Knife fighting

[Nath]

Whenever the subject of using knives in a fight is brought up, people who seem to know what they are talking about always allude to the fact that the correct way to wield a knife is with the blade towards you.

Now I can see how that would enable you to slash pretty nastily in one direction, and also to stab downwards with a lot of force, but I'm still not totally convinced how it would work as a complete fighting style. Can anyone who knows about this give a more thorough description of the 'correct' way to fight using a knife?

I was watching a film tonight where in one scene a character fights with two knives, holding both with the blades towards him, whilst thrashing his arms about left and right pretty frantically. It looked like quite an effective technique that an opponent would be unable to stand their ground against without receiving lots of slash wounds. But is that just a load of 'movie' bollocks?


Note: I'm not looking for any tales of how you carried a penknife in the school playground when you were 15, or similar. Nor do I think it is 'cool' to carry knives or use them in fights. I am just interested in techniques, and the idea of knife fighting as an 'art'.
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Hard livin', hard luck.

[Simple]

I did fencing for a while at college so I'm pretty quick with something like a stick, or a sabre, not sure if it would work with a smaller knife, plus I'd look like a bit of a pansy lol

never used a knife to fight, I was easily the best in my fencing group, up until a corsa but an end to any potential I had. bleh
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Insta - FemFeral

[Silver]

No experience here, but I can imagine holding the blade towards you would be more effective upon striking/slashing your opponents, however, you lose the 'reach' that you would have by holding it out away from you. It would also probably be harder for the average untrained numpty (that's me...) to get right.

All guess work on my part though...

[daz|n00by]

https://72.14.207.104/search?q=cache:jCTtr2t9zakJ:k.1asphost.com/porut4ik/English/Knife/Martial.Art.The.Fairbairn.Manual.Of.Knife.Fighting.pdf+the+art+of+knife+fighting&hl=en&gl=uk&ct=clnk&cd=14
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[Silver]

Daz, there's a lot of words and no pictures in there. It's midnight, I can't be arsed, translate for me!

[daz|n00by]

[tatters]

There quite a few differnt methods of knife fighting but most have the blade facing outwards. at the right distance a kinfe is more deadly then a pistol

https://www.gutterfighting.org/knife.html
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[lozzypop1]

i heard your supposed to hold it blade up (but then what would i know? i'm just a girl!)
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[daz|n00by]

[tatters]

Stick fighting is less messy lol


https://www.gutterfighting.org/fstick.html
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[Tarmacsurfer]

Horses for courses, it's entirely situational.

A reverse grip (holding the knife with the blade lying along the inside front of the forearm) is useful for confined spaces, fast slashing manouvers and in a very limited sense, blocking. It also allows (with the right sort of knife) the wielder to use the handle as a kubotan for less damaging strikes. Basically it's a grip to use if your not wanting to kill. The only real chance you'd have of seriously hurting someone with a cut whilst in this grip is carotid/jugular or the femoral, anything else is going to be surface (but messy, granted) unless you are up against a complete moron. Even the average numpty has enough self preservation to put his arm in the way of an oncoming blade.

Fore grip is essentially similar to a fencers grip, fingers curled around the handle and thumb following the line of the blade. This allows very fast sweeping slashes and accurate stabs. Bear in mind if you're stabbing then although there are limited targets to immediately disable or kill it will still do more serious damage in general than a slash. Only the luckiest and or most skilled get away with trying to block with this grip. To be honest I've never seen it done convincingly well against someone who was actually out to cause mischief as opposed to sparring.

Aside from this, there's also a wide seperation on opinions of how sharp to keep the blade, best styles of blade etc. Everyone I've met has a different opinion. Upshot of it is, there is no text book "correct" format or style any more than there is a "best" martial art really.

On the subject of stick fighting, partaken in both Savate and Escrima. Both very effective styles, I certainly wouldn't have said they weren't messy though
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[veeeffarr]

If someone pulls a knife on you, with the blade pointing towards their chest... Run as fast as fuck.

[tatters]

[craigie b]

holding the blade in reverse makes it more functional. its easier to slice upwards, downwards and across with severe force and there is less chance of dropping the blade. from a limited amount of knowledge holding a blade upright only allows you to stab forward or slash where as holding the blade towards you allows for greater movement around the unfotunate victim. THe blade can be administered with greater force and can flow with the hand in a way which would be impssible otherwise.

