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Watchdog backs motorcyclist in turban battle

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zimi...
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PostPosted: 02:19 - 17 Feb 2008    Post subject: Watchdog backs motorcyclist in turban battle Reply with quote

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Watchdog backs motorcyclist in turban battle

https://multimedia.thestar.com/images/15/68/910b673549ef8d9c4224355f8068.jpeg

Feb 15, 2008 04:30 AM
Bob Mitchell
Staff Reporter

The Ontario Human Rights Commission has ridden to the defence of a Brampton man who says being forced to wear a motorcycle helmet instead of his turban runs counter to his religious faith.

Baljinder Badesha, above, who was charged by Peel police in September 2005 with failing to wear a helmet, said he understands the inherent dangers of riding a motorcycle without a helmet but is willing to take the risk to follow his Sikh tenets.

"I know it is for safety, but people die in car accidents all the time," the 39-year-old owner of a used car dealership said yesterday outside a Brampton court. He is fighting a $110 ticket he received for wearing his turban instead of a helmet while riding his motorcycle on Queen St. in Brampton near Hwy. 410.

Now the Ontario Human Rights Commission is siding with him, insisting Badesha is being discriminated against.

"Telling Mr. Badesha to choose between his religion or participating in the normal life of Ontario is discrimination," Scott Hutchison, an attorney for the human rights commission, told a Brampton court yesterday.

"Roads and riding a motorcycle are something that is available to everybody in Ontario provided they wear a helmet. But that condition makes it impossible for Mr. Bedesha and everybody of the Sikh religion. That amounts to discrimination."

He said the Human Rights code "prevails" over the Highway Traffic Act (HTA). Forcing him to wear his helmet "infringes on his human dignity," Hutchison said.

Badesha hasn't ridden his motorcycle since he received his ticket.

"I was riding for three or four weeks. They caught me one day and gave me a ticket," said Badesha, outside of the courtroom. "I haven't ridden since."

The married father of four has also been prevented from test-riding motorcycles sold at his dealership.

Having previously resided in British Columbia, where Sikhs are exempt from wearing helmets, he said he didn't know it was against the law in Ontario. Court heard that Manitoba also makes the exemption as does the United Kingdom, Hong Kong and India.

In an affidavit entered in court, Badesha said he had a "sincere" belief that he was obligated under the tenets of his faith to wear a turban at all times when outside his home.

"We want an exemption for our religion," he said outside court.

Hutchison said Badesha would not be required to take off his turban if he went into a restaurant that had a requirement for people to take off their hats.

"The code would apply," he said.

Should Justice James Blacklock acquit Badesha on the grounds he was discriminated against, Hutchison said it would not prohibit officers from laying charges against other Sikhs, who would have to seek similar relief from the courts.

The trial continues today.

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Walloper
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PostPosted: 12:20 - 17 Feb 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gaol the bastart.

If it messes with his religion then he shouldn't ride a bike on the public highway.

Paying taxes interferes with my religion but I know I still have to do it if I wish to live among the rest of society.

How much of his argument is just a bullshit anti-helmet facade?

I hate abuse of religion. Twisted Evil Mr. Green
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Itchy
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PostPosted: 12:26 - 17 Feb 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

This sort of reminds me of that episode of only fools and horses the turbinator,

Anyway its hardly abuse of religion , its more like they are willing to stand up and do something about it, here in the UK government does something , many people moan about it and do nothing etc.

In France the country is bought to a standstill if they government does something they don't want.
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ms51ves3
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PostPosted: 12:48 - 17 Feb 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

I knew about that law a long time ago and he is the first sikh man that I have seen who rides a motorcycle.
Would it really be that unsafe? All that hair under his turban must go someway to helping him if he does crash.
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Handsome
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PostPosted: 12:55 - 17 Feb 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

He says that they " Caught him not wearing a helmet ", so he knew he was doing wrong and knew he'd be riding ilegally but chose to do it anyway, pay the fine and shut up, Next...
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Syx
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PostPosted: 13:10 - 17 Feb 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why doesn't someone just make a turban that complies to the helmet protection standards? Laughing
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Walloper
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PostPosted: 16:30 - 17 Feb 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

Syx wrote:
Why doesn't someone just make a turban that complies to the helmet protection standards? Laughing


It's the issue with chin strap retension. Laughing
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plugger147
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PostPosted: 22:54 - 18 Feb 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

