Roadside Fingerprinting

[Annabella]

Police are going to begin taking fingerprints whilst they are on duty (on the streets) using mobile electronic devices. The thinking behind this is to prevent people providing false identities (including those stopped for traffic offenses).

https://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/6170070.stm



Scary, scary stuff
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[Annabella]

As far as I am concerned they can arrest me and waste their time if they want my fingerprints.

The article states that they are not 'currently' storing the prints - how long until they do!?
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[Barry_M2]

I was just reading this on Sky News site. If you've ever been to Luton, you'll understand why they are trialing it there. And they have my backing.

I'd also have no problem giving my prints, I've nothing to hide.


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[Didge]

[craigie b]

[craigie b]

Welcome to New Labours police state.

[Annabella]

[Mister James]

I have no problem providing my fingerprints to be check electronically. I'd have more reservations if they were to be stored indefinitely, but I would still not be instinctively against it.

At the moment it is just a trial, and people have the right to refuse.
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[craigie b]

[Annabella]

[craigie b]

I don't know if anyone recalls my ebay sale of the ultimate banger... a sixteen yeaar old belomt. God it looked like a bag of shit.

I got pulled over three times in two months for driving it. Of that 3 times, once I was speeding, the other two times were simply the visible condition of the car.

That would have been three occassions the police would have taken my finger prints, two of which would be for no good reason.

I'm not a criminal and I don't see why I should be treated as one.

[Ste]

As the police don't have my fingerprints, how would them checking my fingerprints at the roadside prevent me from giving them false details?

Those of you who'd object to the police checking your finger prints, I see this as your best answer.

https://www.stanford.edu/group/stanfordtaiko/manual/images/belt_sander.jpg

[Shaun]

Wait so let me get this straight, you want the police to get off their arses and do something about real criminals, yet when they bring in an initiative to help them catch 'real criminals' quicker you get pissy about that as well. If you have nothing to hide then you have nothing to worry about, now go find something more interesting than complaining about the state of this country to do, like emmigrate to africa.

[craigie b]

shauns usual insulting dross always adds joy to any conversation.

[Dom]

Not keen on the idea. And I wish the "I have nothing to hide" brigade would catch on to this stuff; whether you have anything to hide or not isn't the point.

I'd much rather go down to a police station and provide my details than go down this route, as it's always the case with these things that as soon as the government get an inch they'll try and go a mile.

Edit: Spotted a good quote on the beeb's website:

[Shaun]

Ok think about it this way, this initiative may hinder you for a couple of minutes, however, should your bike be stolen or even anything more serious happen to yourself this system may help to catch the culprit quickly, which is a plus point surely?

Yes there are as with most things the down sides but in my opinion the positive points far out weight them if it helps to catch someone who may previously have not been caught?

[craigie b]

And we can trust the police to guard our finger prints and delete them once there checked because the police are so reliable at guarding information.....

Met police payroll details stolen

Oh, right, maybe not.

[craigie b]

Whilst the nothing to hide squad may be correct about the current political climate (i.e. we're being surveyed, monitored and tracked by a benign government), can you imagine how easy our system now is to be corrupted by a more sinister government (even though B'lairs state is so corrupt and lie based that I find it hard to call them benign).

[Clanger]

[craigie b]

Think on it this way......

If we have nothing to hide then we should have nothing to fear? Yeah?

Yet the people implementing these policies should also have nothing to hide? Right? Leadership, setting the example and all that......


Yet Teflon Tony and new labour seem to have plenty to hide....who recalls a good day to bury bad news? Or blunket and prescotts affairs? Or cash for honours? And lets not even talk about how much unknowns there was regarding the Iraq war.

Fuck it. If your stupid enough to want liars, cheats and whores to to create policies that infringe in your rights because you believe the aformentioned type of people have a moral high ground and your best interests at heart then you deserve to lose your civil liberties.

[Dom]

To say it may 'hinder you for a couple of minutes' is so naive. Surely you wouldn't deny that the next logical step is for the govmt to make it a requirement and then to keep all prints on a national db? Once we get there just think of the potential for abuse. The data wouldn't be secure by its very nature as any cop could access it.

As craigie says, if a more hard-line government came into power this would be a dream come true for them. There seems to be a total disregard of the fact that laws and new technology like this should be used to protect the law abiding public, which these days seems fairly uncommon to say the least.

Speed cameras and breathalysers are not foolproof but they're still used as definitive evidence. This isn't any better. Even going on the released statistics (likely to be optimistic, it's fair to say) 5 or 6 people in 100 will be ID'd completely incorrectly.

The question is not 'do I mind losing a few minutes of my time in the hope that more criminals will be caught' but 'do I mind giving up a civil liberty, do I mind the possibility of being arrested because the technology fails, do I mind the fact that a government could use this system as a person-specific barcode'?

Edit: Oh and just so I'm sure; this is still a democracy, right? It's just that I don't remember even hearing about this before today (let alone having the opportunity to voice an opinion) and it's already up and running.
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[dainesefreak]

I heard this on the radio this morning and my initial instinct was no fucking chance.

It reminds me of a story on something like Tonight with Trev; a story about some bloke who had a conviction for burglary from a long time ago. He'd opened up a shop and when his fingerprints were found on a vase in a burgled house, even though it was bought from his shop, he was hauled in as prime suspect. He was sent down on fingerprint evidence from a now discredited "fingerprint expert", as well it turns out, as a few others. He lost his house and business in the process of trying to defend himself and even had some world renowned fingerprint expert disprove the evidence.

Fingerprints, err, no way Hose.

[Vincey B]

I saw a report on it this morning - before everyone over reacts all this device does is search the existing police database of finger prints to verify a persons identity.

It doesnt record your finger print, it just compares it to what has already been given.

Anyone who has watched "Road Wars" will know that police are always arresting people who are stopped and have no ID on them and cannot give them a name that matches up to the police/DVLA computers.

[G]

If this was used much more pro-actively and authoritarianly, I wonder if people would decide it wasn't such a bad idea if the government saved millions/billions on the costs associated with illegal immigrants etc.
Of course, more likely 'people' want that to be sorted, but still be free to not produce ID themselves or have their own lives monitored, only the 'bad' people.

[Kris]

I love the BBC spin piece on this.

It's only voluntary at the moment.

Fingerprints are not kept at the moment.

Do me a favour! This is clearly yet another step in the ongoing conditioning of the UK general public to accept these totalitarian schemes. I can tell you now that the schemes will be announced a success and every police force will have them in 2 years.

Let me guess, next they'll change the police uniform to brown and ask everyone for their papers on every corner?

If you really cannot see how dangerous this is for our liberties then I really do feel sorry for you. You've heard how the Germans sleep-walked into a fascist state yes? Well this is how they did it, piece by piece, eroding people's rights. Well one day you're all going to wake up in a living fucking nightmare and God help us.

Anyone actually going to do anything about this?
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