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Anyone got swine flu?

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Vin
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PostPosted: 21:56 - 27 Apr 2009    Post subject: Anyone got swine flu? Reply with quote

Well?
The media says we'll all be dead by lunchtime Mr. Green
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JonB
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PostPosted: 21:57 - 27 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm soooo tempted to go to Tesco and buy 300 odd cans of baked beans. Thumbs Up Mr. Green

Interestingly the strain of Flu H1N1 is the same as the famed "spanish flu" of 1918.
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Vin
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PostPosted: 22:01 - 27 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jon B:
Is that the one that killed more people that WW1?
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JonB
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PostPosted: 22:05 - 27 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes. Indeed it is.

I'm only /slightly/ concerned about the threat, if I have to stay indoors and kill my days off playing GTA IV I don't particularly mind.

Do find it rather odd that the people dying are young healthy people though.
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Vin
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PostPosted: 22:17 - 27 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

So the fact that I am old, fat and unhealthy means I am ok.....Hurrah Very Happy
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Skudd
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PostPosted: 22:46 - 27 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Vin wrote:
So the fact that I am old, fat and unhealthy means I am ok.....Hurrah Very Happy


I'm ok too Thumbs Up
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Charlie
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PostPosted: 23:27 - 27 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

It isn't the British flu season so there is a less of a chance we will get it badly.

Mum (who is a nurse) found it quite worrying because apparently the virus is targeting the people who are consider to be least at risk to it. Also said that if an outbreak does occur it will be in the general flu vaccine next year.
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Pie-Roe
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PostPosted: 00:19 - 28 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

You know after all this I've come out in a bit of a rasher, maybe I need some oinkment....

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Itchy
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PostPosted: 00:24 - 28 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

There was something about this I read about a few months ago.

In that such flu is more lethal to younger people due to the fact that their immune systems are more powerful which is what kills them , in that some sort of histamine reaction occurs pumping a defence chemical into the blood large amounts of it which as a side effect causes the lungs to fill up with fluid.

If you are older the reaction is slower and less effective such that you can choke the fluid back out of your lungs with little problem , while the younger people have to have tubes stuffed into their lungs for it to be drained out.

Stick a bloke on a ventilator/lung draining machine and he is ok, the big problem is the lack of ventilators , in that the NHS has barely any excess capacity now.
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Phoenix
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PostPosted: 03:19 - 28 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'll start worrying when swathes of people in this country who are fit and healthy start dying, doubt it's going to turn into anything even remotely approaching that though. Still, I do believe that ultimately when the world becomes grossly overpopulated or certain areas do then nature will do it's job and most likely a virus will curb the population, don't think we're quite there yet though.
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chris-red
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PostPosted: 05:44 - 28 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think animal farm got 21st century,

"4 legs good 2 legs bad"
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GhostRider
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PostPosted: 10:14 - 28 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Itchy wrote:
There was something about this I read about a few months ago.

In that such flu is more lethal to younger people due to the fact that their immune systems are more powerful which is what kills them , in that some sort of histamine reaction occurs pumping a defence chemical into the blood large amounts of it which as a side effect causes the lungs to fill up with fluid.

If you are older the reaction is slower and less effective such that you can choke the fluid back out of your lungs with little problem , while the younger people have to have tubes stuffed into their lungs for it to be drained out.

Stick a bloke on a ventilator/lung draining machine and he is ok, the big problem is the lack of ventilators , in that the NHS has barely any excess capacity now.


AKA a cytokine storm, kind of like a nut allergy but it's more to do with pro-inflammatory mediators called cytokines rather than mass histamine release caused by degranulation of mast cells.

I can't help but think the "hygiene hypothesis" might have something to do with it as well, in that less exposure to pathogens and viruses leave our immune system incapable of mounting an effective response a first presentation, but thats just my take on it.

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Itchy
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PostPosted: 10:24 - 28 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

GhostRider wrote:


AKA a cytokine storm, kind of like a nut allergy but it's more to do with pro-inflammatory mediators called cytokines rather than mass histamine release caused by degranulation of mast cells.

