Clutch permanently engaged?

[Mart_er6]

'Evening..

Yesterday my clutch cable snapped accelerating up a motorway slip road as I changed gear.. slight brown pants moment. I thought it would be an open and shut case of a frayed cable (done 30k miles).

However doubt set in quite early as before I called the recovery van I tried just pulling on the remains of the wire to change gear. Doing this, when I selected first, the gear would not disengage and the bike stalled.. Recovery van called and picked me and bike up

Back home tonight, repeated the test and manually moving the clutch housing leaver (that the cable pulled) makes no difference to the sound of the engine in neutral (it used to change with clutch engaged/not engaged) and again in first pulling the clutch housing leaver didn't disengage the gear, bike stalls (should have put it on center stand!)..

So is it possible the clutch is stuck/fused in the engaged position? If so, any idea what to do with it (other than send it to the Triumph dealer)? Strip and replace/clean? Any other thoughts/ideas?

I have a new cable coming shortly, but I strongly suspect that it won't fix the problem.. One other thing, after a dealer service a month ago, it came back with a different biting point quite near the end of the lever outwards travel..

Bike is a Sprint ST1050..


Martin
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Honda Varadero XL125 "Vara" > Kawasaki ER6F "Smerf" > Triumph Sprint ST 1050

[Artens]

Holy s**t.. I am facing ignition problems, but you, fellow rider have a nightmare.. All i wanted to say was good luck.. I pray for you to get on her as soon as possible.. I will follow this topic and i wish it goes well..

[G]

How were you trying to 'pull' the cable? The lever gives a significant, well, leverage .
I wouldn't expect you'd be able to pull it by hand.

Best way to do I'd say is to knock it into neutral before stopping if possible, or stall it.

To start off, ideally stop on a downhill - but if on flat, start in neutral, push it for a bit until there's a little speed, then drop it into gear.

Read up on clutchless changes if you're not used to it.

[Mart_er6]

Unfortunately the slip road (and road ahead) was uphill.. and yes can do clutchless changes smoothly above third gear on the Sprint.

Now that you mention it though, the ease of pulling the clutch lever is telling. Suspect the clutch is indeed err.. suspect.

So my thoughts are;
I) accelerated up slip road
2) clutch fuses
3) I pull lever
4) clutch stuck, pulling lever snaps cable

Next step therefore is clutch disassembly..
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Honda Varadero XL125 "Vara" > Kawasaki ER6F "Smerf" > Triumph Sprint ST 1050

[G]

Doesn't sound like that to me at all.

Ok, it could be.

But a sprint 1050 has a pretty strong clutch pull.

Sounds more likely the cable was corroded inside and snapped.

My point was that the clutch lever is a force multiplier - at a guess, it probably exerts over 10x the force you're pulling with (for an associated reduction in movement). And remember this is with a nice big lever to hold onto.

It takes a bit more work, but you can clutchless slip up and down, including to first gear on your bike or should be able to - do need to match revs ok going down.

Clutches can stick - but seems unlikely while riding. Usually it's when they've been sat for long periods, not while riding.
Normally the clutch lever still works anyway - you still seperate the cage, but the plates stay together.

A good condition cable won't break if it can't pull it, unless you're a master rock climber with stone-crushing grip.
So I'd say - stick a new cable in it and see how you go.

[sickpup]

Just fit a new clutch cable and stop being paranoid.

[Robby]

This is the kind of thinking that leads to people buying new camshafts when the problem is an exhaust gasket.

Always fix the things that are obviously broken before doing any amateur diagnosis.

