Im curious.........

[bugsy46]

I was thinking back the other day to when I bought my first bike 4 years ago cagiva mito (brand new). I then read a post about how delicate you have to be when running the bike in.

So to the curiosity of my subject we begin..........

Firstly, I have worked for a bike dealership as a technician with no full license to undertake road tests when doing the pdi. It makes me wonder if any technician actually revs the bike over the running in limit when out on a road test! What do you guys reckon? Could be a way for the dealership to make some money hay?!!!

Secondly,

I also remember my CBT. Now it was my first bike and I didnt know anything about running in as the bike came in the dealers van to the training area! Being excited I give the bike some good revs to begin with! But thinking back to when we were on the road with the instructors I was scared to change up and held it in high revs in low gears for ages!!! Do you folks reckon the dealer or the instructor should cast up the importance of running in a 2 stroke motorcycle?

Your thoughts would be much appreciated

thanks
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Laura - "And where did looks come into this and bugsy leave steven alone. You are not gods gift to women you may think you are but you're not."
Keith - "All the best"

[Rory]

Some people advocate a hard running in at varying engne speeds, rather than the kid gloves approach, and I (think I) agree. The manufactures can't recommend a hard-running in because they'd be liable to get sued if someone crashed their new bike. More info at https://www.mototuneusa.com/thanx.htm
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My Old CBR400RR | Bike Oil FAQ | Petrol FAQ

[Claud 14.7 to 1]

[Rory]

If a manufacturer tells you to take it easy, and you go banzai and crash, it's in no way their fault. If they told you to rev to the redline in every gear, someone would come a cropper and the factory would get sued. It's about limiting their exposure.

... I think
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My Old CBR400RR | Bike Oil FAQ | Petrol FAQ

[Claud 14.7 to 1]

If thats the case, then why don't they just not suggest a run-in procedure at all. Let the customer do what they want with the new machine... If it doesnt matter.

That site annoys me. No-one else says the same thing. It is a poorly made site, and he always refers to his gay "secret brake in" procedure. Well its not secret anymore, lol. I just dont buy it. Its like he askes you to subscribe then never he updates the site...

[Rory]

I won't deny that it looks horrible

The guy doesn't make any attempt to deny the fact general consensus goes against him (in fact he points it out himself). His point of view though is that just because he's running contrary to popular opinion (and the manufacturers themselves), that does not in-and-of itself make him wrong. Some of the arcticles, culminating in the rather-technical article 24, "Circular Logic" explain why he believes it to be the case, and having considered his argument, I can see the merit in it. I've never had an opportunity to try it out however.

Ignoring the break-in stuff, he makes interesting points about thinking for yourself, and not accepting other opinions for the wrong reaons. The recommended break-in is a gentle one, yet there is anecdotal evidence that not only do riders get better performance from a hard break-in, but that the factories (bike and car), thrash their engines before selling them. If you take the latter to be true, you're faced with the question of why a manufacturer would recommend one thing and do another. The only answer I can think of is that the gentle break-in is not for the engine's benefit.

Unfortunately this is one of those "holy war" topics, which can't really be settled either way...
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My Old CBR400RR | Bike Oil FAQ | Petrol FAQ

[Claud 14.7 to 1]

Yeah but all the stuff you have said is exactly the things he talks about... I need a 3rd party's views/evidence. I cannot find anyone

Ah well my bike is long past any run-in procedure, and i dont think i will ever buy a brand new bike, so i wont let it bother me too much.

[Rory]

Indeed!
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My Old CBR400RR | Bike Oil FAQ | Petrol FAQ

[Claud 14.7 to 1]

[Scooby]

These days 'running in' isn't as vital as it used to be. Brand new 4 stroke bikes these days can quite happily be thrashed from new and apart from the odd exception, you're not going to have any problems so long as you service it regularly. 2 strokes are a little bit more of a concern, mainly due to the aluminium piston expanding at a much faster rate than the cast iron barrel, but still, not as vital as it used to be.
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A big enough hammer fixes anything!

