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Bloody lorry drivers!

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tintin
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PostPosted: 17:43 - 02 Sep 2006    Post subject: Bloody lorry drivers! Reply with quote

THERE IS AN UPDATE AT THE BOTTOM OF THIS THREAD

I was parked in a bike bay in London on Friday and was the second bike in the bay. When I checked the bike at lunchtime I found that a lorry had come round the corner and knocked a VFR over onto my baby.

Result was a busted mudguard, bent clutch lever, scratched fairing and fork leg, also the bit of plastic on top of the radiator was scuffed.

Luckily some guys in the pub opposite witnessed it and took the lorry's number. To be fair the lorry had also stuck a note on the VFR (he had a busted fairing and broken mirror).

I spoke to the company but there were a bit shitty and started talking about insurance companies contacting each other and the 'alleged incident'. Why can't people who damage your bike just say sorry and offer to pay to fix it instead of acting like arseholes?

Got to get some part costs, I don't know if they will pay for the fork leg, the scratch is pretty faint but I know it's there and it pisses me off that the bike was perfect before this prat came along.
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Last edited by tintin on 09:41 - 29 Nov 2006; edited 1 time in total
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G
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PostPosted: 18:04 - 02 Sep 2006    Post subject: Re: Bloody lorry drivers! Reply with quote

tintin wrote:

I spoke to the company but there were a bit shitty and started talking about insurance companies contacting each other and the 'alleged incident'. Why can't people who damage your bike just say sorry and offer to pay to fix it instead of acting like arseholes?

That's what insurance is for.

It's the driver's company that's being an arse, not him, it sounds like.

However it could all end good for you - presuming the bike is ridable as it is, you can get a cheque written for a load of replacement bits that you don't actually /have/ to replace Smile.
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tintin
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PostPosted: 18:28 - 02 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't want to make a claim off my insurance though as it will just push the premium next time I renew.
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G
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PostPosted: 18:31 - 02 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

You won't be.

You will be making a claim of their insurance.
You can make the claim direct, rather than going through your own insurance. However, if you have legal cover, or even if you don't, I suspect your insurance company may well help you out anyway

Even if you had Fully Comp, the claim would go against yours, then claimed back off the other insurance and your NCB would be reinstated and you wouldn't have a claim against you.
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mrtEE
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PostPosted: 18:40 - 02 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

tintin wrote:
I don't want to make a claim off my insurance though as it will just push the premium next time I renew.


are u retarded ?

Wink
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ColdInsomnia
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PostPosted: 18:47 - 02 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

If a RTA (Road Traffic Accident) occurs where you are not at fault - you claim off the causer's insurance, not your own.

Hence it should make no difference to your quotes at all.
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tintin
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PostPosted: 14:26 - 05 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

mrtEE wrote:
are u retarded ?


No but you are, you little tosser!

I'm fully comp, but even if you claim off someone else then the next time you renew you are asked if you have any claims in the last five years and very often EVEN IF IT IS NOT YOUR FAULT they will load up the premium.

I'm even more pissed off as the bloody manager of the depot wouldn't even admit that his driver did this and wouldn't apologise for damaging my bike as it 'might indicate liability' - wanker.
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Arfdog
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PostPosted: 14:36 - 05 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

tintin wrote:

I'm fully comp, but even if you claim off someone else then the next time you renew you are asked if you have any claims in the last five years and very often EVEN IF IT IS NOT YOUR FAULT they will load up the premium.

I'm even more pissed off as the bloody manager of the depot wouldn't even admit that his driver did this and wouldn't apologise for damaging my bike as it 'might indicate liability' - wanker.


TinTin,

i don't believe you are correct here. Your insurance will go up of you do as you say, but you are filling out the form wrong. You must read the question as asking if YOUR insurance company has had to pay out as a result of any claims against you in the last 5 years. Don't tell them about any claims you've made against others..

