Immortal youth

[Old Git Racing]

How do I convince a young relative that all the accidents he is having lately are not totally the fault of 'muppet car drivers'?
He's a nice lad, rides a 125, doesn't rag it all the time but trouble just seems to find him (or more likely he finds it).
He's done training etc but has this stubborn idea that everybody else is an idiot and he isn't.
How to get him to change his attitude, if he doesn't he's going to end up either a cabbage or dead. (I've told him this virtually word for word).
Ideas?

OGR
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2022 Tiger Sport 660 2019 Street Twin 2003 K3 gixxer 1000 1998 Srad 600 track hack

[P.addy]

When I was on my 125, I was always the target of cars for their SMIDSYs.

I learnt by being put in a wheelchair. Get him to do some advanced riding with a decent school, bit of hazard perception and some SMIDSY weaving.

[Marmalade]

I've been riding obscene mileages for many years and never had an off because of these blind cage drivers.
Does he think people like me have never had a smidsy?
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Nobby the Bastard: How yo tell the difference between the actual japanese and her just screaming because she's had live fish stuck up her arse? [url=https://www.nicks-shop.co.uk/bcf-goodies-15-c.aspGet BCF stickers and things here[/url] Reflective helmet stickers - Legal requirement in france - Clicky

[P.addy]

[Itchy]

In order to counter illusionary superiority and the inability of a person to spot their own failings. (Dunning–Kruger effect)

You need to provide earth shatteringly strong evidence backed arguments of why their illusionary superiority is illusionary.

I mean arguments where the proponent is heavily qualified, respected and well known and that the evidence is absolutely incontrovertible. Therefore any attempt to call foul on this perspective can't happen or is feeble at best.
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Spain 2008France 2007Big one 2009 We all die. The goal isn't to live forever, the goal is to create something that will. In the end, your life will flash before your eyes. Make sure it is worth watching.

[Omega]

Take him to a bikers funeral or hospital bed. Point out how that biker wasn't in the wrong either. Repeat until he gets the message.

[map]

[Rogerborg]

I wouldn't bother trying to convince him that he's not totally awesome or that he's at fault.

Convince him that he needs to be more awesome.

Specifics. What is he doing "not" wrong? Assuming he's been seen? Putting himself where he can't be avoided?
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Biking is 1/20th as dangerous as horse riding.
GONE: HN125-8, LF-250B, GPz 305, GPZ 500S, Burgman 400 // RIDING: F650GS (800 twin), Royal Enfield Bullet Electra 500 AVL, Ninja 250R because racebike

[James83]

Sounds like he has the same disease as a lot of kids these days - that some how the universe should magically be fair. I blame these 'there are no losers' school sports days.

Problem is, when you combine it with youth and inexperience, you get a rider who thinks hes good, but probably isn't and who won't accept it as his responsibility to keep himself alive when poor drivers try and kill him, because 'its not fair that I should have to change how I ride when they are the bad drivers'. Thinking your better than you are can only be cured with experience (well, maybe not cured, we all think we're Rossi sometimes ) but you might be able to get him to understand that actually, the universe is never ever going to say 'Oh, it wasn't your fault, un-potato' and so he has to decide between that or riding defensively.
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Jonathan A wrote: tart.

[map]

Just thought, use mind games. Ask if he would like to learn to ride faster.
Then get him to an iam bike session that will also cover defensive riding, because that's what they do. As well as riding a tad quicker to the next overtake.
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...and the whirlwind is in the thorn trees, it's hard for thee to kick against the pricks...
Gibbs, what did Duckie look like when he was younger?

[P.addy]

Fuck it, get someone to call and pretend to be from ambulance, say one of his extremely close family members has been involved in an accident.

Make him feel what they are likely to feel.

[Boxing]

Can't you go for a ride with him and see what he's actually like? And help him right his riding?

[bamt]

[cloric_tzr]

If he is finding himself in shizzenpoopen alot i would say he is maybe riding a little defensive? I.e riding closer to the curb rather than white line making it harder for turning cars to see him, straight lining roundabouts, traveling to fast in a 30 zone (my mum will openly admit she has difficulty judging how fast a bike is going, cars no probs but bike not so sure) luckily she just waits but some drivers arnt so honest even to themselves. Lights? Mines never off, and last but not least is he attempting to read a situation infront or just boldly thinking he knows whats happening? If that the case there may be no getting through to him.
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i dumped my girlfriend the other day! she wouldnt act out one of my fantasy's. all i wanted her to do was come home from work, catch me fucking her sister and join in!!! miserable bitch!
My wifes so ugly, the only thing that goes down on her
Is the internet connection.

[MCW]

Could you come at it from a different angle and ask him for advice? Not for you, that would be too forced, but perhaps for a young rider on the forum who won't listen because it's old gits like us doing the talking. You could ask him for 'help' explaining the stuff that you want him to think about and ways to put it in yoof friendly words. Teaching someone else can be the best way to learn.

[chickenstrip]

Tell him he's right. All other road users ARE idiots. So now it's time for him to learn to treat them that way, i.e., that car WILL pull out, some idiot WILL come over that blind crest on the wrong side of the road etc etc, and to start riding accordingly.

[Hetzer]

Situational awareness, like many other human attributes, varies from person to person. It sounds like this chap's not got much of it and it can't really be taught (it's innate). Such people, for their own sake, shouldn't ride bikes on the highway.
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"There's the horizon! Ride hard, ride fast and cut down all who stand in your way!"

[RhynoCZ]

One shall find that out by him self soon enough, or die in a horrific accident. That's the thing with immortal youth.
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'87 Honda XBR 500, '96 Kawasaki ZX7R P1, '90 Honda CB-1, '88 Kawasaki GPz550, MZ 150 ETZ
'95 Mercedes-Benz w202 C200 CGI, '98 Mercedes-Benz w210 E200 Kompressor

[Andy_Pagin]

He'll either grow-up
or
Have a really bad smash and then grow up
or
Have a really bad smash, and the ghost of Darwin will finally put a tick in the box next to his name on his "Proves I was right" list.
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They're coming to take me away, ho-ho, hee-hee, ha-haaa, hey-hey,
the men in white coats are coming to take me away.
Yamaha Vity -> YBR125 -> FZS600 Fazer -> FZ1-S Fazer

[skatefreak]

I'm no Rossi, that's for sure but I've been commuting for 5-6 years with Zero incidents.

I know it sounds harsh and some people may be 'unlucky' but if you're getting hit on a bike, repeatedly....
you're clearly not being paranoid/safe enough.

I for one would be curious to hear about these incidents he's had.

If he was honest with you about the incidents he's had I am sure you could find a few trends.
I know I could be pretty stubborn, especially when I was younger but if someone laid out the reasons for a string of accidents and a recurring theme (ie my poor obs and not kamikaze cages) I would like to think I'd pay attention...

Either that or give him his two options:
- Work on his attitude and get more training .
- Work on his will.

-Jvr

[Copycat73]

[yen_powell]

Buy him this t-shirt
https://www.andy-sparrow.co.uk/shop/product/107b/1.png
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Blackmail is a nasty word........but not as nasty as phlegm!
XT1200Z and a DR350 in bits

[Sload]

[Codemonkey]

Strap a go-pro or similar to his bike and insist he video's his rides. After a while look through the footage and point out all the poor obs that could have resulted in him being wiped out / left a dribbling cabbage.
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Test Passed 10/05/2011 Current bike: XJ6-N

[Old Git Racing]

Thanks all, some good advice, I'll have another go with him.

OGR
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2022 Tiger Sport 660 2019 Street Twin 2003 K3 gixxer 1000 1998 Srad 600 track hack