He's in canada, they wouldn't have even stopped him here thank god. I don't want more court time and public money wasted on petty religous arguments than we already have.
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Walloper
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PostPosted: 00:06 - 19 Feb 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think you need to have an exemption order signed (Or Singed) by the Home secretary or some cnut. That states you cannot wear a helmet on religious grounds.
Medical Gounds and one other exemption which fails me....
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chris-red
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PostPosted: 00:38 - 19 Feb 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think people should be forced to wear helmets anyway, I call it darwinism.
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Walloper
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PostPosted: 00:46 - 19 Feb 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

chris-red wrote:
I don't think people should be forced to wear helmets anyway, I call it darwinism.


Fair enough.
But at least wear a kevlar bag to contain the mush. And not put innocent passers by off their fish & chips.

And it is careless to use NHS hospital resources when a proper helmet would have saved injury.

***Awaits Thunder Clap of the arrival of Anti-Helmet war party***
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Last edited by Walloper on 18:13 - 19 Feb 2008; edited 1 time in total
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.
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PostPosted: 17:45 - 19 Feb 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm after a new kidney, I think riding without a helmet should be encouraged, I'd have a much better chance of getting one sooner.

Religion may require him to wear a turban, but where does it say he has to ride a motorbike ???????????????????????? Middle Finger
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AngelGrinder
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PostPosted: 18:05 - 19 Feb 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

What if someone was claustrophobic, and being inside a helmet made them feel very uncomfortable?

So surely - Forcing him to wear his helmet "infringes on his human dignity"

Does it not?

It's one rule for one, and one for another, which leads to discrimination anyway.
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.....
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PostPosted: 18:15 - 19 Feb 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

The 'you must wear a helmet' law is bollocks anyway. Surely the choice should lie with the individual? When have you ever heard of a 3rd party being killed because a rider wasn't wearing a helmet and that had he been wearing one the 3rd party would have survived?

Tell you what as we all need protecting from ourselves, let's ban motorbikes and cars altogether. They're dangerous you see?
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LeeR
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PostPosted: 19:45 - 19 Feb 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

AngelGrinder wrote:
What if someone was claustrophobic, and being inside a helmet made them feel very uncomfortable?


See now this is why I can't get my wife on a bike, she struggles to feel comfortable with her head in a helmet; the other way round however is no problem at all... Shifty
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Moonie
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PostPosted: 08:20 - 20 Feb 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

Joe wrote:
The 'you must wear a helmet' law is bollocks anyway. Surely the choice should lie with the individual? When have you ever heard of a 3rd party being killed because a rider wasn't wearing a helmet and that had he been wearing one the 3rd party would have survived?

Tell you what as we all need protecting from ourselves, let's ban motorbikes and cars altogether. They're dangerous you see?



well how about wasting NHS time and money on coming and trying to save the guys life/scraping him out of the gutter, thus not being able to attend to somebody that was injured without making a ridiculous personal choice that put themselves at a serious unneeded risk?

If you don't wear a helmet you don't deserve medical treatment when you f**k yourself over.
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Pie-Roe
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PostPosted: 11:48 - 20 Feb 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

Moonie wrote:
Joe wrote:
The 'you must wear a helmet' law is bollocks anyway. Surely the choice should lie with the individual? When have you ever heard of a 3rd party being killed because a rider wasn't wearing a helmet and that had he been wearing one the 3rd party would have survived?

Tell you what as we all need protecting from ourselves, let's ban motorbikes and cars altogether. They're dangerous you see?



well how about wasting NHS time and money on coming and trying to save the guys life/scraping him out of the gutter, thus not being able to attend to somebody that was injured without making a ridiculous personal choice that put themselves at a serious unneeded risk?

If you don't wear a helmet you don't deserve medical treatment when you f**k yourself over.


You mean the NHS time and money are taxes pay for? This national health service which responds to our problems because we are opted in automatically to pay for it? Why should we care about making their job easier. Is it ok for professional fighters to do that because they pay for private healthcare? Could it not be argued that in the same vein we pay for private healthcare, just as a country.

Theres a whole picture, and it all boils down to the same things about people being told what to do and when to do it.

Pyro
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Walloper
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PostPosted: 12:35 - 20 Feb 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

I take two gee-gees out for hacks over rough countryside.
Always wear my hat. And only on the road briefly.

