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Tyres for 600s

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B_A_B
Brolly Dolly



Joined: 03 Apr 2008
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PostPosted: 12:38 - 04 Apr 2008    Post subject: Tyres for 600s Reply with quote

Right i had my first scare on my cbr6rr today.......did a quick overtake just out of a roundabout,clipped the white line and some dust and the back end slipped out big time!!!(almost highsided but i managed to keep hold and get it under control).

Its got some michelin pilot sports on atm and they`ve still got plenty of life in them but coz of what happened i don`t trust them now and want something else.

What are you 600 riders using on your bikes and how have you found them?
I`ve only just got this bike and i really don`t want it going in for repairs over summer coz the rubber let me down.......so i think i need some really sticky ones next to deal with the power...(no touring tryes!!)

Opinions....what`s best?
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Itchy
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PostPosted: 12:48 - 04 Apr 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bt14?
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Wafer_Thin_Ham
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PostPosted: 13:11 - 04 Apr 2008    Post subject: Re: Tyres for 600s Reply with quote

B_A_B wrote:
so i think i need some really sticky ones next to deal with the power...(no touring tryes!!)


Rolling Eyes

So you'll get track based tyres which won't get up to operating temperature on the road so you'll have even less grip.

I've got "sports touring" tyres on my mille, and they are 4 years old. I've never had problems with them either.

I found pilot sports to be an excellent tyre on my hornet, I never had any problems, it's all in your head, don't bother wasting £200.
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Last edited by Wafer_Thin_Ham on 13:14 - 04 Apr 2008; edited 1 time in total
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Ichy
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PostPosted: 13:13 - 04 Apr 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

I reckon a track day or a bit of advanced training might be money better spent. What happens when it happens on the new tyres?

The back end of a bike does slip occasionally, especially on white lines and bits of rubbish in the road, you need to get used to it and know how to react. What may feel like major sideways movement to you can be pretty small in real terms.
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cestrian
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PostPosted: 13:16 - 04 Apr 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think that could happen with any tyres. I use Avon Azaro ST sport/touring tyres and despite being able to crank it right over, the tyres are easily grippy enough for my capabilities.
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Kickstart
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PostPosted: 13:40 - 04 Apr 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi

Sticky tyres work when hot. Unless you are going to really push it (which could easily see you having a short life on the road) then they are not going to be better than the sports touring tyres, just last less time and probably work far worse in the wet.

Problem seems to be that you went over a dodgy bit of road. The tyres are not the problem. The road is.

All the best

Keith
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Pie-Roe
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PostPosted: 16:14 - 04 Apr 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have the cheapest tyres for my sizing. I think they are BT45s. I was happy with them when they came on it, and seeing the receipts for them and the time and mileage between them, I'm quite happy with them.

I assume they are fine for commuting, as the previous owner commutes a lot, but there is a distinct lackage of hero blobs, so it would seem they are fine for cranking over probably giving it some too.

I don't think its the tyres. You should ride in all weathers more. I noticed in the ice the back would slide out considerably, not dangerously as long as you just backed off and didn't lean against it. On white lines its not a problem at all. Think how big a white line is, then think how big a drain cover is, then think how bad an entire road of ice is. As soon as it the tyre leaves whichever one, it regains traction.

Pyro
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iooi
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PostPosted: 18:52 - 04 Apr 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

Think about the tyres. You get some super grippy ones like the racers and what happens to them when a racer goes off line onto the dirty stuff......
The tyre picks up all the crap and its a while before its cleaned off so they can go full tilt again. So in effect they will be even worse on the road, which is covered in rubbish.
Stick to what you have got if they are fine the rest of the time. Hone you senses and try to avoid the crap on the road while on a angle.
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MarJay
But it's British!



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PostPosted: 19:19 - 04 Apr 2008    Post subject: Re: Tyres for 600s Reply with quote

B_A_B wrote:

I`ve only just got this bike and i really don`t want it going in for repairs over summer coz the rubber let me down.......so i think i need some really sticky ones next to deal with the power...(no touring tryes!!)

Opinions....what`s best?


Sounds like the rider let you down, not the rubber.

Any tyre which is designed for your bike will give you more grip than you need on the road - with a caveat that super sticky and to some extent sporty road tyres will need lots of thrashing to warm them up properly. I'd be surprised if you ever got super sticky tyres up to temp on the road.

Anyway I'm digressing. I feel like you're prematurely blaming the tyres when actually there is nothing wrong with them. Quite often (although not always) when someone says "Whoah the back end stepped out by miles, but I managed to keep it upright" Actually they've only had a very small slide, but they've tensed up and somehow the bike has gone back into line. Now I don't want you to think I'm accusing you of being a poor rider, but thats what 90% of people do in my experience.

I'm not au fait on current michelin designations, but I'd guess that Pilot Sports aren't super sticky, which means they are either sporty road tyres or just plain road biassed tyres. In which case it won't have been the tyres which let you down.

You say that the bike kicked up a load of dust? Well, perhaps it was the dust which made you lose traction?

This situation is not a disaster, because the bike is naturally stable, as long as the rider is relaxed. The bike naturally wants to have the front and rear wheels in line, even when cranked over. However, human natural survival reactions include tensing up when in danger. This means that unless you have already trained out the survival reaction, you will have tensed up. What happens then is you fight the bike, when in actual fact you are either making over corrections, or you are fighting the bikes natural propensity to have its wheels in line. Both of which are bad.

