Dust seal removal- New problemo

[instigator]

The honda hornet manual states "give the bushes a tap now and then whilst easing it in and out".....

Moving it in and out, it feels like metal is hitting metal, and the dust seal just isn't budging (I assume the dust seal will come out at the same time??)

Is there a certain technique to this?

Also, putting new dust/fork seals on - What is the best method? Without buying the special honda tool.... If you can do such a thing which will keep it in place.

Thanks in advance.

P.S On a different note, say you have stripped the calipers and are putting on new pads - How do you force the piston (okay, perhaps not the correct terminology) back so you can get both pads in place? Yes...they are lightly coated with copper grease on the back.

[Bezzer]

You're on about the forks first of all I take it?? if so just yank them backwards and forwards/in and out. The metal you can hear/feel is a metal bearing/bush on the tube, it will come out with everything else it's just hitting the back of the fork seal.
It can take a bit of force to seperate them, it's like using a slide hammer where the tube is banging out the fork seal from the inside.
I've got different diameters of plastic piping that I've used on various bikes to drive the new seals in place, you should be able to find something similar to fit yours.

The pads - first take the reservoir top off - it lets you push the pistons back easier with no back pressure and you can make sure the fluid won't overflow when you move the pistons as that pushes fluid back up to the reservoir. If the calipers are still on the forks then put a large screwdriver with some padding round the blade in the gap and gently lever the pistons back.
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I used to be indecisive but now I'm not quite so sure.

[instigator]

You should know that the new braided lines aren't on the bike yet, so it has no brake fluid in the system.

Thanks for the reply on dust seal removal - appreciated.

[mr jamez]

Remember to remove the bolt at the bottom of the forks, it goes through the fork leg and into the fork piston, the stanchion will not come out until that is removed. Once you do that, it just requires brute force to get the stanchion out.

As for getting pistons into calipers, I use a little G cramp, the little ones with a large flat surface. As you need to make sure the pistons go in straight.
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NSR 125F > BROS 400 > NC30 > BROS 400 > Trumpet S4 > '97 VFR 750

[Jrod]

Cut the old seal in half and use that to band the new seal in.

[G]

There is sometimes a circlip over the forkseal.

You should be able to lever up the dust seal with a screw driver and slide it off.

Check for a bolt at the bottom as Mr Jamez mentioned.

You do usually need to give it quite a few good 'yanks' before it comes out!


To get the fork seal back in, I've bought some plastic drainage piping from wickes. Cut it up and takena chunk out so it's about the same diameter as the outside of the fork stanchion, then a second one around that. Taped them up and used as a slide hammer to push the seal down.

Dust seal should slide on by hand.



I usually lever caliper pistons apart with a screwdriver or similar.
Can help to put pads (use old ones if possible), but lever on the back of the pads, with them pushed together, otherwise you can damage the pad.

[instigator]

Yeah the bolt was out from the bottom, I just didn't yank it hard enough to get it free form the fork leg.

Can't find anything close enough to the diameter of the fork seal so will have to go buy some piping (unless anyone else has some diy suggestions) Was hoping to get the fork legs back on today. D'oh.

Thanks

[instigator]

Okay...found a bit of pipe that fitted and oil/dust seals are all done now...back on bike, as is the front wheel, rear wheel and installed brake lines and fluid fine.

Infact, it actually resembles a bike now!!

However...it's been sitting maybe a week in a damp atmosphere and now will not start. Only on choke will it perhaps show SOME sort of sign of life but nowhere near staying on by itself. I checked spark plugs, air filter, all connections around the carbs, the wiring...everything I could think of at 9pm at night, having started on it at 9am.

Bike did fall off it's paddock stand (dont ask) and as usual in these sort of situations, started fine on the choke. Then proceeded to die after all the fuel was used up (took tank off beforehand). My synopsis would be there is a problem delivering fuel to the carbs.

Off the bike, when I turn the fuel switch on the tank to ON, no petrol comes out. Is that normal? I would have thought it would just flow out???

There is a bit of a funny sound when trying to start it...sort of like a fizzling sound after I release the starter switch - this is coming from below the carbs...?

Someone...throw me a frickin' bone here..

