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Cannabis back to Class B and it's illogical

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SoND
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PostPosted: 02:07 - 26 Jan 2009    Post subject: Cannabis back to Class B and it's illogical Reply with quote

It doesn't make any sense and they're doing it anyway. Can someone explain?

Are they accidentally stupid or deliberately being cvnts?

https://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7850342.stm
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The Original Muzza
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PostPosted: 02:59 - 26 Jan 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

The latter.

Actually ... no. It's government, so both.
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Skudd
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PostPosted: 10:22 - 26 Jan 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Should make it Class A. Dirty stuff. Lock 'em up, throw the keys away, flog 'em daily, bread and water is too good for 'em. String 'em up high, flog their corpses, send them to Wales.
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Hetzer
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PostPosted: 10:57 - 26 Jan 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh listen to the scum of the magistrates association. "Oh pwease don't take the offence out of our courts!" The pathetic little jack-booted freaks that they are. Can't wait to stick their noses into other peoples business.

The law, telling you what you can and cannot put into your own body. And they have the effrontery to call this a free country?

The UK govt, bringing justice into disrepute since the civil war.
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Fawbish
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PostPosted: 12:10 - 26 Jan 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Theyre a set of cunts, simple as.


Why the fuck would you change it. Its not as if cannabis has suddenly transformed into a new, super dangerous drug.


"Stronger skunk variations" is their tagline.


Right. And where are they basing their opinions there then?

Pretty certain THEY dont fucking do the stuff, bunch of illogical, oxygen sapping shit swabs.
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Itchy
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PostPosted: 12:17 - 26 Jan 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hetzer wrote:
Oh listen to the scum of the magistrates association. "Oh pwease don't take the offence out of our courts!" The pathetic little jack-booted freaks that they are. Can't wait to stick their noses into other peoples business.

The law, telling you what you can and cannot put into your own body. And they have the effrontery to call this a free country?

The UK govt, bringing justice into disrepute since the civil war.



I think the issue is that you 'might' use the NHS and therefore end up costing the tax payer money , with alcohol and cigs you pay a hefty tax on such items to cover the potential 'harm' you may do yourself...

Cannabis isn't taxed (though they would love to tax it and distribute it legally I think in another generation it will be legalised).


Its why in the US where there is utterly minimal health care that is not private or insurance based (same as in China) where you can buy a ton of smokes for £2....


But this is bad as then it sets precedent of 'harm' tax , ie oh so you came off your bike at 152mph why should we treat you...etc...

and no I don't have the solution.
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ColdInsomnia
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PostPosted: 13:47 - 26 Jan 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

I happen to be sparking up right now.


Middle Finger Laughing Middle Finger
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ColdInsomnia
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PostPosted: 13:57 - 26 Jan 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anyway.


Totally illogical, unresponsible, and gob-smackingly pathetic of an increasingly despised government. This will do literally NOTHING but put even more strain on our police, judicial system and prisons.


Absolutely retarded in every sense of the word.
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Charlie
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PostPosted: 23:43 - 26 Jan 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hetzer wrote:
The law, telling you what you can and cannot put into your own body. And they have the effrontery to call this a free country?


Not when it is my tax that is paying to fix people up after abusing their body.

If your go to the NHS and are in need of medical attention and the reason is down to illegal drugs (read untaxed) which have been obviously been taken deliberately then you should pay.

I really don't have a problem with people doing illegal drugs, it is up to them, it is their body. I do think the government interferes with our lives to much, they put rules in place to protect please imaginary majority groups, when at the end of the day they are a small minority. But I don't want to pay for people who at the end of the day will put my taxes up (but at the end of the day I guess taxes will go up no matter what).

If the majority of the population smoked weed then the law is pointless as people are willing to go against the governments risk rating system (which I guess is what the Class A, B, C system really is) then they need not bother with the law and save police time to find some proper criminals.

[Edit]
If they legalised it and taxed it then I'd be totally fine with it, personally I don't do weed, but like I said I have never been negatively effected by it in any way (except a smelly kitchen after friends smoked it in there).

Only reason for re-classifying I can see is to and try and ward people off from trying it and then becoming a regular, doubt it will stop many people. [/edit]

Some random ramblings from a non tax paying student that will most likely get ripped apart. Rolling Eyes
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Kickstart
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PostPosted: 23:50 - 26 Jan 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hetzer wrote:
Oh listen to the scum of the magistrates association. "Oh pwease don't take the offence out of our courts!" The pathetic little jack-booted freaks that they are. Can't wait to stick their noses into other peoples business.