Another possible explanation to this issue comes down to something that you may feel is irrelevant, that of rider weight. How much do you weigh? If its less than ten stone, then I would also hazard a guess that your rear suspension (and, indeed your fork) is set up too hard for your weight. This would mean that you ride permanently with the rear suspension 'topped out. This means that when you hit a bump, the bump is absorbed by the suspension, but as you come back down from the bump, there isn't a lot of travel to extend the suspension to touch the road again, meaning you lose traction.

If you weigh more than about 12 stone, and are riding on stock settings, we can pretty much rule that out too.

It sounds to me like you are looking for something to blame for what happened, but I don't think the tyres are a suitable culprit on this occasion. Unless you hadn't warmed them up, or they were brand new.

Oh, and to reiterate, don't feel like I'm accusing you of being a bad rider, because I crashed my bike with a combination of the above issues not more than two months ago. I had a brand new sporty road tyre on the rear of my bike. It was cold outside and the road was strewn with salt. I had adjusted my fork to suit my weight (~ 10st), but had not taken enough preload off of the shock.

The combination of brand new tyres which were stone cold, road salt, poor suspension setup and me tensing up when I felt the slide caused a tankslapper which I couldn't hold on to. I let the bike go and it slid into a kerb and flipped over.

At no point did I go to blame the make and model of tyre on the bike, and actually the blame falls squarely on me. I should have anticipated the conditions, I should have spent more time adjusting my suspension properly (or left it on stock settings, which may not have been so bad as I effectively sharpened the steering geometry by not adjusting the rear shock enough) and I should have remembered the bike had a brand new rear tyre with releasing compound all over it. I also should not have tensed up when I felt the slide, but who can blame me? I have done the california superbike school, who taught me about survival reactions, tensing up and rear slides, but when it comes to using the stuff for real its a little hard to recall it all! Wink

I'm certain that very few accidents are caused by tyres, and all single vehicle accidents are caused by the rider in some way - by definition.

My reccomendation to you would be - do some advanced training. Its better value for money than the tyres, as it could save your hide!! Smile
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01dabreoo
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PostPosted: 19:27 - 04 Apr 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

Metzler M3's feel awsome on my 400.
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alexhornet
Nitrous Nuisance



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PostPosted: 20:14 - 04 Apr 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

i have diablo's on my hornet 600, cant fault them at all but i chewed through one in 4000 miles.
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faith183uk
Nitrous Nuisance



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PostPosted: 01:59 - 05 Apr 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

dunlop sportmax

Ive been running the Pilot sport myself for a few years and really like them. But the best selling tyre from our place is the 207's sportmax. good price, great grip and lean angle believed tested at 50 degrees dry and 42 degress wet.

I have stickies on my gsxr750 and they are a nightmare, only put them on for the MOT off my SRAD track bike. without tyre warmers and our great roads they are crap until hot.

Have faith in your tyres though, white lines can be really slippery and no tyre regardless of make with stick to them, best to ease off throttle especially on bends if you anticipate running over them.

As long as you arent running GOLDENBOYS i think you will be fine

Think MAR JAY hit the nail on the head. Don't lose confidence in the bike or tyres.

I made a prick of myself just the other day pulling out my drive. Turned left on main road, opened throttle and lost rear end on cold tyres/cold road. Looked a right tit in front of everyone waiting for a bus. Luckily i didnt drop it, although the legs all over the place was embarrassing enough. Dont worry though i did the classic biker thing and road off down the road pretending to be looking at a problem at the rear of the bike like that was the cause and not my balls up.
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Ichy
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PostPosted: 13:10 - 05 Apr 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

faith183uk wrote:
Dont worry though i did the classic biker thing and road off down the road pretending to be looking at a problem at the rear of the bike like that was the cause and not my balls up.


Laughing Laughing

Works every time!
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instigator
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PostPosted: 13:21 - 05 Apr 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can barely tell the difference from touring and super sticky tyres these days, basically because I don't push it that far on the road. However, the Dunlop Sportmax GP Racer I had on ym zx6r seemed quite positive but only when warmed up.
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G
The Voice of Reason



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PostPosted: 13:47 - 05 Apr 2008    Post subject: Re: Tyres for 600s Reply with quote

Were your tyres warm?
I believe Pilot Sports are particularly bad grip-wise from cold.

While warm they should be fine - you won't get anything significantly grippier considering that you won't be keeping trackday tyres up to heat.

Pirilies should warm up faster - their track tyres are definitely much grippier from cold than the Pilot Race's - though about the same when warmed up.

As above; I'd be considering where you stick your tyres rather than what type they are... the best road tyre in the world still isn't going to grip on a patch of manure whatever compound you get Smile.
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B_A_B
Brolly Dolly



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PostPosted: 15:28 - 05 Apr 2008    Post subject: Reply with quote

o.k cheers for the replies lads.Some of the "rider error" comments might be true and i agree that`s "usually" the case...and don`t worry i haven`t taken what was said the wrong way. Wink

I`ve never had that happen before crossing the white line so instinctively i blamed the rubber....but as said already if id`ve read the road a bit better id`ve seen the dried mud stacked up and backed off a bit....but i didn`t...lol
The sun and the absence of wet tarmac lulled me into a false sense of security...lol....lesson learned eh.

I think i`m gonna get some fresh tyres on it anyway just for personal satisfaction.....so i`ll have a good read over some reviews and find some that match my riding style.

cheers... Cool
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timjim
Trackday Trickster



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PostPosted: 19:55 - 06 Apr 2008    Post subject: tyres Reply with quote

Bridgestone BT014s..used in all weathers..trust them 100%..get about 7000from a front and 4-5000 from a rear..perhaps a little more!! Thumbs Up
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