Battery Woes - Aprilia Sportcity 250 Scooter

MahatmaAndhi · Traffic Copper Joined: 10 Jun 2015 Karma :

Hi all,

It's been a while since I posted here, but I now I'm back on two (motorised) wheels, I figured I'd give it a shot.
I bought my 2008 Aprilia Sportcity 250 a few weeks back. It was a fixerupper but (with my meagre mechanical skills) managed to get it up and running.

I'm currently on my third battery from Halfords though. The first simply didn't fit. So that went back.
The second (a Yuasa YT12B-BS) fit, but wouldn't start the bike. The bike has a volt meter on it and it said, out of the box, it was around 7.5 volts. I tried charging it overnight, but it never exceeded 11.5V. Given that this was meant to be a fuss-free battery, I took it back and exchanged it for another Yuasa YT12B-BS.

This one has been fine. For about a week. I've done about 100 miles on the bike, all on this battery. I thought all was well. However, yesterday I went to get on it and it the bike wouldn't start. The lights and dashboard all lit up, but when you pushed the starter, it gave a single 'cough' and died.
I can't remember what the volt meter showed. I think it was 7.5V again. But I can't remember.
I've taken the battery off and put it on charge where it has been since around 7pm last night (about 14 hours). It's still charging now.

Any ideas what could be wrong? Is it another duff battery from Halfords? Does my bike have an electrical problem that I need to diagnose?
One thing worth mentioning is that there's a Meta alarm system on the bike. I'm not sure which model, but I have the key and the fob and they're very annoying to have to use. Could this be the culprit? I saw that you can get bypass kits online so I am planning on doing this anyway when I figure out the model.
That's the only thing that I can think of that isn't stock. But, again, I've very limited experience and so I wouldn't know for certain.

Thanks!
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2008 Aprilia Sportcity 250

P.addy · *Formerly known as* P. Joined: 14 Feb 2008 Karma :

MCN · Super Spammer Joined: 22 Jul 2015 Karma :

When you go to Halfords to change the battery buy a multimeter when you're there.

Set to max DC Amps

Ignition off.
Connect the red lead to the battery + and the black lead to the + cable.
That will measure how much current is draining out the battery.

Read what the meter says.

It should be zero amps or very near zero.

Then connect the battery lead to the battery.
Set the meter to DC volts.
Put the red lead on +
Put the black lead on -.
That will read the volts in the battery.
Should be 12 - 13 volts ish.

Start the hoowur.

Read the volts with the engine running.

Should now read more than with the engine off.

If it doesnt change then your charging system is stuffed.
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Disclaimer: The comments above may be predicted text and not necessarily the opinion of MCN.

MahatmaAndhi · Traffic Copper Joined: 10 Jun 2015 Karma :

Thanks for your help so far. Apologies for being a dullard, but here's the update.

I have a multimeter. It's a bit of a crap one from Amazon.

I haven't been to Halfords yet, but with a freshly charged battery I went and did what you said. Or at least my interpretation of it.

https://i.imgur.com/vJv99EMm.jpg

Big version: https://imgur.com/vJv99EM

I think I've misunderstood somewhere along the lines.

When I put the battery back in the bike started up fine (it's been charging for 24 hours.) However, when I turned the ignition off again I noticed a noise. It was really faint, but sounded what I imagine an electricity current to sound like (as hard as that is to explain).

The noise was coming from somewhere under the seat. And, when I removed the negative cable, the noise stopped completely.

If it's the alarm/immobilizer system, then I'm happy to get rid or bypass it. I've just got to identify the model number first, by whipping off the tupperware until I find it. That's a job for the weekend.
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2008 Aprilia Sportcity 250

WD Forte · World Chat Champion Joined: 17 Jun 2010 Karma :

"I think I've misunderstood somewhere along the lines."

yes you have

As simply as i can describe it:

Refit the battery to the scoot
connect up the red (positive) terminal to the battery +
but leave the negative "-" terminal undone.
You have the meter set to DC amps up to 10A so leave it like that

Now fit the red meter probe to the scoots negative lead
and the black meter probe to the battery.

the meter should now show what current (if any) is draining from the battery when the scoot is switched off .