The depot manager sounds like a wanker, but another bit of advice if you are involved in an accident, is to never admit responsibility. This is something that the insurance companies sort out, and your sole responsibility should be to give your insurance details, go home, and ring your insurance company and tell em what happened. He was correct in avoiding 'suggesting liability' by apologising, even though he probably didn't need to be a wanker and say something else helpful instead.

It's a bit like 'anything you say can be used against you in a court of law' etc, if it was found there was more to the accident that you or he realised, then he may be jeopordising his legal position as a result of admitting liability.
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Finglonga
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PostPosted: 14:38 - 05 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

tintin wrote:


I'm even more pissed off as the bloody manager of the depot wouldn't even admit that his driver did this and wouldn't apologise for damaging my bike as it 'might indicate liability' - wanker.


Think about it! Insurance companys say NEVER ADMIT LIABILITY plus if his driver is still out he may not know about the accident yet.

Believe me if you have a minor accident while doing deliveries you just leave a note and carry on with your days work. Then report the accident when you return to base.

The tricky thing is, whose insurance do you claim off, as the wagon didn't hit your bike, it was the VFR that did. You may have to claim of the VFR for damage to your bike and he/she claims it back off the wagons insurance. Bet you didn't get the VFR's details.
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paulthewitt
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PostPosted: 14:39 - 05 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

tintin wrote:
I'm fully comp, but even if you claim off someone else then the next time you renew you are asked if you have any claims in the last five years and very often EVEN IF IT IS NOT YOUR FAULT they will load up the premium.

I'm even more pissed off as the bloody manager of the depot wouldn't even admit that his driver did this and wouldn't apologise for damaging my bike as it 'might indicate liability' - wanker.


It does depend on the company. but you are correect. even a non-fault accident can affect the premium (yes its unfair but its what can happen)

as for the depot manager not admitting liability, some insuruers will invalidate all cover if you admit liability. So he may be contractually bound not to admit liability by his insurer....or he may be a prat.

Paul
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Trixie
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PostPosted: 15:13 - 05 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The tricky thing is, whose insurance do you claim off, as the wagon didn't hit your bike, it was the VFR that did. You may have to claim of the VFR for damage to your bike and he/she claims it back off the wagons insurance. Bet you didn't get the VFR's details.


I think you'd still claim off the truck driver's insurance, as he was the one that caused the VFR to fall over in the first place.
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Finglonga
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PostPosted: 15:23 - 05 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

Trixie wrote:


I think you'd still claim off the truck driver's insurance, as he was the one that caused the VFR to fall over in the first place.


Nope. I was rear ended by a car at traffic lights that had been shunted by a van bahind him. I had to claim on the car that hit me and not the van.
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map
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PostPosted: 15:25 - 05 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

G wrote:
You won't be.

You will be making a claim of their insurance.
You can make the claim direct, rather than going through your own insurance. However, if you have legal cover, or even if you don't, I suspect your insurance company may well help you out anyway...

However, bear in mind that you'll have an excess on your policy and claiming will affect your no claims unless you replay the uninsured amount (the excess) as well. I'm explaining this as how I was told how it worked. So if your excess is £200 and parts are £300 you'll still be £200 out of pocket at least.

You also apparently have to report any claim when you renew, even if not your fault and excess repaid, etc. So whether that affects your renewal amount is anyones guess.
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edd
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PostPosted: 15:40 - 05 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

Finglonga wrote:
Trixie wrote:


I think you'd still claim off the truck driver's insurance, as he was the one that caused the VFR to fall over in the first place.


Nope. I was rear ended by a car at traffic lights that had been shunted by a van bahind him. I had to claim on the car that hit me and not the van.


Isnt that a different situation again though? The car behind you was at fault for rear ending you for not leaving enough gap, and possibly not applying the handbrake while he was stopped. Regardless of the fact that he was pushed. If both vehicles were parked I think it might be a different situation.

