At what point should you cut your losses?

[TheDonUK]

Im facing a bit of a dilemma, I brought my immaculate bandit last year around christmas time for about 1500, i paid slightly over the odds because it was in great nick and only had 5000 miles... Fast foward 11 months, Its only got around 27k on the clock but its had a hard year, i tend to trash my bikes, they dont get an easy life.

I have recently discovered that two of the piston rings have gone, so now it becomes more economical to find a second hand bandit 6 lump and just do a transplant...

Right so i have checked the usuall sources, nothing decent and near me on ebay, rang all the breakers i know and done the whole partsearch and been innundated with calls today... It seems most breakers want between 200 quid for an engine with 25k+ (not worth it to me) and upto 400 including VAT/delivery for something with say 5000 miles.

My mechanic friend who has the bike at the moment reckons its time for me to cut my losses and buy a reliable honda... Hes logic being that i dont warm by bikes up religiously (i just ride them gently for the first mile or two) and sometimes get sloppy with maintence (guilty as charged.. Im working on that...) He reckons something like a Hornet/CBR600F will be more able to take the punishment i though at my bikes... He works for a main honda dealership im inclined to believe he knows what hes talking about when it comes to them (and no hes not trying to sell me one through his dealership )

He reckons i should take off the exhaust sell that for say 150 quid, then put the bike up on gumtree or similar and advertise it along the lines of

"Im a student, i brought the bike last year, it ran fine for 6 months then the usual bandit problem of exhaust rot wrecked the end can and i cant afford to fix it up so im selling it as is for a reduced price"... Say maybe 400-700 quid, depending on what i can get, and then put that money together with the exhaust money and anything i was gonna spend on a new engine, and get a cheapish hornet which he has loads of spare parts for and will get it in tiptop shape and then i will have a slightly faster and more reliable bike for everyday use...

On the other hand i could spend 300+ on getting another engine and having it fitted only for something else to go wrong with it or for the engine to be a lemon...

The first idea is appealing to me, i just wanted to get a few other opinions before i hear from him tomorow about a couple of possible bikes in the works...



Cheers

[Gazdaman]

Have you seriously looked into repairing the lump?

Bandit engines sometimes turn up VERY cheaply on eBay, but granted, when I was looking for a new engine, I could not find one less than about £250.

Personally I think you stand to lose a lot of money if you cut your loses. A bandit with a dead engine is worth £400? Maybe?

If you can afford to take a step back and wait for a cheap engine, then that's a good bet. Or buy a trashed engine and swap the top ends over.

Gaz

[TheDonUK]

Thats the thing i cant really afford to be without a bike mate, im living where public transport is dire at best, also bloody expensive and slow... Plus i dont want to be without a bike, i havent ridden since thursday and im starting to become a depressive bastard...

Plus i think the idea behind that sales pitch was to be a bit of a cunt and imply that when i last rode the bike the engine was running fine, basically to fuck someone else over... Ie Advertise it as needing an exhaust... Normally i would never do something like that but im really poor and in need of a bike atm so am considering it...

BTW currently the bike starts and idles, for a couple of minutes before it basically bogs down to fuck and wont rev... So if someone were to just start it without a pipe on at all they would probably wrongly assume everything was ok...

[.Chris.]

Surely you can just rebore the existing engine as long as the rest of it is in reasonable nick. I rebuilt a car engine about 9 months ago - it cost me £50 to have the block rebored. I used some secondhand oversize pistons but a new set complete with rings would have been about £150. Not sure how much it would cost for a bike engine but worth considering maybe?

If not you could renew just the rings on the affected cylinders. The repair probably won't last long if the bores are worn but might give you the chance to get rid of it for a reasonable price. Not that I would encourage such a thing - seems a bit dishonest to me.
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Chris
1985 Kawasaki Z550F

[Kickstart]

Hi

Surprised it is the rings that have gone. The engine is tough (it is a 750 by design).

Doubt that, by design, a Hornet engine would be any tougher. Same bad luck could occur, just with more chance of a bent frame from a minor off in the mean time.

Can anyone help you get an Ebay engine to you cheaply?