I do have a tiny bit of sympathy there. Don't agree that it should be reclassified, but if it is being reclassified then it seems really screwey to have a seperate half baked penalty system. And surprised you are happy with the police handing out fixed penalty tickets.

ds55 wrote:
But I don't want to pay for people who at the end of the day will put my taxes up (but at the end of the day I guess taxes will go up no matter what).


Where do you draw the line though? Refuse NHS treatment for alcohol? How about for any road accident where the victim wasn't in the safest form of transport they could have chosen? How about any form of pregnancy treatment? All a pretty much the NHS picking up the tab for someone choice.

All the best

Keith
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Charlie
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PostPosted: 00:19 - 27 Jan 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kickstart wrote:
Where do you draw the line though? Refuse NHS treatment for alcohol? How about for any road accident where the victim wasn't in the safest form of transport they could have chosen? How about any form of pregnancy treatment?


Legal drugs such as alcohol and smoking are taxed quite heavily and part if not most of this money should be spent on it. Why else can they justify taxing it?

Pregnancy, if they are repeat offenders then should be given a couple of chances, but I guess this would be un-enforceable with the current system (such as drop in clinics). I mean you can get condoms and the pill free from the NHS.

I am sure some people would have the view that motorcyclists shouldn't be given treatment on the NHS due to the number of accidents and the costly nature of them. But at the end it is something totally legal so we aren't doing anything wrong.... but then I guess this would mean if you where speeding then it shouldn't be covered.

Like you say this is where I draw the line and there for isn't a true representation of the population, however they would never get a decent representation of the population, so you could never draw a line.

The problems with a free country and democracy.
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Kickstart
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PostPosted: 00:42 - 27 Jan 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

ds55 wrote:
I am sure some people would have the view that motorcyclists shouldn't be given treatment on the NHS due to the number of accidents and the costly nature of them. But at the end it is something totally legal so we aren't doing anything wrong.... but then I guess this would mean if you where speeding then it shouldn't be covered.


So if cannabis was totally legal then it would be OK for it to be treated? Seems the logical solution would be to legalise it then Wink .

ds55 wrote:
Like you say this is where I draw the line and there for isn't a true representation of the population, however they would never get a decent representation of the population, so you could never draw a line.


True, but if you accept that people can put themselves at risk of harm (eg, drinking, riding bikes or even just deciding to have a kid) then there seems no reason to ban a pretty mild drug.

All the best

Keith
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Charlie
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PostPosted: 02:12 - 27 Jan 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kickstart wrote:
So if cannabis was totally legal then it would be OK for it to be treated? Seems the logical solution would be to legalise it then Wink .


Yeah it would, but it would never happen because the government believe they should meld with what we can and can't do because they have to pick the bill up for it at the end of the day when it goes pair shaped. Although I am sure there could be away of calculating this risk involved with certain actions. If this risk was deemed too high then it would be illegal, if it was low enough it would be legal and taxed so that they covered their own back... meaning at the end of the day if you where wanting to do anything with a reasonably high risk you'd have to be pretty rich. Which is sort of done by insurance in the current situation.

Kickstart wrote:
True, but if you accept that people can put themselves at risk of harm (eg, drinking, riding bikes or even just deciding to have a kid) then there seems no reason to ban a pretty mild drug.


Personally I am not to sure if banning weed has a positive effect or a negative effect. On the one hand, it can lead to the use of harsher drugs, I have seen this first hand... but the percentage of this compared to people smoking it and sticking to it is very small, but not quite negligible.

But if it wasn't banned then it could be taxed and side effects payed for by the correct tax.

To be honest the number of people that I know who have smoked weed at least once or on a regular basis would justify it being made legal. I take it from your comments Keith you would have no problems with it being legalised?

Still wouldn't try it myself.
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D O G
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PostPosted: 03:23 - 27 Jan 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

article wrote:
However Debra Bell, who says her son became aggressive and dishonest after first smoking the drug aged 14, told the BBC the age of users is falling and the damage to families is acute


Yup, I bet that it was all down to the drugs. All of it. Nothing at all to do with the fact he was turning into an uppity teenager.

What a loon.

The logical step is just to legalise all drugs and 'control' them just as alcohol is. Instant reduction in crime figures, massive revenue boost, improved quality (and therefore safety), and massive savings in administration and policing.
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Nufkamp
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PostPosted: 08:09 - 27 Jan 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

ds55, did you have a bet with somebody on how many times you can insert "at the end of the day" into this thread?

