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Three myths that block progress for the poor.

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Lord Percy
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PostPosted: 15:44 - 21 Jan 2014    Post subject: Three myths that block progress for the poor. Reply with quote
https://annualletter.gatesfoundation.org/?cid=gf_fb_tgm0_011918/#section=home

Long read but quite interesting I think.

It's sort of made me slightly rethink my stance on charity, but only slightly. I still think most problems would be solved much faster by other (mostly political) means.
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smegballs
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PostPosted: 16:21 - 21 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Bill Gates wrote:
The idea that this will happen within my lifetime is simply amazing to me.


Like he won't live forever on his techno-throne. I'm sure he already has a whole selection of clone bodies grown in vats ready.
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Benno
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PostPosted: 16:49 - 21 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
smegballs wrote:
Bill Gates wrote:
The idea that this will happen within my lifetime is simply amazing to me.


Like he won't live forever on his techno-throne. I'm sure he already has a whole selection of clone bodies grown in vats ready.


https://theshellcase.files.wordpress.com/2012/07/god-emperor.jpg

This is our future. Tens of thousands of us will be sacrificed, daily, to sustain our rich masters.

(Or if you believe in metaphors, that is exactly what is happening right now.)
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temeluchus
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PostPosted: 18:22 - 21 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
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ninja_butler
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PostPosted: 18:55 - 21 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
↑

Somebody's a fan of 40K... I hate 40K
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 19:25 - 21 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
ninja_butler wrote:
Somebody's a fan of 40K... I hate 40K

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ninja_butler
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PostPosted: 19:45 - 21 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
I read some of the article but then I took a short cut; I skipped to the bottom of the page where as I suspected I found the old "click here to buy our product" links. Granted it's links to charities, but even so they are not charities I trust and the article grossly misrepresents the scale of corruption that goes on in those Countries.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2002319/UK-aid-cash-helped-African-dictator-buy-30m-jet.html
https://www.forbes.com/sites/mfonobongnsehe/2011/10/26/u-s-government-moves-against-african-dictators-son/

Foreign-aid charities are a gravy train for corrupt officials in Africa and to a lesser degree for the people who run them for a high salary (and don't forget the little perks, like a company car).


edit*

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Lord Percy
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PostPosted: 20:07 - 21 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
ninja_butler wrote:
grossly misrepresents the scale of corruption that goes on in those Countries.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2002319/UK-aid-cash-helped-African-dictator-buy-30m-jet.html
https://www.forbes.com/sites/mfonobongnsehe/2011/10/26/u-s-government-moves-against-african-dictators-son/


You should probably have skipped a bit less and gone to the middle bit, myth number 2, which covers those parts quite well.

A few negative news articles are hardly indicative of real life (newspapers need shock stories to sell copies...), plus it's not like the odd bit of corruption means the whole thing is a failure.

A good example it gives is this: "Four of the past seven governors of Illinois have gone to prison for corruption, and to my knowledge no one has demanded that Illinois schools be shut down or its highways closed."

Or in other words, corruption doesn't mean a whole community of innocents should be outright ignored.

I dunno though, I am just sort of providing a theoretical counter-argument. My amount of charitableness hasn't changed since reading it. Although I do feel somewhat more positive about the outlook for the world in general.
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smegballs
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PostPosted: 20:56 - 21 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
ninja_butler wrote:
↑

Somebody's a fan of 40K... I hate 40K


Y u no like 40k?


It's a cool sci-fi world, with good books and stuff, but the miniatures (painting and wargaming of) is hella gay IMO.
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Benno
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PostPosted: 01:53 - 22 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
ninja_butler wrote:
↑

Somebody's a fan of 40K... I hate 40K


I love science fiction in general. But I hate paying £999.99 for a small plastic figurine that I have to assemble and paint MYSELF. I gave up on that many years ago.
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smegballs
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PostPosted: 02:29 - 22 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Benno wrote:

I love science fiction in general. But I hate paying £999.99 for a small plastic figurine that I have to assemble and paint MYSELF. I gave up on that many years ago.


