Rear brake use: not enough, too much, just right?

[Rogerborg]

I keep seeing folk talking about using the rear brake for slow speed manoeuvres. It's not something that I ever got into the habit of doing to "balance" the bike, and nor have I needed to given that I tend to plan ahead enough to not use the brakes much[*], but I'm beginning to wonder if there's something to it.

Talking about it is one thing, seeing how much someone actually does it is another.

TRIGGER WARNING: vlogger.

On and off but mostly on the rear brake while filtering.

To me that looks extreme: he's pressing (not just covering) the rear brake while accelerating, not just occasionally but repeatedly. In this section here for example.

It seems like a fair old waste of energy to be doing that. Fuel, brake pads: am I being a bit Scotch about it?

How does that compare to your cut-and-thrust heroics? Do you London-wallahs habitually ride the rear like that?


[*] With one comical exception. Being quicker onto or poised on the rear might actually have helped there.
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[ScaredyCat]

One of the things they teach on the i2i machine control courses is that for the slow stuff you don't use the throttle to slow down and speed up.
You set the throttle at a reasonable level for what you're doing and then use the rear brake to make adjustments.

I thought it was rubbish until I had a few goes, it does work, when you get it right it's like all the forces being applied make the bike taut and super stable.

However, I don't actually do it much in the real world. I only really use my front brake, even when filtering.
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[weasley]

Didn't watch the vlog and I am a rear brake pedal dodging extremist, but I do sometimes use it under specific conditions. One is to hold the bike on a hill, but that's normal. No, I use it if riding in the wet and coming on throttle out of a junction or corner. I'll brake into the corner and use a little rear, then keep the rear on as I open the throttle, to temper any snatch in pick-up, then I'll blend off the rear brake.

Other than that it is an ornament.
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[Shaft]

I got about half way through that and I would say I probably use my rear brake in a similar fashion.

I was brought up riding off road, where the rear brake is often used for balance, kicking the back out a bit or simply because using the front, in certain circumstances, isn't very sensible.

Before I went on the road, I did a training course and it was quite a change to stick to their recommended 70/30 ish front to rear brake bias, I had to make a concerted effort during observed tests.

While I'm filtering (more at slow speeds) I prefer to use the rear as a steady, you don't get the same level of weight transfer and certainly no diving forks, which I find makes control a bit easier, but maybe it's just me.
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[Pigeon]

Use the rear a lot for low speed stuff and some higher speed stuff when i miss-judge a corner.

That taught bike feeling yo.

But stamping on it like RJ, depends. If i did that on my SV, it would easily lock the rear.
My striples brembo setup has a smaller disc + calliper and is basically useless, stamping on it is a requirement.

[andym]

When I had my lesson(s) for my MOD 2 the instructor told me not to use my front brake at all

[barrkel]

For low speeds especially with frequent variation in speed, the rear keeps lash / slop out of the drive. Slack in the chain, gearbox, cush drive etc. all adds up to potential for jerkiness if you let engine braking kick in.

Different story on scooters; there it's essential for fine control over the output of the centrifugal clutch. You effectively slip the clutch by preventing the rear from getting too much speed despite the action on the drum. I replace rear pads on the scooter about every 7k miles.
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[NJD]

Similar to andym. During my training I was told continuously by all bar one instructor that it was rear brake only at low speeds, slow control and to the final part of coming to a dead stop, if I attempted to use the front brake for anything other than the first part of coming to a dead stop or slowing down they'd moan and reminded me about the rear brake only.

While riding the GS 500 that method worked because in comparison to my tiddler the GS had a powerful rear brake and provided very good feedback and feel through the pedal and reacted and stopped, slowed and behaved just how I wanted it to. On my tiddler, and possibly as an inadvertent comparison to the GS, I find that the rear drum brake is so utterly useless that it doesn't even help at the lowest of speeds despite any attempts to adjust it that I've made in the past I just find that I don't have any confidence in it at all and feel like I'm going to end up not being able to stop or end up in the rear of the car in-front if I did attempt to rely on the rear only. Due to the lack of trust in the rear I use the front most and if not all of the time and then a combination of clutch and throttle at low speeds, filtering etc.

Personally I'd like to be able to ride with more rear brake only action but have given up trying (as above) because of the utterly crappy brakes. The only time I apply the rear when at slow speeds or filtering it to scrub of that little bit of extra speed and then continue with a clutch and throttle combination. Front brake whenever I need to stop, has dipped the front a few times but I've learnt to adjust, when and how much brake to apply etc. At this point I think I ride thinking that I'm using the rear brake but probably don't, I've caught myself a few times thinking I'm pressing on the pedal and I haven't been, out of habit.