Or have you been at the old super skunk? Very Happy
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Charlie
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PostPosted: 09:59 - 27 Jan 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Embarassed Laughing

Well it was getting to the end of the day when I posted yesterday Rolling Eyes
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killa
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PostPosted: 10:15 - 27 Jan 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

There's more people in hospitals suffering from DIY related incidents than anything to do with weed. The government don't talk about the harsher, readily available dirty drugs like MDMA and KET. It cheap, strong and prone to make people do odd things, like dance for a long period of time and make loads of friends.
Weed is the LEAST of anyone's worries in terms of drugs, legal, non legal, super strength, mild crap weed. Its pathetic...the number of users getting into a K-hole is on the rise, usually where ever there's a bag of weed someones got some mandy.

The governments so out of touch its un-real. My mum, dad, sisters...me, all smoked at some point. We're fine, for the families that aren't fine, is it a result of drugs? Sometimes...
Some families approach breaking point because the government turn a blind eye to their needs, or just sqeeze them a little more. A government can destroy a family and they don't even have to touch drugs. Anyway, im rambling.
Like drink, teens go off their heads, drinking cheap skanky cider in the gallons.
Teens also experiment a little too much with weed, buckets & drainers for example are giving you more THC levels etc than these scientists can comprehend. lol
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Hetzer
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PostPosted: 12:15 - 27 Jan 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kickstart wrote:
Hetzer wrote:
Oh listen to the scum of the magistrates association. "Oh pwease don't take the offence out of our courts!" The pathetic little jack-booted freaks that they are. Can't wait to stick their noses into other peoples business.


I do have a tiny bit of sympathy there. Don't agree that it should be reclassified, but if it is being reclassified then it seems really screwey to have a seperate half baked penalty system. And surprised you are happy with the police handing out fixed penalty tickets.



All the best

Keith


I'm not happy with any of it, but hearing the magistrates whining about their perception one of their new balls is going to be taken out of play makes me drip contempt. Why should they give a toss? If it comes up in front of them they deal with it. If it doesn't, so what? All about power and ego is what it is. Vile little kapos, all self-important and oh so eager to judge, according to their sick, twisted, narrow little view of reality.

Too many people too eager to stick their noses into other peoples' business. A nation of kapos and block-wardens, courtesy of Zanu Labour, the new fascist regime.

Thou shalt not kill....fair do.

Thou shalt not partake of a plant...get to fvck, you sub-human, control-freak, tyrannical nazi vermin. Middle Finger Evil or Very Mad
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Kickstart
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PostPosted: 13:04 - 27 Jan 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

ds55 wrote:
Yeah it would, but it would never happen because the government believe they should meld with what we can and can't do because they have to pick the bill up for it at the end of the day when it goes pair shaped.


That smacks of the only reason being that it is the law, and that is to me pretty much the weakest reason there can be. Law should reflect peoples general wishes, not control those wishes, hence for pretty much everyone the law should be something that they would not break even unknowingly.

ds55 wrote:
Personally I am not to sure if banning weed has a positive effect or a negative effect. On the one hand, it can lead to the use of harsher drugs, I have seen this first hand... but the percentage of this compared to people smoking it and sticking to it is very small, but not quite negligible.


Personally think that banning it has next to no positive benefits. Sure a few people do have issues after (ab)using it, but not convinced that most would not have similar issues if they decided to abuse other things (eg, alcohol). There is also the issue of it being regarded as a "gateway drug", but I regard this as being a problem caused by its banning (due to the circles some will meet with to buy their supplies), and legalising it would remove this issue.

ds55 wrote:
To be honest the number of people that I know who have smoked weed at least once or on a regular basis would justify it being made legal. I take it from your comments Keith you would have no problems with it being legalised?


No issue at all with it being legalised. Why people want to use drugs to loose control of themselves is a seperate issue.

Hetzer wrote:
I'm not happy with any of it, but hearing the magistrates whining about their perception one of their new balls is going to be taken out of play makes me drip contempt. Why should they give a toss?


There is meant to be a legal process, with those doing the investigating being seperate from those who doing the trials. That those who do the investigating can also act as judge, jury and executioner is a very dubious idea (although this is just the last example of this dubious idea). As such they are quite right to give a toss about the destruction of a system which they are part of.

All the best

Keith
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Kwaks
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PostPosted: 13:26 - 27 Jan 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Confused Surely everyone accepts the damage Cannabis does to memory?