[TheDonUK]

I have no idea the condition of the cylinders/piston, from the way they felt i would take a stab in the dark and say i would need more than some rings, which are expensive enough as it is... Also bare in mind i cant do this work myself, Fair enough im not paying 40 quid an hour labour but i still gotta pay my mate something for his time. He has worked on my bike since i owned it and knows it mechanically far better than I, I dont want this thread to turn into a workshop diagnosis.

I dont have the time or money at the moment to repair it up (ie just the piston rings that are gone) and try and flog it for slightly more, because realistically even a good bandit nowadays only gets around a grand. I need a working and reliable bike soon, which is why its come down to either find the money somewhere for a second hand engine and hope its not a lemon, or sell of the valuable bits and try and flog off the rest being somewhat dubious about the condition of the engine....

To put it into perspective, i paid 4 quid to get to uni and back today and that took me 40 mins or so, usually it would be around a pound petrol and 5-10 mins... Also i ate plain pasta with olive oil because i have no food and am nowhere near any shops to buy some... All my mates with bikes and cars are not around this week... Its highlighted to me how much i need a reliable bike to get on with my daily life...

EDIT: Kickstart: As i say i have looked on ebay, the only decent ish looking engine i saw anywhere near my price range was in cumbria and collection only, and i dont know anyone with a van, my mates only very small cars and they are nearly in as bad shape as my bike...

[Gazdaman]

So you havn't actually tested it?

It starts ok and soon bogs and dies? Sounds like a stuck choke to me...

Gaz

[TheDonUK]

I am 100% its not a stuck choke...

It was pissing blue smoke last time i rode it, there is no compression on the 3/4 cylinders. As kickstart says, when head gaskets and whatnot come into play in my situation if i am to carry on with this bike it would be cheaper to just replace the lump...

I realise you guys can only go on what i say, but understand i suck at explaining the mechanical faults with my bike over an internet forum, Im told by a trusted friend who is also a qualified bike mechanic that in my case it would be cheaper and easier to just replace the engine if i want to carry on with this bike...

So do i take a financial hit and not get most of the money i have paid for the bike back with the prospect of getting another more reliable bike (also i wouldent mind a change) or do i persevere with what i have. Thats what im after from you guys...

I dont mind being poor as long as i have a reliable bike, so, as long as selling the bandit+exhaust gets me enough to get something else i can live with that... Im just wondering if i should cut my losses or not...

[.Chris.]

[TheDonUK]

Again i considered that option and i would probably get more for the bike doing that, but I dont have the time to wait for everything to sell individually, I dont really have anywhere to put all the parts while im waiting for them to sell... And thats if they even do all sell at this time of year... Plus that means endless trips to a postoffice which is miles away to post things with no form of transport... I gotta rule that one out...

Sorry to postwhore here btw, you guys are coming up with all the options me and my mate bounced off each other earlier, i have narrowed it down to either Sell off the bike/parts for what i can get and add any money i would have spent on an engine and get a new bike or get the engine and cross my fingers its just the piston rings that need doing...

[Kickstart]

Hi

Personally I would say pick up a spare engine and lob it in there as the cheapest option.

However it is a bit odd that 2 cylinders on one side have gone. How much is compression down? Would be inclined to think that a likely issue is the head gasket going between the cylinders rather than pistons.

I would not advocate dumping on people like that trying to resell it, and you could probably make as much or more from breaking it for spares anyway. If you did decide to do this then taking the head off for a quick check could be worthwhile.

All the best

Keith
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Traxpics, track day and racing photographs - Bimota Forum - Bike performance / thrust graphs for choosing gearing

[TheDonUK]

[Kickstart]

Hi

Well, factor in you might get a bit back for the existing engine.

Find an engine and see if anyone here can help get it to you. Might make distance less of an issue if someone is coming past and can pick it up / drop it off.

I would be inclined to check inside your current engine and see what the exact problem is.

All the best

Keith
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Traxpics, track day and racing photographs - Bimota Forum - Bike performance / thrust graphs for choosing gearing

[TheDonUK]

Aye im giving myself untill the weekend to find an engine, im hoping something pops up on ebay for cheap or that a breaker comes through with a good offer. If not i guess its bye bye bandit

If it were a case of the bike sitting outside and me having the knowledge to do it i would have a look... But that means if i did decide to dubiously sell it on i would have to buy another head gasket set to get it to idle like it does now?