I can't help but think the "hygiene hypothesis" might have something to do with it as well, in that less exposure to pathogens and viruses leave our immune system incapable of mounting an effective response a first presentation, but thats just my take on it.

GhostRider


Britain will be alright then, with some appauling hygene standards that I have witnessed and the enourmous amount of dodgy kebabs British people have consumed swine flu will just be a minor footnote in history.
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yuri2085
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PostPosted: 12:03 - 28 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you want to be a doomsayer you should complain about how CLEAN Britain is, and hence we will all die.
Living in (moderatley) unhygenic conditions strengthens your immune system Smile
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Visitor Q
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PostPosted: 12:24 - 28 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

yuri2085 wrote:
If you want to be a doomsayer you should complain about how CLEAN Britain is, and hence we will all die.
Living in (moderatley) unhygenic conditions strengthens your immune system Smile


so does picking youur nose and eating it Thumbs Up

i'll worry when the death toll is in 6 figures.
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cheesyleps
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PostPosted: 21:42 - 28 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

GhostRider wrote:
I can't help but think the "hygiene hypothesis" might have something to do with it as well, in that less exposure to pathogens and viruses leave our immune system incapable of mounting an effective response a first presentation, but thats just my take on it.


One of my favourite theories and seemingly being borne out by the prevalence of allergies among children these days. Would love to see some statistics on the increase in allergies over the past two hundred years.

Mentioned this hypothesis to one of the fillipino officers I was sailing with recently. In the Phillippines they have a saying "Only the rich can afford to have allergies."

It may not even be a side effect of hygiene, it could purely be a side effect of modern medicine interfering with natural selection. Before modern medicine, if you got ill, you either died or survived. If you survive, you probably have a better immune system than those that died and were able to pass this on to your offspring.

Ergo, the weak perish and the strong survive. Now, if you have a weak immune system, modern medicine can cure you and you pass that weak system on to the next generation.

To go back to the filipino wisdom, you don't see poor people with allergies because they are already dead. They don't have the right genetic traits to survive in their environment, therefore they die and don't pass on their DNA.

Natural selection at it's simplest and most elegant.
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Visitor Q
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PostPosted: 22:06 - 28 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

cheesyleps wrote:

Natural selection at it's simplest and most elegant.


Not quite. Flu viruses by themselves are natural selection at its most elegant, seriously cool things.

When this strain mutates to be more virulent, then I'll concern myself. The problem is, it wouldn't take much.

Anyhew, allergies are best thought of as a bored immune system. Ever notice you can guess which kids/adults have allergies normally, on the basis of them being 'nerdy'.

This is I believe is more to do with over protective parents, who try to get rid of all possible germs and discourage dirty play.

I will healthily encourage my children to eat their snot for a start, its an impulse for a reason.
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cheesyleps
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PostPosted: 22:22 - 28 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Virii are extremely elegant, especially the cold in using a natural bodily reaction to spread (the cough or sneeze).

My comment refers to the idea that if your genetic traits aren't suited to your environment, then you die and another with the correct traits survives. That is natural selection condensed into it's simplest form.

Survival of the fittest, although sometimes misleading and not actually coined by Darwin himself, is still a great concept.
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SpicyBlimp
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PostPosted: 22:54 - 28 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

cheesyleps wrote:
GhostRider wrote:
I can't help but think the "hygiene hypothesis" might have something to do with it as well, in that less exposure to pathogens and viruses leave our immune system incapable of mounting an effective response a first presentation, but thats just my take on it.


One of my favourite theories and seemingly being borne out by the prevalence of allergies among children these days. Would love to see some statistics on the increase in allergies over the past two hundred years.

Mentioned this hypothesis to one of the fillipino officers I was sailing with recently. In the Phillippines they have a saying "Only the rich can afford to have allergies."

It may not even be a side effect of hygiene, it could purely be a side effect of modern medicine interfering with natural selection. Before modern medicine, if you got ill, you either died or survived. If you survive, you probably have a better immune system than those that died and were able to pass this on to your offspring.

Ergo, the weak perish and the strong survive. Now, if you have a weak immune system, modern medicine can cure you and you pass that weak system on to the next generation.