Realistically though I wouldn;t want to use a knife in a fight nor fight someone with one. You will get cut and possibly killed. Fuck that shit

[Black Knight]

I had some little scrote pull a knife on me in a pub once.

I was weight training at the time so certainly had a psycological size advantage at the time.

Simply squared up to him and said 'And what the fuck are you gonna do with that?'

He ran off like a scared icle wabbit!
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[akaDAVE]

Hold the knife upwards, take a step back and dummy a throw towards your oponents face then as they curl away in defense, dive and stick the knife in their back/ribs

Personally I would just leg it into the nearest pub/police station.
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[MarJay]

if you see the knife the person is a numpty.

Anyone worth their salt with a knife won't let you see it. You'll just be cut or stabbed. It'll feel like a hard punch at first...
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[stinkwheel]

Guys who have showed me about knife fighting (not as how to fight with a knife but how to defend yourself against it) have said that someone who knows what they are doing holds the knife along the palm of their hand with the blade lying down along their forearm. They will also curl their index finger over the end of the handle.

There are several reasons for this. One is that when held in that sort of grip, the knife cannot be seen, it is hidden behind your arm. In a typical fight, where both people 'square up' the knife fighter will wait for you to throw a punch and block it by slashing across your forearm then follow up by striking down in a stabbing movement. In this grip the knife also can't be knocked from your hand very easily. There isn't really a good way to defend against this because you are cut before you know they have it.

The curling of the index finger is to prevent your hand slipping down the knife as you stab with it. A lot of people who carry out a stabbing injure themselves too as their hand slips on the knife and they slash the tendons in their own fingers.

Someone who hlds a knife sticking out of the top of their fist and held overarm is just showing it to you as a threat. It is difficult to stab someone like this unless the are going underarm and they will invariably overextend the knife arm towards you as they wave it in your face (encouraged by you backing away). This leaves them open to a variety of particularly nasty self-defence moves such as popping their elbow or knocking the knife up out of the way and headbutting them full in the face.

If they hold the knife sticking out of the bottom of their fist, they are probably going to cut their own fingers but they also intend to stab you with it. It is difficult to defend against this, best bet is to kick their knees out, using your feet to keep them at a distance.

Of course, in all of these situations, the best form of defence is fast running. Shouting "help, help, he's got a knife!" probably wont get anyone to assist you but they will phone the police and your attacker will not appreciate the audience.
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[Tarmacsurfer]

[Itchy]

Knife? , knives? , must be my visit to Manchester or something , everybody here has guns and kiddies have been wearing stab proof vests here for a while (a highlight of my school days here was when a fellow school pupil bought in a gun I didn't see it though)

The Manchester way:

See scum pull out knife , pull out Uzi/AK/Igram/M60/M16/Minigun/magnum
open fire.

[stinkwheel]

[Tarmacsurfer]

The first grip is known as "hammer" grip. I'm not a fan myself, second is a "pakal" reverse grip, common in the Phillipino styles (and elsewhere). The last is known as an "icepick" grip, another I'm not overly fond of. You've missed the fencing (or "saber" grip) which is the one I was referring to as a "fore" grip and my personal favourite. It's the most flat out offensive grip and if you go in using it you will get cut if your opponent is carrying as well. However it's the best for range and also the best in my experience for a fast finish. Over the last few years (Steven Seagal, what have you done ) the forward grips have fallen into disrepute, mainly because alot of people ignore the european martial arts and automatically assume anything of eastern descent has to be better, hence alot of bar room "experts" spouting off on the subject.

Pakal is far more interesting to spar with though, and as I said originally, definitely has it's place in any reportoire.

The problem with any kind of discussion like this though, it's not just how someone is holding the knife it's all down to how they're carrying themselves. I've seen people holding in a textbook fashion who looked nothing less than ridiculous and promptly got slapped aside, then again I remember one scruffy little git in sheffield who was carrying a craft knife all of 2 inches long who managed to put down and stamp on three door staff before he was gotten under control.
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[freestyler_onli]

The problem with knife fighting is that when you ''attack'', you have to go all the way- you cant stop halfway through and 'slightly' hurt them with a knife.

Unarmed combat against knives is my preferable choice, as you can incapacitate the person, without risk of killing him.

[colin1]

i think you can slightly hurt someone if you just slash them on the arm instead of stab them somewhere life threatening
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