It should not need to be law.
It is just a wee bit of common.

More injuries horse riding than bikes/horse rode I bet.

The 1HP ignorant fourlegged, sure-footed, over-fed big bastats have un-seated me a few times.... Embarassed
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Moonie
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PostPosted: 14:48 - 20 Feb 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

pyroforlife wrote:

You mean the NHS time and money our taxes pay for? This national health service which responds to our problems because we are opted in automatically to pay for it? Why should we care about making their job easier. Is it ok for professional fighters to do that because they pay for private healthcare? Could it not be argued that in the same vein we pay for private healthcare, just as a country.

Theres a whole picture, and it all boils down to the same things about people being told what to do and when to do it.

Pyro


Who pays for it is irrelevant. Got kids? A wife? Your parents? Imagine one of them getting run over by a car, and the ambulance not being able to attend to them as soon as they need it to, because I've binned it 50 yards down the road and I was too cretinous to be wearing something designed to save my life when doing something which like it or not is intensely dangerous.

pyroforlife wrote:
Theres a whole picture, and it all boils down to the same things about people being told what to do and when to do it.


O Rly?

I'm telling you to wear a helmet, now do it.
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.Chris.
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PostPosted: 16:46 - 20 Feb 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Who pays for it is irrelevant. Got kids? A wife? Your parents? Imagine one of them getting run over by a car, and the ambulance not being able to attend to them as soon as they need it to, because I've binned it 50 yards down the road and I was too cretinous to be wearing something designed to save my life when doing something which like it or not is intensely dangerous.


Same could be said for the fatties who stuff their faces with burgers and pies all day then require expensive treatment due to heart disease/obesity/diabetes. Could easily be said that these people are taking away ambulances and hospital resources from more 'deserving' patients. I assume therefore you're in favour of banning pies, burgers and all the rest of it?

As far as I'm aware there is no law saying I mustn't climb under a car only supported by a jack. Surely this should be illegal, as it's a fairly basic safety precaution to put some axle stands under there?

At the end of the day, I own my own body. Therefore nobody has the right to say what I may or may not do with it, provided I am not causing harm to others. The fact that healthcare in this country is provided by a government agency and funded through general taxation doesn't affect this at all. It's not even as if I'm free-riding as we all contribute towards the running of the system through paying taxes.

The creeping 'government by NHS' is all the proof I need that this sort of collectivism can easily end up being pretty dangerous to liberty.
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Cigaro
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PostPosted: 17:16 - 20 Feb 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

Walloper wrote:
How much of his argument is just a bullshit anti-helmet facade?


If he doesn't want to wear a helmet he shouldn't have to, religion or not. It's his own head at the end of the day.

I have ridden on the public road without a helmet on a few occasions. I know it's stupid, but as I said it's my own choice. Even though I'd always insist on a pillion passenger wearing a lid wether it was illegal or not.
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.....
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PostPosted: 17:53 - 20 Feb 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

Moonie, can you not see the obvious flaw in your argument?

You're basically saying that if you do anything to increase your risk of being injured you don't deserve NHS treatment.

Better stay in bed today then, eh?

There's a good chap.
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Moonie
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PostPosted: 18:40 - 20 Feb 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok you guys, having read your arguments, I'm not afraid to say that I was wrong. You've made me see a couple of bad points.

New Point of view:

if your dense enough to not wear a helmet you deserve to die when you crash

Rolling Eyes
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PostPosted: 18:44 - 20 Feb 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

Moonie wrote:
Ok you guys, having read your arguments, I'm not afraid to say that I was wrong. You've made me see a couple of bad points.

New Point of view:

if your dense enough to not wear a helmet you deserve to die when you crash

Rolling Eyes


In the same way if you're dense enough to ride a motorbike you deserve to die when you crash?
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Walloper
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PostPosted: 19:04 - 20 Feb 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

Joe wrote:
Moonie wrote:
Ok you guys, having read your arguments, I'm not afraid to say that I was wrong. You've made me see a couple of bad points.

New Point of view:

if your dense enough to not wear a helmet you deserve to die when you crash

Rolling Eyes


In the same way if you're dense enough to ride a motorbike you deserve to die when you crash?


So how many cars, vans, trucks or buses kill folk compared to the number of bike who kill folk?

Shouldn't we just ban all machinery then?

You closet Luddite you. Razz
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