[tgabber]

I suppose one thing to be said for a gentle running in is that if you're unlucky enough to have a bike that's got a manufacturing defect it's better to find out at 50mph and 6,000 rpm than at 90 and 10,000 rpm!
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"It's all about dislocating expectation"
Kawasaki KMX125 -> Aprilia RS125 -> Kawasaki ZZR600

[Kickstart]

Hi

My feeling is that running them in properly will lead to a longer engine life, although thrashing them in is likely to land up with wider clearances which are probably better for performance.

2 stroke barrels and pistons are pretty much a muchness with 4 stroke ones. Similar piston material, and both will use either cast iron or plated bores. 2 strokes do have irty great holes in the barrel which give the rings a harder time.

Engine life wise the makers probably do not care too much as by the time it is of any relevance it is several owners old and well out of warrenty. Same applies to cars. When we had problems with the Clio as 50000 miles / years old Renaults comment was pretty much "What do you expect on such an old and high mileage car".

What is worth noting is that the makers might well have used a different oil when thevehicle is new to enable it to run in. For this reason doing an early oil change can be worse for the engine.

All the best

Keith
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Traxpics, track day and racing photographs - Bimota Forum - Bike performance / thrust graphs for choosing gearing

[Claud 14.7 to 1]

[Rory]

[Claud 14.7 to 1]

Maybey, but the increaded load will wear out the rings more, so for the short term they will be a good seal and give good power outputs, but in the long run they will have worn faster and more, and maybey not in such a gradual way...

Well thats what i think anyway. Plus you have all the other points which could possible benefit from a slower run-in procedure like bearings and such like.

Anyway they run in race engines "slowly" as well so they cant be wrong.

[TheShaggyDA]

I like the sound of the "hard run in", but I don't think I could ever bring myself to do it. The pictoral evidence is quite convincing, but there's this voice at the back of my head going "you don't want to do that...."

Maybe when I've got a few grand to throw away, I'll give it a try.
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Current: CB500 Previous: CB100N, CB250RS, XJ900F, GT550, GPZ750R/1000RX, AJS M16, R100RT, Enfield Bullet

[i:6e3bfc7581]But still I fear and still I dare not laugh at the madman...[/i:6e3bfc7581]

[Robby]

I'm getting an old gsx250 in a few days that I'm going to mess around with. If I give it a rebuild, which is possible, I'll probably give it a hard run in and see what happens.

[Rory]

[Claud 14.7 to 1]

Hehe what about it, ^^^^^^^^

[mchaggis]

I've been slowly running mine in, had no trouble with it so far (except crashing and having a five week hiatus ). One thing to note though, having just changed the oil at 250 miles, it was a black sludge, full of rubbish. Once I'd put nice new Castrol in, it not only idled better, but ran much more smoothly and sounded much less rough. Keeping that oil in till 500 miles?

[Claud 14.7 to 1]

Well Mcshaggis, im not 100% on the exact change oil period. 500m is an educated guestimate. If you change it too early you risk putting too "good" an oil in that wont be as effective as the first lower grade oil for run-in process.

Its up to manufactures recomendations, i'd say. Always best to check.

[carvell]

Every 500 miles? That's insane. I'd be doing it every 4 weeks if that was the service interval. Some people would be doing it every 1-2 weeks.

A few thousand is a more realistic oil change interval.
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Yamaha TDM 850

[mchaggis]

That was after 500 miles when you're breaking it in, rather than just general use. So long as you use non-synthetic mineral oil when you're running it in, there shouldn't be a problem from what I've read. I've been gradually increasing the revs, load and gear over the past 250 miles; now just broaching the beginnings of fifth, and I'm not red lining it at all.

Breaking in 2t engines I don't know much about, they want fully synth once they're broken in, but super slippery oil's not good for breaking in with, so... ?

[Claud 14.7 to 1]

[Rory]