Cheers for the advice and any more from anyone is very welcome, from anyone, i have alot of decisions to make in the next few days...

[Kris]

My old Bandit 6 packed up one day.

Went out, usual morning commute routine, locked garage got on bike and it wouldn't start.

When it did start it bogged down and stank of fuel. I literally had to rev it like crazy to get any decent drive and the blue smoke out the back was incredible. To be honest, I though it was fucked.

Turns out the carbs were worn and just flooding the engine constantly. I was suprised as it appeared to happen overnight, but alas, a replacement set of carbs and carb rubbers sorted it.

I'd really check the analysis of what is wrong carefully. Try to locate the exact problem. These engines are bombproof and I'd seriously doubt after 27k the rings have gone.

Take it apart then decide if it's cheaper to get a new engine...
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www.prisonplanet.com

[Barry_M2]

If you can get the engine out, I'll take a look at it for you. I'm quite local to you according to the map in profile.

I have equipment to do a leak down test and find out where the problem is pretty much straight away.

Even if you find a new one, I can sort your old one for you as long as you pay for parts and a few beers, then you might at least get a bit of money back by selling it on!?
____________________
ZXR750R (M2) - For the road.
CBR1000 RR4 - For the track.
https://www.bikechatforums.com/profile.php?mode=viewprofile&u=4332

[TheDonUK]

Cheers for the offer Barry, i will bare that in mind mate, Ile PM you in a couple of days

Kris, I took it in knowing the carbs were running well rich, with problems like you describe, I had taken it in to get them tuned, which they have been, so im sure its not them now... What my mate reckons is that because the petrol was flooding into the engine it would basically wash away the oil for lubrication and perhaps leave the barrel marked/scored/something not good (at least i think thats how he described it...)

[Barry_M2]

No problem.

Can ballance the carbs too if needed.

Just give me a shout.
____________________
ZXR750R (M2) - For the road.
CBR1000 RR4 - For the track.
https://www.bikechatforums.com/profile.php?mode=viewprofile&u=4332

[sickpup]

[D O G]

This sounds like a nasty situation.

I can empathise with your predicament. I too have only a little technical knowledge/experience, little time and crucially lack the facilities and comprehensive tools to do what others consider to be an easy task.

Something like checking the bores etc would probably take me a whole day and much frustration.

I vote you go for the new engine, and keep the old one. Get it chucked into your frame so you have a useable bike, then spend some time taking your old one apart and checking its condition and potentially fixing it.

That way you get a useable bike, some experience of doing (what is to most people) major mechanical work, and a spare engine (or one you can sell).

Just my thoughts.

[MattEMulsion]

[davylynne]

my friend bought a bike off ebay that was a pile of shit - certainly not as described

Took the person who sold it to small claims and got the price of the bike + costs + they have to collect it!

So don't do it!

[Barry_M2]

[TheDonUK]

Nice one Barry, Carbs have been done already, so would be less work for ya

sickpup: Sorry i seem to have offended you by not accepting your offer straight away, I dont really wanna part with 150 notes of which i would have to sell parts of my body to get for an engine which has known problems, As i have said i am totally relying on other people to do ths work on the engine for me so anything extra just costs me more in labour and time and effort. My clutch is basically new and as i said the carbs have been balanced. As it seems you dont suffer fools gladly, and in regards to engines i am definately one i will make sure i dont bother you again

It seems the consensus here is to persevere on with the bandit and i appreciate everyones opinions, If i can find a running engine with lowish miles for the right price i will likely do just that and stick with it. If i do that, i will definately keep the old one, open it up myself with a haynes manual and try and learn a thing or two about engines as its one of the last things on bikes i dont even really have a basic grasp of.

In regards to shafting someone else, i havent decided anything, it was just something i had run past me and was bouncing it off you guys also. If someone straight out asked me i dont think i could lie to their face but if they dont then thats their business and as i say im not in a financial position where i can be worrying about everyone else... It sucks but thats how it is for me at the moment...

As i say Im still weighing up my options nothing is set in stone yet so any more input is appreciated. Cheers

[sickpup]