOT and it's been fine ever since.
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MrCawdell
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Joined: 07 Apr 2017
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PostPosted: 22:49 - 15 Jun 2017    Post subject: Re: Worn Rear Monoshock Pivot Reply with quote
Commuter_Tim wrote:
MrCawdell wrote:
Morning BCFers

I'm looking at picking up a new bike tomorrow but it appears from the old MOT of last year it had an advisory for a worn, but not excessively worn, monoshock pivot.

It's on a Kawasaki ER6F.

Can anyone advise on the cost involved and time involved to fix this, should it be an issue come the next MOT?

Thanks!

Google suggests the pivot is structurally welded to the swingarm.
https://www.asianconnection71.com/ER6nSwingarmWeightSSR.jpg

So this noob would guess it's either replacement swingarm, or BodyGuard bodge.
Let's wait and see what the more educated have to say about welding structural frame parts.

Even I'm capable of swapping out a swingarm, so cost aside, the time that would take isn't a hugely significant concern.


Appreciate this, had a look into it and even if i have to replace the whole swingarm then it's only around £50. I have small amounts of mechanical knowledge so maybe i'll be capable but i wont hold my breath too much Laughing
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MrCawdell
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Joined: 07 Apr 2017
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PostPosted: 22:50 - 15 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
sickpup wrote:
The build quality on these is dire, there is to my mind excessive play from new. My 08 model had the top and bottom bushes on the rear shock replaced under warranty and there was still play.

Assuming the Bush is in decent condition the best thing to do is shim the through bolt with a steel beer can. I did mine for its first MOT and it's been fine ever since.


I had read that Sakis have play in them from day one which makes me a little less concerned regarding the advisory. I wont pretend i know what you meant by the fix but if you have 2 minutes to quickly explain via pm itd be grateful as i'll get it done if it helps
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Commuter_Tim
World Chat Champion



Joined: 09 May 2013
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PostPosted: 00:11 - 16 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
MrCawdell wrote:
sickpup wrote:
Assuming the Bush is in decent condition the best thing to do is shim the through bolt with a steel beer can. I did mine for its first MOT and it's been fine ever since.


I had read that Sakis have play in them from day one which makes me a little less concerned regarding the advisory. I wont pretend i know what you meant by the fix but if you have 2 minutes to quickly explain via pm itd be grateful as i'll get it done if it helps


Sickpup is known for getting people to play the guessing game, so I will attempt to interpret in case he's feeling playful...
I believe he means pad the worn area around the bolt out with a sliver of beer can.
Sometimes I forget that Sickpup is an old geezer, they can fix everything on a bike with a beercan and a cereal box. Very Happy

Jokes aside, I gather he knows his bikes so probly worth a crack.
They don't disassemble on an MOT so they would certainly never know.

Very generalised summary of removing a swingarm:
Prop bike up
Remove brakes
Unbolt/Remove wheel and detach chain
Remove rear mudguard etc
Unbolt shock
Unbolt Swingarm

The only bit that isn't necessarily plain and simple is if you decide to replace the swingarm bearings, but that's not rocket science either.
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Robby
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Joined: 16 May 2002
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PostPosted: 09:08 - 16 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
It shouldn't be a swingarm replacement job. Assuming the shock has an eye type fitting at each end, then it will have a bush at each end (that can wear) and a bolt through that bush on the swingarm and on the frame.

The wear would be in either the bushes, or the bolts, both of which could be easily replaced.

The fun comes in when you replace the bolts and bushes and it's still loose, because the build quality/tolerances are shit. This is when you shim it.
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sickpup
Old Timer



Joined: 21 Apr 2004
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PostPosted: 09:27 - 16 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
Commuter_Tim wrote:
Sickpup is known for getting people to play the guessing game, so I will attempt to interpret in case he's feeling playful...


Its a thinking game not a guessing game but I was being straight forward there Shocked

Commuter_Tim wrote:
I believe he means pad the worn area around the bolt out with a sliver of beer can.


Precisely. You fill the space between the bolt and the bush with a rolled up tube of steel beer can.

