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Cars in the outside lane.

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Kawasaki Jimbo
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PostPosted: 21:01 - 27 May 2016    Post subject: Cars in the outside lane. Reply with quote

I'm no newbie but somehow I've missed this tip until recently. It's not uncommon to encounter a single car on a deserted stretch of dual carriageway (A10) which will not budge from the right hand lane. I figure they're either self-annointed alpha-males/females who think they belong in the overtaking lane, or they have such poor spatial awareness that having the nearest kerb just two feet away from their right side window is less scarey than having it eight feet to the left and out of view.

I've tried Delboy's tip and it really works. Until now I'd have been either in their 6 o'clock position and expecting that my headlight centrally positioned in their rear view mirror would convey the message, "I'm on a sportsbike, what do you think I want to do?" or in the "8 o'clock" position (centre line just to my left) for a good view ahead, still with a view to getting past. Occasionally my patience will run out and I'll undertake. "4 o'clock" is a place I don't really want to be, but used momentarily it does seem to influence car drivers to move to the left as if by magic.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=REU39NgkBws

tl:dw - Try 6.30 to 9.30 mins.
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Pete.
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PostPosted: 21:05 - 27 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Saturday mornings on the A2 you usually get a lot of hung-over third-laners. I just go around. If they want to use the third lane I'll use another.
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Nobby the Bastard
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PostPosted: 21:17 - 27 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just give it the berries in the inside lane. Aint got the time for their shit.
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Ste
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PostPosted: 21:27 - 27 May 2016    Post subject: Re: Cars in the outside lane. Reply with quote

Kawasaki Jimbo wrote:
I'd have been either in their 6 o'clock position and expecting that my headlight centrally positioned in their rear view mirror would convey the message, "I'm on a sportsbike, what do you think I want to do?" or in the "8 o'clock" position (centre line just to my left) for a good view ahead, still with a view to getting past. Occasionally my patience will run out and I'll undertake. "4 o'clock" is a place I don't really want to be, but used momentarily it does seem to influence car drivers to move to the left as if by magic.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZgdufzXvjqw
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MCN
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PostPosted: 21:28 - 27 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Standard approach.

Pass on inside and kick the door mirror off as you go past. Rolling Eyes

First ensure there's no PoPo around and do them ahp the inside.
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Ste
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PostPosted: 21:35 - 27 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

MCN wrote:
Pass on inside and kick the door mirror off as you go past. Rolling Eyes

https://i.imgur.com/BOo3mTo.gif
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BTTD
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PostPosted: 22:07 - 27 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ste wrote:
https://i.imgur.com/BOo3mTo.gif


Laughing That's brilliant.

I've watched a few of Delboys vids, but there is one where he started banging on about what a great job MAG do and how we should all be members. Apparently we should read up on it. Rolling Eyes That pissed me off.
On the whole there's some interesting stuff he posts on the workshop vids.

Overtaking dawdlers, if there's a gap you can get through, use it.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 23:40 - 27 May 2016    Post subject: Re: Cars in the outside lane. Reply with quote

Kawasaki Jimbo wrote:
tl:dw - Try 6.30 to 9.30 mins.

I've have been past in the left hand lane at 6:40 while he was still Teffing his Jedi mind tricks.
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Last edited by Rogerborg on 08:44 - 28 May 2016; edited 1 time in total
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Wafer_Thin_Ham
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PostPosted: 08:22 - 28 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

M1 is usually nose to tail in lane 3 full of Audis and BMWs who rarely let you past. I just undertake them all in the rarely used inner lanes when on the bike.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 08:45 - 28 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is't possible? Does BCF actually... agree on something? Shocked

[Looks out window for other Signs of the Apocalypse]
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Pete.
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PostPosted: 08:54 - 28 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not really there's just a lot of people out there who don't need to watch some fool blabbering on a vlog to know how to get along the road.
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Wafer_Thin_Ham
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PostPosted: 09:10 - 28 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pete. wrote:
Not really there's just a lot of people out there who don't need to watch some fool blabbering on a vlog to know how to get along the road.