Most regular users I know certainly have short term memory problems.

Does no-one even consider the Government may be trying to stop an increase of future problems in mental health?

No-one likes to be told what not to do. Sometimes though that advice/order can be the best thing.

I have no problem with whatever classification it is in, they downgraded it and it seems problems have increased to the point thats it needs upgraded again.

Lets try to remember the other effects of people smoking cannabis, how many people do you think are driving with their judgement impaired by the use of so-called "harmless recreational drugs"
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Kickstart
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PostPosted: 13:37 - 27 Jan 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

kwaker6r wrote:
Confused Surely everyone accepts the damage Cannabis does to memory?


Doubt it, but plenty of other things cause issues. And to be honest it is up to the individual it affects to take the decision.

kwaker6r wrote:
No-one likes to be told what not to do. Sometimes though that advice/order can be the best thing.


Why? For example, being bossed around and controlled will increase the stress people feel under, and that in itself can have negative effects.

kwaker6r wrote:
Lets try to remember the other effects of people smoking cannabis, how many people do you think are driving with their judgement impaired by the use of so-called "harmless recreational drugs"


Which is a very seperate idea. Do we ban alcohol because some people might drive while under the influence of it? Similarly do we ban people from taking kids in cars as their driving will suffer from the stress of arguing kids?

All the best

Keith
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killa
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PostPosted: 14:03 - 27 Jan 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

It is a little more complicated than 'it shortens your memory'
I think every drug can cause ill effects on the brain long term. Drink is one you know about straight away.

Varying degrees of everything, i guess its an odd one.
There are a multitude of legal things that can kill you, and others, if you have a pop at it too often. But thats alright. Rolling Eyes

The government aren't taking steps towards benefiting our next generation, if you believe that, you need help.

kwaker6r wrote:
Does no-one even consider the Government may be trying to stop an increase of future problems in mental health?


Laughing Ha..you're one of them. Sorry
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ColdInsomnia
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PostPosted: 14:22 - 27 Jan 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

It is quite possible that weed can have negative effects on mental health. Especially with individuals that have pre-existing mental issues (just the same as alcohol can amplify these problems).

It IS worth noting however, that weed has shown in some studies to have positive effects on health; such as evidence for slowing the advancement of arthritis and even alzhiemers. And the benefits of using hemp as a textile are well accepted.



As for the whole "it'll put more strain on the NHS" arguement, that's utter bollocks. Not a single person has ever OD'd on weed, even with the super-scary ultra-strength hyper-strains which the government feebly attempts to convince people that exist.

Drugs are a part of life on this Earth. Like it or not, creating a "law" against it and then being done with it is never going to be rid of the problem (short of giving everyone on Earth a frontal labotomy and creating a race of identical drones). Outlawing anything will never prevent it and generally just causes problems for otherwise law-biding respectable citizens as well as puts more strain on the judicial system.

Like all drugs, legalise, regulate, study, research, educate.

I suspect many people are sucked in to the drug culture because of it's 'taboo' reputation.. as some sort of rebellion against a conformist and money driven society. It's probably better that these sort of people are left to ruin their lives via the use of 'illegal' drugs. Rolling Eyes
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killa
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PostPosted: 14:45 - 27 Jan 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

The government aren't trying to help any of us. With that simple lesson over it should be pointed out in this topic, the main focus shouldn't be the wobbly facts given to us over the years, its the dealers.
Earning tax free money from selling something which gains you respect/money and power is something government know about in great detail and control it, this is a way of doing it,
Its not conspiricy, it's about getting something out of it, which they are.
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pa_broon74
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PostPosted: 16:22 - 27 Jan 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wouldn't have thought what classification it had would have any effect on how people (young or old) used it. No way is a 15yo going to say "I'd better not, its a class A drug, but if you have anything in class C..."

The Gov are having a 'drive' at the moment about long term mental effects cannabis might have. I rather suspect its a ploy they're using to raise revenue from the on the spot second offence fines and to soften us up in general for other tax rises citing the NHS as a reason.

To be honest, I'm surprised the government hasn't legalised it. Going by the shite peddled on the TV on a weekend evening (which is just novocaine for the brain & soul) to keep the masses anaethsetised, cannabis could do it much more effectively.

There is also a real risk of a violent side effect if to much time is spent viewing Celebrity Family fucking Fortunes with that arse Vernon Kaye. This wouldn't be the case if you were stoned... I think Ginster's should probably lobby the government...

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