Commuter_Tim wrote:
Sometimes I forget that Sickpup is an old geezer, they can fix everything on a bike with a beercan and a cereal box. Very Happy


Cool

Commuter_Tim wrote:
Jokes aside, I gather he knows his bikes so probly worth a crack.
They don't disassemble on an MOT so they would certainly never know.


Even for an MOT it is a perfectly valid repair. Unorthodox to todays way of thinking where everything is just replaced but valid nonetheless

Robby wrote:
It shouldn't be a swingarm replacement job. Assuming the shock has an eye type fitting at each end, then it will have a bush at each end (that can wear) and a bolt through that bush on the swingarm and on the frame.


These don't, the bolt rests on the swingarm hole.

Robby wrote:
The wear would be in either the bushes, or the bolts, both of which could be easily replaced.


Both are available as parts

Robby wrote:
The fun comes in when you replace the bolts and bushes and it's still loose, because the build quality/tolerances are shit. This is when you shim it.


I have a brand new top bolt and bush in the tool box that has more slop than one with 70,000miles on it. The tolerances are terrible on these.

All of this relies on the bottom bush being in good condition, if it isn't just get a engineering shop to replace it as it requires pressing out and the new pressing in.
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Rogerborg
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Joined: 26 Oct 2010
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PostPosted: 10:42 - 16 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
Mmm, as I intimated in a PM, Kawasaki are notorious for this. My old GPZ500 had a sloppy shock linkage with just 4000 miles on it.

I know it came up as an advisory last year but that may just have been an overly cautious tester or one that was looking out for it on a Kwak.

I'd fire it through another MOT first before deciding if you need to sort it.
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Ed Case
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Joined: 01 Mar 2009
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PostPosted: 17:52 - 16 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
sickpup wrote:
The build quality on these is dire, there is to my mind excessive play from new. My 08 model had the top and bottom bushes on the rear shock replaced under warranty and there was still play.

Assuming the Bush is in decent condition the best thing to do is shim the through bolt with a steel beer can. I did mine for its first MOT and it's been fine ever since.


That's exactly the mod I had to do on my 07 when the MOT fella failed the bike. The bottom pivot was fine but the top rubber/metal bush had sideplay so I spent an hour 'shimming-up' the mounting. Just winding the securing bolt tighter could well end-up stripping the thread in the frame and then you'll really be in the shit, the bracket is so rigid so as to make it virtually incompressible.
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kgm
World Chat Champion



Joined: 04 Jun 2015
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PostPosted: 18:30 - 16 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
My '10 plate ER6 with 16k has no play at all, I must have got lucky.. I recently discovered though that the lower mounting bolt was totally seized to the sleeve and the needle bearing wasn't in the best condition. I replaced them easily enough using a drawbolt set up for the needle bearing and top bush. Think I'll keep an eye on that and take it apart from a clean and grease occasionally from now on.

I don't think the guy who does my MOTs is very thorough, he just has a quick check round and makes sure all the lights/horn work then fires out a new certificate. Glad I don't have to deal with someone overly thorough Thumbs Up
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MrCawdell
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Joined: 07 Apr 2017
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PostPosted: 23:12 - 16 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
Rogerborg wrote:
Mmm, as I intimated in a PM, Kawasaki are notorious for this. My old GPZ500 had a sloppy shock linkage with just 4000 miles on it.

I know it came up as an advisory last year but that may just have been an overly cautious tester or one that was looking out for it on a Kwak.

I'd fire it through another MOT first before deciding if you need to sort it.


I managed to convince the seller to put it through an MOT tomorrow Roger it's just more curiosity to see if its a big fix or not but judging by the BCF grease monkeys it's not too bad at all. If it passes ill buy at agreed price and pickup sunday, if not i'll negotiate repairs into the price Smile

Appreciate all the replies guys!
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colink98
Could Be A Chat Bot



Joined: 27 Jun 2016
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PostPosted: 08:10 - 17 Jun 2017    Post subject: Reply with quote
my CBF failed for the just this reason.
turns out the whole bottom part of the shock has seized solid.
was a total bitch just getting it apart.

once apart the bolt hole had been elongated which in turn led to the play.

i brazed a line around the inside of the bolt hole and then filed it down to a snug fit.
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