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BFG
Brolly Dolly



Joined: 14 Feb 2005
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PostPosted: 02:07 - 06 Apr 2005    Post subject: Two Wheel Drive Reply with quote

Do you think it'll catch on?

https://www.bikez.com/bike/21147/index2.jpg

https://www.yamaha-motor.co.uk/products/motorcycles/competition/WR450F_2trac.jsp
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mr.z
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PostPosted: 02:15 - 06 Apr 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would/.... like one... Very Happy

Supermoto anyone?

It will be interesting to see how these develop, in the offroad community it WILL take off, because it will totaly change they way these bikes are, front drive would be a MASSIVE advantage, imagine offroad cars were all 2 wheel drive and then 4 wheel drive was just invented.. its that big a deal imo...

I was reading about some sidecar offroad events and somebody had managed to make theirs drive from the front and it was completely pishing allover the other competators, so much so they banned the use of fwd because it gave them an unfair advantage..

Also for the road, appart from the weight gain it will improve handleing and safety, probably will never get to race bikes but in the real world they will be great..

Still its got a long way to go, only a small ammount of the actual power is transfered, but its early days..
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Jrod
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PostPosted: 02:39 - 06 Apr 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

Havn't they released a kit for this to fit the R1? Confused I'm sure I saw it In MCN.......
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mchaggis
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PostPosted: 03:13 - 06 Apr 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

I shudder to think how heavy all that hydraulic gear is though. I should think they'll be damned expensive too, so it will probably take off slowly, or not at all.
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binge
Emo Kiddy



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PostPosted: 03:18 - 06 Apr 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

mchaggis wrote:
I shudder to think how heavy all that hydraulic gear is though. I should think they'll be damned expensive too, so it will probably take off slowly, or not at all.


Ok, Extra weight from the hydraulics, but an extra driving wheel with an extra load of power...

I recon its pretty cool, but surely if the front is only hydraulic, and the back is engine. then if the front is of less power than the back, the front wheel will be acting as a brake rather than an accelerator... (if that makes sense)

<|Ben|>
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ginguar
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PostPosted: 03:40 - 06 Apr 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

Warning-not the most intelliegent post coming but....


....that bike looks like a small child wearing his dad's shoes. *goes back to bed*
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BFG
Brolly Dolly



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PostPosted: 11:04 - 06 Apr 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

mchaggis wrote:
I shudder to think how heavy all that hydraulic gear is though. I should think they'll be damned expensive too, so it will probably take off slowly, or not at all.


It's lighter than a chain and sprockets. Been talk for years of doing away with mechanical rear drive and switching to hydraulic - but the technology is not there yet. If this takes off it might bring that closer?
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cc123
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PostPosted: 11:08 - 06 Apr 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Ok, Extra weight from the hydraulics, but an extra driving wheel with an extra load of power...


Extra load of power? I can't get the site to open but surely the front wheel will still be powered by the engine driving the rear? No extra power, same power spread over 2 wheels surely??
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Sparks!
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PostPosted: 11:16 - 06 Apr 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

BFG wrote:
It's lighter than a chain and sprockets. Been talk for years of doing away with mechanical rear drive and switching to hydraulic - but the technology is not there yet. If this takes off it might bring that closer?


It took off ages ago, this bike has been released for ages. I've seen one in supermoto trim, looked good, not sure I'd be too keen on it myself.

Raced it in the Dakar rally and it done pretty well IIRC. Although they kept disabling the front wheel drive, then re-enabling it for hard terrain. It's not meant to make the bike go faster or anything like that, just to gain better traction so technically able to corner faster/easier etc when off road.

I've always wondered though if you do a stoppy and keep the power on.. would you be able to ride it for ages if at balance point? Shocked Very Happy
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Kickstart
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PostPosted: 17:09 - 06 Apr 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yams wrote:
I've always wondered though if you do a stoppy and keep the power on.. would you be able to ride it for ages if at balance point? Shocked Very Happy


At least gives you something you can do to save yourself if you overcook a stoppie.