Yeah it's is fucking silly isn't it, I never did the models just read books and played the vidya. A few friends did though and I was astounded to see that 40 quid or so buys you a single plastic tank that no doubt cost pennies to produce in a big injection moulding machine.
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ninja_butler
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PostPosted: 05:00 - 22 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
A teeny-tiny bit off-topic.. Games Workshop's plastic models are roughly on-par with models made by other manufacturers; some are expensive, some are cheap, and overall they are cheaper than historical WW2 kits. Me, I hate the story but kind-of like the models because when I first got into minis in the late 80's, Warhammer was mostly still very tongue-in-cheek and not to be taken seriously, but these days it seems to be treated with the poe-faced seriousness normally reserved for stamp-collectors and "rail enthusiasts" and the story got awfully dark considering it was increasingly marketed at 12 year-olds. 40K is for people who paint their walls black.
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ninja_butler
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PostPosted: 05:10 - 22 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Lord Percy wrote:
ninja_butler wrote:
grossly misrepresents the scale of corruption that goes on in those Countries.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2002319/UK-aid-cash-helped-African-dictator-buy-30m-jet.html
https://www.forbes.com/sites/mfonobongnsehe/2011/10/26/u-s-government-moves-against-african-dictators-son/


You should probably have skipped a bit less and gone to the middle bit, myth number 2, which covers those parts quite well.

A few negative news articles are hardly indicative of real life (newspapers need shock stories to sell copies...), plus it's not like the odd bit of corruption means the whole thing is a failure.


It's not just a few, I could throw stories like that at the argument all day long, charity is a multi-billion dollar industry in Africa. Improvements in Africa, where they have happened have come about by internal progress and - ironically - exploitation by overseas businesses, not by foreign aid, yes there are some modern Cities in Africa but the pictures in the article are misleading; there were affluent areas in Africa before the modern developments, but the photographers focused on the most marketable images; ie photos of slums.
https://answersafrica.com/worst-dictators-africa.html
https://str8talkchronicles.com/?p=12566
A good example it gives is this: "Four of the past seven governors of Illinois have gone to prison for corruption, and to my knowledge no one has demanded that Illinois schools be shut down or its highways closed."

Or in other words, corruption doesn't mean a whole community of innocents should be outright ignored.

I dunno though, I am just sort of providing a theoretical counter-argument. My amount of charitableness hasn't changed since reading it. Although I do feel somewhat more positive about the outlook for the world in general.
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daemonoid
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PostPosted: 08:21 - 22 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
smegballs wrote:
Yeah it's is fucking silly isn't it, I never did the models just read books and played the vidya. A few friends did though and I was astounded to see that 40 quid or so buys you a single plastic tank that no doubt cost pennies to produce in a big injection moulding machine.


But you're not just buying the tank, you're buying the shop and the helpful staff and the people who organise gaming nights. And the people who write the stories etc. etc.

And back on topic, the Bill & Melinda foundation really is one of the few forces for good in the world. Bill takes an active roll and turns his keen business sense towards charity (something that has been lacking elsewhere). It means that the charity is run like a business... Projects need results, money needs to be managed. BCF's response to charity tends to be 'well it pays the directors so I'm not bothering' in this case, the guy in charge has put in un fathomable amounts of money as have his friends.
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Lord Percy
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PostPosted: 12:20 - 22 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
daemonoid wrote:
in this case, the guy in charge has put in un fathomable amounts of money as have his friends.


Yeah I'm willing to believe this.

He's surely one of those 'top 85 richest who has more than half the world', but he's certainly doing it right.
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Benno
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PostPosted: 12:51 - 22 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
ninja_butler wrote:
A teeny-tiny bit off-topic.. Games Workshop's plastic models are roughly on-par with models made by other manufacturers; some are expensive, some are cheap, and overall they are cheaper than historical WW2 kits. Me, I hate the story but kind-of like the models because when I first got into minis in the late 80's, Warhammer was mostly still very tongue-in-cheek and not to be taken seriously, but these days it seems to be treated with the poe-faced seriousness normally reserved for stamp-collectors and "rail enthusiasts" and the story got awfully dark considering it was increasingly marketed at 12 year-olds. 40K is for people who paint their walls black.


