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Is this proof cameras are a scam?

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Mr Calendar



Joined: 14 Jun 2004
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PostPosted: 12:18 - 07 Jul 2005    Post subject: Is this proof cameras are a scam? Reply with quote

Just looking at the figures from the Lincolnshire Road Safety Partnership (I was at Barton Bike Night and picked up a leaflet).

Now I know you can prove anything with statistics but some of the figures look a bit wrong.

The full table is in this link - https://www.lincssafetycamera.com/CollisionData.asp

For example Personal Injury Collisions (PIC)
Arrow A15 Snitterby S/B, Before=6, After=6, % reduction=-40% Confused (not 0%)
Arrow A15 Scampton N/B, Before=2, After=5, % reduction=+50% Confused (not +150%)

and Killed Seriously Injured (KSI)
Arrow Brant Road Waddington N/B, Before=1, After=1, % reduction=-25% Confused
Arrow A52 Leverton S/B, Before=4, After=2, % reduction=-100% Confused (not -50%)

There are many other examples of this in these figures.
I suspect it is only the % figures that get reported so the partnership continues to justify its existance.

Now my questions are (1) have I understood this right? and (2) are there any more examples of this apparent inconsistancy in data?

Any other comments welcome Thumbs Up
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Klause
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PostPosted: 13:08 - 07 Jul 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

Does seem very dodgy Thumbs Down
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Kickstart
The Oracle



Joined: 04 Feb 2002
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PostPosted: 13:41 - 07 Jul 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi

Suspect it is to do with the time periods involved.

However note that the numbers look best on the most recent scameras which pretty much supports the case that any apparent effects of cameras are just short term statistical anomalies.

All the best

Keith
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Mr Calendar



Joined: 14 Jun 2004
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PostPosted: 14:46 - 07 Jul 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kickstart wrote:
...Suspect it is to do with the time periods involved...

How right you are. I gave them a 'phone call, waiting for someone to call me back with more info. I was told initially that the before figures are over 3 years and the after over 7 years.

Whatever way it is this would appear to be proof that the scamera partnerships cherry pick their figures and statistics to show themselves in a favourable light (or at least not as bad as would appear). IMO it throws into question the whole credibility of the figures and therefore the alleged benefits of having the cameras.
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Chriss
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Joined: 07 May 2005
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PostPosted: 15:16 - 07 Jul 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've been tempted, on more than one occasion to take spray paint to the camera lense. There's so much debate about weather they're for raising cash or not. We all *know* they are, and there are so few that I actually belive make a blind bit of difference.

Sorry, just vented a bit of steam. Confused
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the grim reaper
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Joined: 29 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: 20:46 - 07 Jul 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

There's lies, damn lies and statistics.

Did you know that the government state that one third of all accidents are attributable to speed.What they don't say is how they describe speed related accidents. They attribute a car pulling out from a junction into another car as a speed related accident, not a muppet induced accident.

It's all a smokescreen to justify more cameras.

Cheers

Grim
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Mr Calendar



Joined: 14 Jun 2004
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PostPosted: 11:15 - 08 Jul 2005    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well someone did phone me back Shocked
I was put through to the data analyst.

She said that the figures before are 3 years before the camera and the figures after are 5 years after the camera (this is for the 1998 A15 Snitterby S/B, Before=6, After=6, % reduction=-40%).

So that means 6/3 - 6/5 = 0.8, which is a -40% average reduction in the before figure.

Now there's 2 points to this
(1) Should be grateful they cocked up again because 2005-1998=7 years which is -57% average reduction (even if it's 2004 figures it's still wrong Rolling Eyes)
and
(2) It is hardly a level playing field as over the longer period the % accidents will be less than the shorter one.

So, I for one, can't really believe these figures Confused
As I said before this fiddling with the figures to get the result that's favourable undermines the whole credibility and justification for the camera partnerships.

Lies, damn lies and statistics.

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