Try and make good connections with the meter probes or the meter may under read the actual current flow
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bikers smell of wee

MahatmaAndhi · Traffic Copper Joined: 10 Jun 2015 Karma :

Ahh yeah, I see what I did there.

I did as you've suggested (I hope). It settled at 0.01, but did jump up to 0.11 at times.
That pesky noise is still there though whenever the battery gets fully connected.

https://i.ibb.co/xL17Q6h/20220602-114724.jpg
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2008 Aprilia Sportcity 250

WD Forte · World Chat Champion Joined: 17 Jun 2010 Karma :

Nothing wrong with that meter
probably fine for general bike electrics
and far superior to no meter at all.

That reading suggests a drain of 10mA
which if true is kind of typical for an alarm/immobiliser thing

I'd switch the meter to the 200mA range to see if the reading there
corresponds to the indicated 10mA in the 10A range
Even if it jumps to the 0.11, this 110 mA is still in the 200mA range

( tip: when measuring an unknown current , always start with the meter at its highest range and only switch to lower more accurate ranges when and if that range is well above the previous reading)
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bikers smell of wee

MahatmaAndhi · Traffic Copper Joined: 10 Jun 2015 Karma :

Excellent. Thanks for the guidance.
I'm off out today but I'll do as you've suggested over the weekend.
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2008 Aprilia Sportcity 250

Polarbear · Super Spammer Joined: 24 Feb 2007 Karma :

Personally I would dump the alarm. I've vary rarely heard good stories about retro fit alams and TBH no one takes a blind bit of notice of them anyway.

Even if you decide to reconnect it later you will have ruled out or confirmed if the alarm is an issue.
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Triumph Trophy Launch Edition

WD Forte · World Chat Champion Joined: 17 Jun 2010 Karma :

I knew nothing about these META alarms but after googling
apparently they're a type insurance companies like.
You can buy plug in by pass modules for say £20 which would save
rummaging about in the guts to disconnect it.

then, you could still say hand on heart to the Ins Co
" yes guvner its got a pukka Meta alarm fitted innit" when getting quotes

10mA alarm drain shouldn't cause problems on a regularly used bike
but if it makes funny noises and the current can jump up to 110mA
I wouldn't trust it either.
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bikers smell of wee

MahatmaAndhi · Traffic Copper Joined: 10 Jun 2015 Karma :

I found the alarm and took it off. Using this video of a guy with the same model, I managed to bypass the alarm and immobiliser with some dynamo cable. It's still starting, which is nice. However, that noise still persists. And it's made no difference to the draw from the battery.

I'm going to order an isolator switch for the time being so I can quickly disconnect the battery when the bike's not being used. At least until I can figure this out.

As for insurance, I didn't have the bike when I set up the insurance, so I said 'No' to alarms, immobilizers etc.
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2008 Aprilia Sportcity 250

WD Forte · World Chat Champion Joined: 17 Jun 2010 Karma :

before going any further
I'd set the meter to the 20V DC range
and read the standing voltage of the battery ignition off
A healthy/new battery will usually sit at around 12.65V possibly more

Then, switch the bike on whilst observing this voltage
there's bound to be a drop as the fuel pump pressurises *
and systems power up
but not a lot on a good battery.

Next start the engine, the battery voltage should rise to around
14-14.2V fairly quickly.
anything significantly more or less is cause for concern

*
Fuel pumps often make a 'hissing' sound for short while at ignition on, this perfectly normal.
Could this be the sound you hear under the seat?
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bikers smell of wee

xX-Alex-Xx · World Chat Champion Joined: 12 Sep 2019 Karma :

MahatmaAndhi · Traffic Copper Joined: 10 Jun 2015 Karma :

I've done as you said.
When the battery is connected but the key is off, the reading is 13.34v.
When the key is turned, but the engine is still off, it drops to 12.65v but moves about a tiny bit.
Then, when the engine is on, it settles around 14.35v.