That's because it's been taken over by edgy teens and fat, neckbearded autists who will shout you down with snot filled fury if you say "What's this dude with the Russian hat? Are these guys Russians?"

To their credit it's nice that they have a passion, and I do like sci fi myself as I said. But I don't fly into a rage when someone says "laser gun" instead of "lasgun". I keep my ire bottled up and take it out on women in nightclubs that should have dressed more conservatively.

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Last edited by Benno on 13:05 - 22 Jan 2014; edited 1 time in total
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daemonoid
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PostPosted: 12:55 - 22 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Lord Percy wrote:
Yeah I'm willing to believe this.

He's surely one of those 'top 85 richest who has more than half the world', but he's certainly doing it right.


He's number 2! and the second biggest contributor is number 4...

https://www.forbes.com/pictures/mel45ghdi/bill-gates-25/

So far they've spent $18bil and he's still got $67bil to go.

He also has an interesting take on what he's gonna give to his kids as inheritance: "I will give the kids some money but not a meaningful percentage. Setting the number so that they need to work but they feel reasonably taken care of is hard to figure out."
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Lord Percy
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PostPosted: 14:31 - 22 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
He also put a lot into promoting the development of a waterless toilet.

Which is great!

Although I wonder how much tech is actually needed to dig a hole and shit in it? Laughing

Nah I'm joking, of course a waterless toilet is great, and overall with all his endeavours Gates seems to be doing a sterling job so far Thumbs Up
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ninja_butler
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PostPosted: 14:52 - 22 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
Ugh. We've got waterless urinals at work. And guess what? They stink.
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daemonoid
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PostPosted: 14:58 - 22 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
ninja_butler wrote:
Ugh. We've got waterless urinals at work. And guess what? They stink.


So your point is that the poor people of the world shouldn't have affordable sanitation because you don't like the smell?

4 posts in this thread, all about how crap one thing or another is. Is there anything you actually like in the whole world? I assume you are making a massive contribution to society too?
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TheSmiler
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PostPosted: 15:36 - 22 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
ninja_butler wrote:
..but these days it seems to be treated with the poe-faced seriousness normally reserved for stamp-collectors and "rail enthusiasts" and the story got awfully dark considering it was increasingly marketed at 12 year-olds. 40K is for people who paint their walls black.


Thinking Hmm interesting I personally liked the 40k models Orks are the best obviously everyone knows that. At one point actually did a few dioramas, however long since gone. Also FYI I'm not that much for stamps but coins Wub
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Lord Percy
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PostPosted: 15:40 - 22 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
ninja_butler wrote:
Ugh. We've got waterless urinals at work. And guess what? They stink.


At the factory I worked at in Australia there were stickers all over the toilet boasting of their waterless urinal systems.

Only problem is the urinals did a full flush literally every 30 seconds, I've never seen a bigger waste of water.

And I think they still smelled bad.

I think to get rid of the smell it just needs cleaning, or some kind of long-lasting chemical block being dumped in it.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 08:47 - 23 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
daemonoid wrote:
And back on topic, the Bill & Melinda foundation really is one of the few forces for good in the world. [...] in this case, the guy in charge has put in un fathomable amounts of money as have his friends.

Loooool.

They "donate" money tax free, then claw it straight back in dividends from the companies - gosh darn, who might own them? - that their "charity" funds.

Any health benefits are incidental and accidental. They may happen, and jolly good if they do, but they're a side effect of the tax avoision wheeze.
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dydey90
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PostPosted: 09:51 - 23 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
TheSmiler wrote:
Orks are the best obviously everyone knows that.


I don't like fungus.

Tau for me.
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Clutchy
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PostPosted: 10:36 - 23 Jan 2014    Post subject: Reply with quote
I've always said to myself I won't give money to starving Africans, purely because they will just have more kids and therefore no food for the kids...

It's a natural thing for them to do, have kids, but if there wasn't enough natural food around without help from other countries, then why the hell would you have more kids.

Give them condoms.

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