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DVLA no longer issuing V5Cs for cat A/B write offs

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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 11:25 - 04 Jan 2016    Post subject: DVLA no longer issuing V5Cs for cat A/B write offs Reply with quote

Extracted from a General thread as I suspect this one is going to come up a lot and it'll be easier to find here.

It has never been and is not now an offence to use any category of "written off" vehicle on the road, as long as it's roadworthy, insured and taxed. Possession of a V5C is neither here nor there. However, in practice, you need a valid V5C to buy VED for the vehicle, and nobody in their right mind is going to be buying from you if you can't produce a V5C.

Previously, DVLA would issue a new V5C on change of keeper for any "written-off" vehicle, regardless of the "category" of write off.

That's now changed. Since October 26th 2015, insurers must now when writing off a vehicle:

Arrow Inform the Secretary of State (hereafter DVLA).
Arrow Destroy the V5C if it's in their possession, regardless of the category of write-off.
Arrow Tell the DVLA whether, in their sole and apparently non-appealable opinion, the vehicle is "suitable for repair". In insurance parlance, category C and D are repairable, A and B are not.

Where the DVLA have been told that the vehicle is not repairable, they now will not issue a V5C for it, to either to the existing keeper or to any new keeper.

The tl;dr versions are:

If you intend to buy a vehicle for use on the road, or intend to sell it on, you must now check that it's not a category A or B insurance write off.[*]

If your vehicle is written off and you intend to use it or to sell it on, press for a cat C or D, for example by raising the possibility of buying it back if and only if it's so categorised. The insurance examiner isn't independent or State funded, he's just another cog in the money machine.

If you are issued an A or B write off, then reality has finally caught up with what insurers have long believed to be true, and it's now much harder to continue using it on the road legally.


The new Regulations:

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2015/1657/regulation/7/made


[*]
At the time of writing, entering a vehicle's details into the "selling" part of autotrader and hitting "Next" will show the category of write-off:

https://selling.autotrader.co.uk

Karma to Paul Fzs for that tip.
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DrSnoosnoo
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PostPosted: 11:43 - 04 Jan 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wonder whether this would be tied into their online service of notification of change of keeper?

Would a message appear to say, ownership will not be transferred, we will not issue a V5c ?

I suppose it's a difficult one to test unless somebody has a recently cat A/B and will put up the "ownership" for a test.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 13:04 - 04 Jan 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very interesting question.

V5C has nothing to do with "ownership" though, it's about who's liable for VED (and insurance and parking penalties).

I expect (but do not know) that they'll be happy to accept the change of keeper because de facto the vehicle has most likely already changed hands. They just won't be issuing the new keeper with a V5C, although I'm sure they'll continue to issue blackmail demands over non-insured, non-SORNed vehicles.

Caveat emptor.
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weasley
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PostPosted: 13:36 - 04 Jan 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

So what about a bike that is 'fatally' damaged but the keeper intends to keep it after the incident, fix it up and carry on regardless. They still have the V5C. Does it become an issue at VED renewal time? Or as and when the bike is sold on?

I guess the aim is to keep dangerous vehicles off of the road, but surely the MoT should do this? I could fold my bike in two, not make a claim but straighten it up, return it to the road and nobody would be the wiser. Since when did insurers become arbiters of road safety and structural integrity?
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DrSnoosnoo
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PostPosted: 13:46 - 04 Jan 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:
...I expect (but do not know) that they'll be happy to accept the change of keeper because de facto the vehicle has most likely already changed hands. They just won't be issuing the new keeper with a V5C, although I'm sure they'll continue to issue blackmail demands over non-insured, non-SORNed vehicles...


Yes but No. In that when a change of keeper is processed, a new V5 would have to be produced to represent the change and to produce to the new keeper. With regard to the online system, it can only be done by the seller, so I'd assume the buyer is stood with them to enter their details. The DooVLA should then say, we won't be processing a change of keeper and thus producing any new V5 becoz it's got2 be off the road ... init. Or along those lines.
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CaNsA
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PostPosted: 14:10 - 04 Jan 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

This whole thing sounds like a plot to prevent people making insurance claims, but all the while still paying through the arse for a policy.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 15:09 - 04 Jan 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

CaNsA wrote:
This whole thing sounds like a plot to prevent people making insurance claims, but all the while still paying through the arse for a policy.