As for putting your premiums up, I have had 3 NFA's in the last 3 years. I dont think my premiums are affected much, if at all. (I pay about the same as my mates on similar bikes in similar areas at the same age) The only thing it seemed to affect, was many companies wouldnt accept my pass plus for my car insurance because I had been involved in a bike accident!!?!? (no I dont get it either)
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Arfdog
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PostPosted: 15:46 - 05 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

edd wrote:
Isnt that a different situation again though? The car behind you was at fault for rear ending you for not leaving enough gap, and possibly not applying the handbrake while he was stopped. Regardless of the fact that he was pushed. If both vehicles were parked I think it might be a different situation.


It's always the guy at the back's fault in a pileup situation..
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edd
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PostPosted: 16:49 - 05 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well no, its the fault of the person who hits you, as I have just said, and as Finglonga said earlier, and why he had to claim off said person.
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Arfdog
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PostPosted: 17:01 - 05 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

edd wrote:
Well no, its the fault of the person who hits you, as I have just said, and as Finglonga said earlier, and why he had to claim off said person.


Ah I think we're talking past each other.
It's the person who hits you whose insurance company your insurance company deals with, but in the case of the pileup, the person who hits' you's insurance company will refer the claim back to the insurance company of the person who hit the person who hit you. And so on, like a giant chain, until eventually the insurance company of the car right at the back of the pileup ends up paying out a huge claim.. and that dude's will be responsible and lose his noclaim bonus. I think.

all the rest are just little cogs in the chain...

So when I said fault, I meant the person who's insurance company foots the bill as the person who was insured with them was deemed to be the ultimate causer of the accident.

If that makes any sense at all..
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natv4
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PostPosted: 17:37 - 05 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

As mentioned; With insurance, you can only claim from the person whom makes contact with you, unless you can prove someones action caused a collision.

Your NCD will be affected only when your insurance company pays out. This may happen if it was not your fault, but the TP (third party) was uninsured. Therefore your insurance company would pay you, be unable to recover its losses and prejudice your NCD.

Your excess is only payable on damage to your vehicle. There is no excess on any TP's claim.

If you have an accident as at the start of this thread, simply claim against the TP's insurance company (the van). This usually involves phoning them and then providing details and your side of events together with any witnesses (and their statements). Its a pain, but it will not affect your insurance if you do it this way. You do not have to declare claims against other people at renewal, only ones against your own policy.

Quite rightly if you have legal cover you are entitled to use this to pursue the TP and it will not affect your NCD. All costs will be recovered from the other driver.

I know, I've had to do it on 2 occasions. Both times I was satisfied with the results. If you have witnesses things are fairly straight forward, but it can take time.

And yes, you would be able to claim against the VFR should you be unable to claim against the van (if he was uninsured etc).
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BFG
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PostPosted: 18:18 - 05 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

tintin wrote:
even if you claim off someone else then the next time you renew you are asked if you have any claims in the last five years and very often EVEN IF IT IS NOT YOUR FAULT they will load up the premium.


This is true. They encourage you not to claim at all. I.e. all insurance is a rip off.

Proof of a sort is No Claims Bonus. Not only do they give you a fake bonus for not using their service (It's actually just a discount), they offer protected no claims bonus for a premium.

Which is insurance on your insurance. Rolling Eyes
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natv4
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PostPosted: 19:49 - 05 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

BFG wrote:
tintin wrote:
even if you claim off someone else then the next time you renew you are asked if you have any claims in the last five years and very often EVEN IF IT IS NOT YOUR FAULT they will load up the premium.


This is true. They encourage you not to claim at all. I.e. all insurance is a rip off.

Proof of a sort is No Claims Bonus. Not only do they give you a fake bonus for not using their service (It's actually just a discount), they offer protected no claims bonus for a premium.

Which is insurance on your insurance. Rolling Eyes
This is not true at all. If you are fully comprehensive you have the option of claiming from your policy. You do not have to. If you claim from the other person directly, as mentioned above, then you do not have to disclose the claim to your insurers. You only have to disclose claims against your policy. Therefore it will not impact your premium at all.