That noise could potentially be the fuel pump, but it never seems to turn off. I've had the battery connected, but not started for about 20 mins and it's still been there.
I've also heard it after a ride, once I've switched the engine off.

What I'm thinking is to put the battery on and carry on as normal. This has only happened once and the alarm is now off. Maybe that fixed it and the noise is unrelated (wishful thinking).
The bike has a volt meter built in which seems pretty accurate, matching the multimeter, so I can check it daily to see if there's an overnight drop.
If the problem persists, perhaps it's time to call in the professionals.

If you've any more suggestions, I'm happy to keep trying. And I really appreciate the help. I'm learning as I go, and regretting the amount of time that I skived off school.
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2008 Aprilia Sportcity 250

WD Forte · World Chat Champion Joined: 17 Jun 2010 Karma :

Hmm............. interesting

The voltages look fine that sound is an odd one.
We need some kind of power to make a noise,
electrical, mechanical force , heat, pressure differentials etc
so summat is happening to do that.

got a wiring diagram for that scooty?
first thing I'd want to do is check if anything has a permanent supply
that may be causing the noise

could it be the foam desperately trying to regain its shape after yer big fat arse has squashed the bollox out of it?
fambly of nesting rodents snoring and fidgeting?
interdimensional hole trying to open to allow tentacled space aliens to invade our planet or similar kind of X files stuff?

The truth is out there...
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bikers smell of wee

MahatmaAndhi · Traffic Copper Joined: 10 Jun 2015 Karma :

I have found one online. Hopefully this will link you to the right page too: https://www.manualslib.com/manual/769184/Aprilia-Sportcity-250-Ie.html?page=75&term=Diagram&selected=4#manual
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2008 Aprilia Sportcity 250

WD Forte · World Chat Champion Joined: 17 Jun 2010 Karma :

https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Flive.staticflickr.com%2F3693%2F11930382516_40e3d54c15.jpg&f=1&nofb=1
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bikers smell of wee

MahatmaAndhi · Traffic Copper Joined: 10 Jun 2015 Karma :

Dang. Thought that would work.
Give this one a try: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1a7-g0qj4-uD8ZFyuadvzdE2QZJsEVwJ9/view?usp=drivesdk

The search doesn't work for me, but it appears to be page 61 onwards.
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2008 Aprilia Sportcity 250

WD Forte · World Chat Champion Joined: 17 Jun 2010 Karma :

Unfortunately another manual with a poorly scanned wiring diagram

As well as monitoring the charging now you're reasonably confident the onboard volt meter can be trusted
I'd whip out the seat bucket and have a good look and listen.

It may be some normal function for that scoot
say related to the remote stuff it has
but hopefully at least you can put your mind at rest and possibly detect and fix something that ignored may leave you by the side of the road and cost more.
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bikers smell of wee

MahatmaAndhi · Traffic Copper Joined: 10 Jun 2015 Karma :

Yeah, unfortunately I can't find a Hayne's for this bike. Just generic "scooter" manuals.
I'll keep an eye and see if there's any change, or drop.
The isolator switch arrived, but it's massive. It looked much smaller in the illustration.

If anything new comes to light then I'll post a follow up. Thank you very much for your help thus far
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2008 Aprilia Sportcity 250

sickpup · Old Timer Joined: 21 Apr 2004 Karma :

As there is a noise and a power drain I would take a look at the starter relay.
On many bikes ALL the power goes through the starter relay and as it has a coil it has the potential to make a noise if shorting internally, normally a light buzzing.
Seen this happen with starter relays that are corroded internally due to water ingress.