[Bezzer]

are they CV carbs on the Hornet?? if so petrol won't flow until it's started as it's working on a vacuum. Dunno if yours has but a lot of CV bikes have a PRIME position on the fuel tap, put it to that and petrol should flow unrestricted, usually used to prime the carbs after work or a lay-up. Should have a main petrol feed pipe and a smaller diameter vacuum pipe to the tap, if you suck on the vacuum pipe that should also allow the fuel to flow, check it to see if it's working, then make sure it's connected securely at the carb end. Also check any other pipes from the tank (usually a vent and overflow) are both clear and not kinked when you replace the tank.
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I used to be indecisive but now I'm not quite so sure.

[instigator]

Not sure what you mean by cv carbs, but I checked the whole bike, all of the pipes around the carbs and nothing SEEMS blocked or not connected. As stated, the bike will NEARLY start on the choke, it did once this morning but it gives out an awful THUMP from the engine, like its running dry.

Attached a line onto the fuel switch and sucked but nothing came out...however....with the tank off, I put some fuel into the main fuel line and it still won't start, so I can't see how it's a problem with that....

[Kickstart]

Hi

Whether it is CV carbs or not is irrelevant to it having a vacuum fuel tap.

Does sound like the vacuum pipe is disconnected. There should be 2 pipes from the fuel tap. One large fuel pipe to the carbs. One small vacuum pipe that will go to one of the inlets.

Check the oil level. Wonder if it has gone UP. Could be the engine has dumped loads of fuel through the carbs when it went onto its side.

All the best

Keith
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[instigator]

I managed to get it to idle for a minute before conking out. Sufficienty warm enough, or so I thought, to replace the oil and filter, so oil shouldn't be an issue.

Still wasn't starting, so I took off the air box and carbs to find any strange gremlins. Took the 'covers' off the inlets to the carbs and noticed that on 2 of the inlets, 3 out of the 4 small gold tubes were blocked with petrol...well, not blocked but I cleared it out anyway. It did have some sort of strange brown tinge to it.

Just putting it back together and I find this:

https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v612/greggreggreg/100_0255.jpg

I have no idea where this goes to be honest.

EDIT

The above pipe is now connected to the fuel tap (never was before and it worked fine )

However.....bike still won't tick over. Adjusting idle isn't doing a thing.

Rough compression test on all 4 cylinders seems fine. Test being putting my finger over the whole and they all seemed to give out the same size of compression.

[Kickstart]

Hi

That looks like a water pipe. Should go somewhere into the cooling system (possibly the top of the radiator or something like that). Could possibly go somewhere on the carbs as part of a carb heater system.

The position you have connected this to the fuel tap on should almost certainly have a pipe going down to one of the rubber inlets after the carb.

It is possible that it is the connection for the vacuum tap (not looked at a Hornet in that much detail), but normally they just plug into one of the 4 connectors you use for vacuum gauges when balancing the carbs.

All the best

Keith
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[instigator]

The pipe shown is connected to the engine block (well, jsut AFTER the carbs) and the other end is now connected to the fuel tap.

I have just remembered though - the new twin cans wouldn't have this much effect on it would it? The bike ran fine with a single race can on, now with two on, this is the first time I've got round to actually wanting it to tickover. Before servicing it, I did try it with the cans on and it wasn't happy on choke, ran for maybe 30 seconds before I switched it off. I doubt it would have that much of an effect on the system but it's just information on the table really.

I actually checked the honda workshop manual for this bike, the 330 page long manual. It doesn't actually say anything about this pipe,. Infact, it doesn't detail it full stop. On the other side, maybe about 10cm from this connection on the engine block, is another connection, the same really, with the same diameter pipe coming out of it (this is detailed in the manual). That particular tube goes to the front, jsut by the wheel. Forgive me for not remembering, but it's something to do with the secondary PAIR air supply? Might have minced my words there...apparently it's hardly ever used on the bike anyway.

[Kickstart]

Hi

Cans would have some effect, but I doubt it would be this severe (unless you left a cloth in the exhaust while it was apart ).

If you disconnect that pipe again then feel it while cranking the engine over. You should feel air sucking in if it is a vacuum pipe.

I would say to get Jay to have a look at his Hornet and tell you where the pipes are routed.

All the best

Keith
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