Starter relays

[Easter Bunny]

Does it matter if the live feed wire from the battery through the starter relay is now going in the opposite way to way it did previously?


I took my Pan ST1100 into a garage I use regularly for an unrelated problem, when i picked it up they said they had to replace the starter relay as it was jammed when they went to start it.


I have used it for a 200 mile trip and went to start it yesterday and ignition lights came on then straight off, I suspected it was main fuse on the relay (as I have had problems in the past) and yes the 15Amp fuse had blown (there was a 30 amp in the previous one) but the the thing that puzzled me was the relay is now facing the wrong way.
Previously the main live (with the allen bolts) was at the rear, often making it difficult to access. Its now at the front, meaning the feed is going in the wrong way is this a problem?

I'm sure they manage to get the subsidiary wires in the right place as I'm sure it wouldn't have started otherwise.

This is what it looked like previously
https://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii284/mkbiker/starterrelay_zps3af55d29.jpg
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The light at the end of the tunnel is an oncoming train!

[stinkwheel]

If they were connected the wrong way on a straight solenoid, it would make no difference to the starter motor, the solenoid is in series with the positive feed to the motor. Activating the solenoid just joins thye two wires together.

It would however make a difference to the rest of the bike because what you have is NOT just a straight solenoid. It's a solenoid with the main fuse takeoff attached to it. That main fuse take-off is connected into the "hot" terminal of the solenoid. If it was hooked up backwards, nothing electrical would work at all.

EDIT: Also. A bit blurry but those blue crimp connectors don't look very well attached. Do they each have two crimps on and have the insulation trapped in the top crimp? Try pulling them off. If you can, they weren't on properly, they should take well in excess of 10kg of load to pull the wire out. I measured one out of interest a while back and hung 17kg off the end of it without it pulling out.
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“Rule one: Always stick around for one more drink. That's when things happen. That's when you find out everything you want to know.”
I did the 2010 Round Britain Rally on my 350 Bullet. 89 landmarks, 3 months, 9,500 miles.

[davebike]

Pattern replacement relays often don't have the wires the same way around as the original

The two heavy wires are Labled B battery and M Starter motor
Two nearest to the fuse spades are the relay coil and work either way around
Two further away are the power feed to the loom and feed to the battery from the Charging system and again don't matter which way around

Funnily enough just ordering another of those relays for stock
Common fail point

Dave
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Dave
NC750Xdct + others at work !
davebike1@gmail.com

[wots]

On my fireblade when the wires melted on my starter relay I ordered this.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/360727550906

It does a proper job if take care when putting it back together. Assume the additional rubber boot is still attached to your loom.

If it's too short because they've cut it back, use this.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/281226488116

Just be sure that all connectors you replace are soldered (where they are not being crimped) and are encased in heatshrink sleeving.

From what I've seen, there is a round Starter Relay and a Square Relay. The wiring is a different orientation on each.
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Currently: Yamaha DT 125 LC2,Repsol Fireblade, and Bumblebee MSX 125

[WD Forte]

As said, it doesnt matter where the two main battery to starter terminals are as long they function properly.
15A main fuse on a Pan?
Sounds a bit lightweight to me, maybe that's why it went
I'd stick a 30A back in like you had previously.
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bikers smell of wee

[Easter Bunny]

Right thanks for your replies so far, this is a picture of it today....(the red/green has a kink in the picture)

https://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii284/mkbiker/starterrelay06-05_zpsbd8da141.jpg

taking into account the relay now faces the wrong way......the rde/white has swopped places with the red & the red/green has swopped places with the yellow/red whilst in the garage


I stuck a 30 amp fuse in and the bike starts without blowing the 30 amp but I checked on one of the 10amp fuses in the fuse box as it blew in the 120 miles I did after taking the bike out but before blowing the 30 amp starter fuse, and it was very hot after about a minute of ignition switched on .

When I questioned the garage about the swop about of the wires they said because it was a pattern relay it had to wired differently??

The only reason they were able to swop the wires was the original block isn't present, surely if you buy a patent relay you don't need to do this??
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The light at the end of the tunnel is an oncoming train!

[Easter Bunny]

[Easter Bunny]

[WD Forte]

I wouldnt be concerned that this relay looks different
as long as its up to the job and probably is
the 2 big terminals connect the battery directly to the starter via the
soelnoid contacts and not fused
The red/white is DC power from the regulator
and this goes to one side of the main 30A fuse

The other side of the fuse is connected to the red wire
and heavy duty battery side terminal
This feeds all the bikes electrical systems and sub fuses
as well as charging the battery

The red/yellow wire is the live feed from the starter button
(this may pass through another relay en route on some bikes)
and gets energised when you press the button

The green/red is the solenoid coils ground wire
but its held off ground by the neutral switch and clutch switch
so you can only start the motor when in neutral or with the clutch in.

If you have a sub fuse getting hot, you need to investigate the circuit it supplies and also check its the correct rating for the circuit
You may well have electrical problems elsewhere.
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bikers smell of wee

[Easter Bunny]

Right I think the problem is they used a generic relay not a pattern one but I explained that if the relay fried itself in Glasgow I wouldn't be able to fit a pattern one without swapping the wiring, so a pattern one is going to be fitted once I get the replacement block connector as below & return it all back to as near normal as possible, still doesn't explain why they left it with a 15A fuse, they said because it was supplied with one??