[Mart_er6]

Ok, so I'm an amateur, fair enough, guilty as charged! The clutch cable is on order and I'll fit that first of course. But all I'm saying is that the clutch lever on the clutch housing can be pushed to its endstop, without the clutch dis-engaging, by my thumb alone. Comments here and elsewhere verbally suggest I should not be able to do this without applying much more force. Therefore there is the possibility that there is a fault within the clutch and that the cable breaking is a symptom not a cause. I'll keep you updated..
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Honda Varadero XL125 "Vara" > Kawasaki ER6F "Smerf" > Triumph Sprint ST 1050

[jaffa90]

If you can turn this lever by hand the correct way then there`s something worn inside,
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Triumph-SPRINT-ST-SPEED-TRIPLE-1050-CLUTCH-ACTUATOR-ARM-LEVER-LINK-/371700528058?hash=item568b13f3ba:g:q6UAAOSwGIRXbBSs
This lever when relaxed should be at a right angle to the box.

[G]

Oops, if you didn't edit the post, I totally missed that.

That being the case; yes there's a problem inside. I would suspect the actuator has snapped inside.

Odd that the cable and that have gone - I'd expect one could break the other, but less likely both would go at the same time.

[sickpup]

[Mart_er6]

Yes, will fit the new clutch cable first before removing clutch cover etc. 95% sure I'm pushing the actuator correctly when testing it but you lot have me doubting everything
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Honda Varadero XL125 "Vara" > Kawasaki ER6F "Smerf" > Triumph Sprint ST 1050

[smallfrowne]

The arm will have quite a bit of movement in it before it actually starts to disengage the clutch - you are only pushing/pulling against the arm's own return spring up to this point, and that is pretty easy to do. When you get to the point of disengaging the clutch it could feel quite solid. Just a thought,

Edit: not sure what you are referring to as the end-stop, I dunno what the engine is like on this bike, so as I said, it's just a thought.
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'90 VFR750; '89 NC30; '95 DR650; '89 CD250U; ~'82 CG125; ~C90

[Mart_er6]

Yes, what I might be thinking is the 'end stop' could actually be the start of where the real effort needs to applied..Occam says it's just the cable so fingers crossed.
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Honda Varadero XL125 "Vara" > Kawasaki ER6F "Smerf" > Triumph Sprint ST 1050

[Mart_er6]

Ok, so I was being a bit paranoid.. it was indeed just a broken clutch cable!

I now also know that to actuate my clutch properly, plenty of leverage is definitely required..
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Honda Varadero XL125 "Vara" > Kawasaki ER6F "Smerf" > Triumph Sprint ST 1050

[bikenut]

and regular servicing the clutch cable, and rest of bike, wonder what the chain is like??
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nuts about bikes

[Mart_er6]

[iooi]

[Mart_er6]

[nitrosurf]

Lube up your cables often, with something nice with PTFE in if possible (though any old junk is better than nowt). It'll hold off the corrosion that leads to cables dragging or breaking. Don't get me wrong sometimes they'll just go, but preventative maintenance is, well, preventative!
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"Multiple exclamation marks," he went on, shaking his head, "are a sure sign of a diseased mind."

[Dave70]

Just wondering, while reading this thread. (I'm still a bit of a mechanical noob).

Is there a general milage point when one should look at replacing the clutch cable?

Obviously, I realise that this in part will rely on how well maintained the bike, including lubing the cable, has been. I currently have my bike serviced at a dealership for warranty purposes, so would hope they'd spot any issue beforehand.

However, I feel that it would be handy to know if there is a general rule regarding this (milage wise), so I could just get it replaced before finding myself stranded somewhere along way from home.

Or is it different for all models of bike?
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There ain't no devil, there's just god when he's drunk.

2012: R125 killed by white van. 2016 R125 killed by 30,000 miles of redline. Current: 2016 Kawasaki ER6f.

[yen_powell]

I chuck a bit of oil down mine every few months.

If I have to start adjusting it more than usual I look for frayed bits of the braid, usually detected by running a finger over the exposed ends and seeing if I say 'ouch!' If it has started to fray, replace it asap as it will not get better on its own.

On my trail bikes I used to zip tie a spare cable alongside the old one.
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Blackmail is a nasty word........but not as nasty as phlegm!
XT1200Z and a DR350 in bits