Everyone has a different method of riding and an idea of how it should or shouldn't be done but I'd say ride the way that you're comfortable with and gives you the most control.

I seem to recall being more confident on the rear in ankle boots and getting a far better feel of my tiddlers rear brake through the pedal than I ever have while wearing my RST boots or full on sized boots. Should probably invest in a decent usable pair of ankle boots and see if that's the case or not.

[mentalboy]

[Polarbear]

On a normal braked bike I hardly use the rear at all. Emergency stops
etc. yes but usually just front brake.

On bloody linked brake systems like my Trophy has then it's a mixture but the back brake lever operates a percentage of the front brake as well so you can't get away with just the front.

Overcomplicated and unnecessary but getting more and more popular.
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[Teflon-Mike]

Despite my wrath about 'Drag 'n' Slip taught as 'first course' to 'under-drive' the gear-box for slow-speed manoeuvres.... yes, I do use fair bit of back brake where appropriate, but then I ride a quarter ton barge, usually 2-Up...

Found I use it a bit more on the Guzzi, too, but then, front brake lever only works one disc, back brake pedal works back brake disc and the other front.

Curiously, in trials I use a lot less back brake...
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[Rogerborg]

[Doovy]

[Matt B]

I probably use the rear brake about as much as Jordanian in the video when filtering. It really does help to keep the bike stable and you can turn tighter and smoother in situations like the part where he is weaving through. The other benefit is the unexpected - car moves across or any point where you need to slow quickly you already have one brake partially engaged. Avoids grabbing at the front in a panic.

Like Shaft said, my first experience of bikes was MX for 6 years before I was even old enough to get on the road. Use of the rear brake for control and cornering is common and it's a natural transfer over to a road bike. Put an ST1100 or something else barge like round a tight turn or a mini roundabout, then do it dragging the rear brake and see the difference.
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[Islander]

I use the rear brake for slow speed stuff and have done pretty much since I started riding. Used with a sensible throttle setting and some good clutch control, it allows you to keep the bike balanced whereas using the front can cause dive and that in turn can cause you to lose fine control.

[Silver_Fox]

I almost never touch it. This thread encourages me to try using it more....

Having said that I find it hard to use with touring boots because of the lack of ankle flex

[winz]

I use(d) the rear brake in a similar way. During slow maneuvers the back brake feels like planting the back wheel into the road making you more stable. Was taught this in training. If I just use the front brake I can feel the front dipping.

Even on a bike with linked system I use the rear as it has more bias towards the rear but feels a lot smoother.
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[someotherguy]

[smallfrowne]

[andym]

[chris-red]

I use the rear a lot filtering, if slows you without diving the front, and is great for controlling sharp slow turns. I don't really bother the rest of the time. Sometimes while fast cornering to tidy a line but I tend to trail brake the front into a corner if I need a bit more speed scrubbed off, I feel I have more control doing that. I also use it a lot in a straight line when 2 up the extra weight requiring more stopping force and the weight keeping the rear down makes it more effective.
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[el_oso]

I must admit I use it in quite a similar fashion to RJ.

In the big smoke, you can't plan ahead if you want to make swift progress through rush hour traffic. Sure it's not the most efficient use of resources, but it certainly allows you to make much quicker progress. The main slowdown in the big smoke is waiting in traffic lights. If you can get to the front of the queue, you may stand a chance at racing past the next set before they change therevby saving yourself some considerable time.
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[M.C]

[Piercee100]

When learning to ride on the H100, I found the front drum brake so poor that I used the rear most of the time being the better of the two. I know that caused my problems when doing Mod1 as I found the GS500 brakes AMAZING! Grabbing some front brake nearly sent me over the handlebars lol.

My Suzuki is coming up to 3yrs old and recently changed the front and rear brakes and both were worn identically so I don't know what that means? The rear pads are smaller and I do a fair bit of filtering. 12k miles and both sets of pads down to less than 1mm.
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[Irn-Bru]

Some bikes just have crap rear brake set ups, not surprised some don't touch it. My DRZ was a nightmare, it was either on or off, when I changed to a braided line it would just lock up all the time unless you were careful. Swapped it out for a master cylinder off a crf 450, still a Nissin but much more progressive so now I can comfortably use the rear. I use it quite a lot, mainly for slow speed stuff so I can have full control of the throttle, junctions, filtering etc. On rare occasions I might use it on those gravelly death trap roads that have been resurfaced, total nightmare, logic is it's easier to control losing the back end than the front. Even then I try my very hardest not to touch the brakes, even a sudden down change will lock up the rear, absolutely despise when they leave the roads in that condition, especially on biker roads, they did it quite a bit in the Lakes last year.
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