Incidentally, as you said, it is NCD (no claims discount). There is no bonus, it is simply to try and encourage people not to take risks which could cause a claim. NCD protection is in recognition that if you have stayed accident free for 5 years, the chances are that any claim you have will not be due to you taking an elevated level of risk (beacuse you have proven that you are capable of not claiming for 5 years). This (NCD protection) usually only works for the first 2 claims in a 3 year period, after that you will loose your NCD.

I fail to see why everyone should pay the same for insurance, the current system is not fair, but it is fairer than everyone paying the same.
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tintin
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PostPosted: 13:47 - 09 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the replies, at leaset some people understand what I am saying here.

I have still not had a response from the insurance, the transport company (who own the lorry hit me) have pssed the claim to another company who 'handle their claims' who in turn passed it to the insurance company (Zurich), they were not able to find the paerwork, or the claim reference when I spoke to them and said they would contact me. Four days later, nothing, nadda, zilch. The claim agents (whatever they are) told me that the driver involved had not filled out an accident/claim form before he went on two weeks holiday (thanks mate).

Meanwhile I have been and bought a new clutch lever (only £63 from Aprilia) and I am working in Scotland next week so I probably will not have time to sort this out.

P.S. Yes I did get the registration details of the VFR and we have alredty spoken on the phone wirth each other. Not sure what he is doing, maybe he is claiming off his own insurance.
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stinkwheel
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PostPosted: 17:21 - 09 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ride the insurance company, keep at them or they will deliberately drag their heels in the hope that you will give up and go away.

Ask them if they want their own claims asessor to look at your bike BEFORE you do any repairs yourself. Even if they don't, it would be well worth getting an independant asessmant of the cost of the damage.

If they pull the "He's gone on holiday and not filled in the form." stunt again, tell them that's none your concern and that you want your bike repaired as soon as possible. Tell them you will be claiming for the hire of another bike until yours is fixed if it takes much longer (give them a time scale, seven days would seem reasonable), that usually gets them moving. Put it in writing as well and send it to them, keep a copy.
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G
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PostPosted: 21:34 - 09 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

map wrote:

However, bear in mind that you'll have an excess on your policy and claiming will affect your no claims unless you replay the uninsured amount (the excess) as well. I'm explaining this as how I was told how it worked. So if your excess is £200 and parts are £300 you'll still be £200 out of pocket at least.

Only if you are claiming off your own Fully Comp insurance.
None of that applies if you are claiming from someone else's insurance and not trying to claim of your own fully comp first (who will then claim back off theirs).

Quote:
You also apparently have to report any claim when you renew, even if not your fault and excess repaid, etc. So whether that affects your renewal amount is anyones guess.

You do, but shouldn't really be penalised for a non-fault one.
If you have say ten non-fault accidents in a year, they might think differently, though.
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Jack_Cheese
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PostPosted: 22:28 - 09 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

G wrote:
Quote:
You also apparently have to report any claim when you renew, even if not your fault and excess repaid, etc. So whether that affects your renewal amount is anyones guess.

You do, but shouldn't really be penalised for a non-fault one.
If you have say ten non-fault accidents in a year, they might think differently, though.


Non fault accidents do bump up insurance quite a bit. My parents have full NCB and 3 minor non fault accidents in the past couple of years. Their insurance has gone up by about £200 i think.

Jack
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natv4
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PostPosted: 08:34 - 10 Sep 2006    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jack_Cheese wrote:
Non fault accidents do bump up insurance quite a bit. My parents have full NCB and 3 minor non fault accidents in the past couple of years. Their insurance has gone up by about £200 i think.

Jack
Not necessarily so, remember that in the last 5 years insurance premiums on the whole have increased by 25% at least. The whole industry is raising prices as a result (they claim) of higher personal injury claims. Norwich Union alone have increased their premiums above inflation (15%) this year even though they have posted healthy profits.

In this circumstance I would take Stinkwheels advice, this should have the matter resolved swiftly. Also remember to mention that you have independant witnesses. Whatever Mr lorry driver says is fairly irrelevant in that case.
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