All the best

Keith
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0ni
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PostPosted: 17:42 - 06 Apr 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

A stock WR450F weights in at 110 kg, the WR450F with the 2 trac system fitted increases that weight to 119.5 kg

2 Wheel drive for an 8% weight penalty - yes please Thumbs Up
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lilredmachine
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PostPosted: 01:12 - 07 Apr 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

On a road bike, wouldn't that promote copious front end lossage under power?
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 01:31 - 07 Apr 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

lilredmachine wrote:
On a road bike, wouldn't that promote copious front end lossage under power?


No, the exact opposite. I remember reading an article on it a few years ago where they made a prototype 2WD sportsbike. Remember, you can't loose the front end under power (like in a corner) but the 2WD means that when the rear breaks away and starts sliding you into a lowside, you still have the front pulling you round the corner. Cue much rear wheel steering and powersliding malarkey.

2WD has been done before by an american company in the 1970s called Rokon. They used chain drive on a go-anywhere behemoth of a thing.

https://www.ozebook.com/rokon2.jpg
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mchaggis
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PostPosted: 02:59 - 07 Apr 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

All the hydraulic motors and pumps I've seen have been pretty huge and made from big lumps of steel mostly. Admittedly they've been on earth moving equipment, and they don't need a gearbox, so it's possible units for a lightweight bike would be less heavy. They do need a pump which would easily be as heavy as the gearbox though.

Yams wrote:
I've always wondered though if you do a stoppy and keep the power on.. would you be able to ride it for ages if at balance point? Shocked Very Happy


This is how I reckon it would be though. The BP for the rolling stoppie would be past vertical, in the same sort of fashion as the wheelie I suppose, just the other way up. Laughing
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 03:17 - 07 Apr 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

What might be more of a concern for motocrossers is how the thing balances in the air. If the front end starts coming down on you mid-air, will giving it some revs still rotate the bike back?
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I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.
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BFG
Brolly Dolly



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PostPosted: 21:05 - 07 Apr 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good point. Didn't see any report of it. They did say that the continued gyroscopic effect was helpful.

Extra info:
https://www.yamaha-motor.co.uk/products/information/extra_2trac.jsp
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TheShaggyDA
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PostPosted: 21:12 - 07 Apr 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

There's been a 2 wheel drive electric bike around for a while - £600 and it's yours :-

https://www.f2motorcycles.ltd.uk/f2images/e-bike%20images/beachbike.jpg
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numark1
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PostPosted: 21:54 - 07 Apr 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

Will it wheelie or burnout though?
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Dom_
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PostPosted: 22:08 - 07 Apr 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

Will make for brilliant stoppies, as the rear is in the air the system will think the rear is losing traction, so supply more power to the front wheel, pulling you along earlier. Imagine that, getting your helmet down during a stoppie. Razz
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lilredmachine
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PostPosted: 09:29 - 08 Apr 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

LOOK AT THE SIZE OF THAT FUCKING BATTERY Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked
Must weigh a ton
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gsxrpeak
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PostPosted: 11:18 - 08 Apr 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

i dont think it will catch on, as good as it is! people want the good old rear wheel drive! ONE WHEEL thats the way we all know, and thats what we have fallen in love with!
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 17:17 - 08 Apr 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

gsxrpeak wrote:
i dont think it will catch on, as good as it is! people want the good old rear wheel drive! ONE WHEEL thats the way we all know, and thats what we have fallen in love with!


Ahhhhh. But which wheel? front or rear Wink

https://www.kunis.nl/bikes/megola1.jpg
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primalcarl
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PostPosted: 18:22 - 08 Apr 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

Been around on mountainbikes for a while.

Doesn't add much weight, can be simple to maintain, and you get torque steer at times
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TheShaggyDA
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PostPosted: 18:30 - 08 Apr 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

gsxrpeak wrote:
i dont think it will catch on, as good as it is! people want the good old rear wheel drive! ONE WHEEL thats the way we all know, and thats what we have fallen in love with!

Do people want the good old hand change as well?
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