To go back to the filipino wisdom, you don't see poor people with allergies because they are already dead. They don't have the right genetic traits to survive in their environment, therefore they die and don't pass on their DNA.

Natural selection at it's simplest and most elegant.


Sorry for the strange hi-jack, but who do you work for lol
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Visitor Q
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PostPosted: 23:11 - 28 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

cheesyleps wrote:
Virii are extremely elegant, especially the cold in using a natural bodily reaction to spread (the cough or sneeze).

My comment refers to the idea that if your genetic traits aren't suited to your environment, then you die and another with the correct traits survives. That is natural selection condensed into it's simplest form.

Survival of the fittest, although sometimes misleading and not actually coined by Darwin himself, is still a great concept.


Grandmothers and egg felatio sunshine Wink
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From September 2014 to January/February 2015 I will not be using any English, nor reading any. As such, I won't be on here. PM at will, but I won't be checking/posting unless in emergencies. Certainly not for the first couple of months. Please berate me savagely if I break that rule...
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igiyf
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PostPosted: 23:50 - 28 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Meanwhile, leading health officials said today that four in 10 Britons could catch the deadly swine flu virus within the next six months


https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-wellbeing/health-news/four-in-10-britons-could-fall-ill-in-flu-pandemic-1675367.html
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GhostRider
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PostPosted: 00:03 - 29 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

cheesyleps wrote:


Mentioned this hypothesis to one of the fillipino officers I was sailing with recently. In the Phillippines they have a saying "Only the rich can afford to have allergies."

It may not even be a side effect of hygiene, it could purely be a side effect of modern medicine interfering with natural selection. Before modern medicine, if you got ill, you either died or survived. If you survive, you probably have a better immune system than those that died and were able to pass this on to your offspring.

Ergo, the weak perish and the strong survive. Now, if you have a weak immune system, modern medicine can cure you and you pass that weak system on to the next generation.

To go back to the filipino wisdom, you don't see poor people with allergies because they are already dead. They don't have the right genetic traits to survive in their environment, therefore they die and don't pass on their DNA.


An interesting disease is Leprosy, because depending on how your immune system reacts to it, depends on the type of disease you get. If your immune response is primarily what is called a "Th1 subset" response, you develop Tuberculoid Leprosy, for which there is some damage to the skin and peripheral nerves with slow progression and long term survial. Conversely, if the immune response is primarily a "Th2 subset" response, you get lepromatous leprosy and it spreads like a bastard causing extensive damage to the whole body.

Incidentally, it is the same Th2 subset that is involved in allergies and hypersensitivity reactions.

Interesting take on the effects of modern medicine, hadn't thought about it like that before.

GhostRider
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I have all the characteristics of a human being: blood, flesh, skin, hair; but not a single, clear, identifiable emotion, except for greed and disgust. Something horrible is happening inside of me and I don't know why. My nightly bloodlust has overflown into my days. I feel lethal, on the verge of frenzy. I think my mask of sanity is about to slip.
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Visitor Q
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PostPosted: 00:10 - 29 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you're interested by that, have a look for stuff regarding hookworm infections 'curing' asthma.

It's quite widely known, although they're not certain why yet (well, back when I first heard about it, it may have changed now).

'Robert Desovitz - Tales of Jewish grandmothers and tapeworms' covers it at one point and is a great book if you like tropical diseases Thumbs Up Very dry humour too Laughing
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cheesyleps
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PostPosted: 02:11 - 29 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

Iain 007 wrote:
Sorry for the strange hi-jack, but who do you work for lol


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bonny_ricardo wrote:
Grandmothers and egg felatio sunshine Wink


I know, I was simply clarifying my point slightly.
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Phoenix
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PostPosted: 03:59 - 29 Apr 2009    Post subject: Reply with quote

mad_man wrote:
Quote:
Meanwhile, leading health officials said today that four in 10 Britons could catch the deadly swine flu virus within the next six months



In a way I kind of hope it does happen, and Gordon Brown drowns in his own mucous while delivering a live party poltical broadcast. Oh well, one can dream.
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