It sounds like it's making the insurance cartel's long held dream a reality: getting more written-off vehicles off the road so that they can't be claimed on again.


weasley wrote:
So what about a bike that is 'fatally' damaged but the keeper intends to keep it after the incident, fix it up and carry on regardless. They still have the V5C.

Note the part about insurers being required to destroy the V5C when they write off a vehicle. I don't know if handing over my V5C in return for a write-off payment is a condition of my insurance, but I expect it will increasingly become so.


weasley wrote:
Does it become an issue at VED renewal time?

Dunno. We'd need to try buying VED for a cat B and see.


weasley wrote:
I guess the aim is to keep dangerous vehicles off of the road, but surely the MoT should do this?

And that might make sense for cars, but we've seen bikes being cat-B'd for minor and fully repairable frame damage, and in one case damage to an integral footpeg hangar.

We're just going to have to see how it plays out in practice, but the landscape has changed.
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M.C
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PostPosted: 22:45 - 04 Jan 2016    Post subject: Re: DVLA no longer issuing V5Cs for cat A/B write offs Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:

I mentioned it twice previously in that thread *takes ball and goes home*

Someone on here discovered it ages ago but can't remember who.
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dydey90
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PostPosted: 16:57 - 05 Jan 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

If it helps, whenever I use the autotrader tool for checking a category, I use the registration of a Corsa that I wrote off in 2010 just to make sure it still works. If anybody else wants to use it, YJ52 WUO
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Last edited by dydey90 on 17:07 - 05 Jan 2016; edited 1 time in total
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 17:04 - 05 Jan 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well... not sure how that helps, except that it does confirm that neither https://www.vehicleenquiry.service.gov.uk/ and https://www.check-mot.service.gov.uk/ disclose write-offs. The former denies all knowledge of that vehicle, in fact. Mad
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Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
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M.C
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PostPosted: 20:48 - 05 Jan 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Also might be worth adding to your guide that the autotrader thing appears to only work on the desktop site (via a PC). On my phone and tablet it doesn't have the box pop-up that tells you it's a write-off.
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dydey90
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PostPosted: 22:04 - 08 Jan 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just went to check to prove you can see it on your phone, but my old Corsa now just shows "you cannot sell your car today". Must be because selling a Cat B is now officially naughty.
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Old Thread Alert!

There is a gap of 2 years, 265 days between these two posts...

tittymcarsefa...
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PostPosted: 12:38 - 30 Sep 2018    Post subject: Reply with quote

ahh shite, I've just starting getting my old cb-1 mot ready it was written off in early 2015 and I bought it back with the intention of using my second bike untill it was repaired (bought a reliant robin instead lol). it was just too expensive for parts rather than any structural damage.

I had claimed on the bike before when someone reversed into it knocking it up a bollard (both claims against churchill customers), so the inspector said he was putting a cat b on it to prevent future claims.

Still have the v5c in my name and the bike is on sorn just worried now what happens when I change address in few months.

It has a nice six digit plate on it too, A friend of mine tried buying the reg when i got knocked off the bike, i wish i would have let him have it now.
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MATTT
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PostPosted: 20:59 - 06 Oct 2018    Post subject: Van Reply with quote

Slightly non bike ....
My old 19 yr old van has just been written off for minor front damage ,they said over the phone the government has given them targets to get older vehicle off the road so mine was cat B so its only for parts.I pressed to get an inspection ,he said a few years ago it could have been repaired,i had someone ready to fix it lined up,but as it has a small area of box section and that was compressed he wouldnt change it to cat c or d
Even if i refused the claim and didnt take the money they still register it so i wont be able to get it insured even if it gets fixed
So ive had a scrap a non diesel 1 owner 53k miles van ,that ive been unable to replace after 4 weeks of searching
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