I think Mr Moonfleet should try riding in rush hour rather than cruising along at lunch time. It's very different......
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Pete.
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PostPosted: 09:23 - 28 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually I was going to say the same. If I tried his tactic on my commute I would be sat behind every car until it got to a slip road. At least one of his examples was looking like they were going to move anyway, and in fact started moving before he'd even closed up to jedi-range.

The other problem with his tactic is if you get fed up with waiting for them to move and switch to a left-side pass, you're movement in their mirror might be what causes them to notice you and suddenly try to 'get out of your way'.
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P.addy
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PostPosted: 10:08 - 28 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

They made the bikes narrow and powerful for a reason. Any gap is a way of making progress Laughing
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sepher
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PostPosted: 10:33 - 28 May 2016    Post subject: Re: Cars in the outside lane. Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:
Kawasaki Jimbo wrote:
tl:dw - Try 6.30 to 9.30 mins.

I've have been past in the left hand lane at 6:40 while he was still Teffing his Jedi mind tricks.


6:36 would of been a perfect opportunity to get past Very Happy

Also if you get in that position (4 o clock?) his in on a dual carriageway I've actually seen cars pull over staying in that right lane expecting you to filter past on the right side between a car and the kerb Shocked so then you have to hang back as if to say your not overtaking so they resume normal position and then you can filter past on the left.
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techathy
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PostPosted: 11:32 - 28 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

In lower density traffic DCs I’d do a variation of Del's suggestion.

Approaching a car hogging lane 2 make sure I’ve got a 10mph or bigger speed difference. At about 80-100m move to the extreme right of the lane and a single quick main-beam flash, then return to the centre of the lane. This will either cause them to change lanes or they’ll ignore you. If they’ve not started change lanes by 50m out I’ll move to the left hand side of the lane and evaluate an immediate undertake, which almost certainly is on. If it’s not on then I’ll drop into to my close following awaiting overtake opportunity position, rather than my standard distances (standard & close are relative. My close following distance is bigger than the typical following distance).

If it's high density traffic, which is typical, then make progress in what seems the most prudent manner for the exact situation.
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Pete.
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PostPosted: 12:23 - 28 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

techathy wrote:
In lower density traffic DCs I’d do a variation of Del's suggestion.

Approaching a car hogging lane 2 make sure I’ve got a 10mph or bigger speed difference. At about 80-100m move to the extreme right of the lane and a single quick main-beam flash, then return to the centre of the lane. This will either cause them to change lanes or they’ll ignore you. If they’ve not started change lanes by 50m out I’ll move to the left hand side of the lane and evaluate an immediate undertake, which almost certainly is on. If it’s not on then I’ll drop into to my close following awaiting overtake opportunity position, rather than my standard distances (standard & close are relative. My close following distance is bigger than the typical following distance).

If it's high density traffic, which is typical, then make progress in what seems the most prudent manner for the exact situation.


So you flash a vehicle over when you're 20 seconds away then sit 10 seconds back expecting them to move?
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kramdra
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PostPosted: 12:56 - 28 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just stay left. Lane is always empty.

Vid above he gets far too close for my liking. Any "pressuring" on a car is asking to be brake checked. It is much safer to go between two cars.
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Val
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PostPosted: 14:17 - 28 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just overtake in the left lane whilst doing a wheelie and giving the two fingers sign.

Safer and you are more visible that way Laughing
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techathy
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PostPosted: 14:35 - 28 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pete. wrote:
So you flash a vehicle over when you're 20 seconds away then sit 10 seconds back expecting them to move?

20 seconds away? Laughing I think your calculator is broken.

A car doing 70mph in lane 2 means I’m at 80mph. So my flash is when I’m about 2.5 seconds back and closing. At that distance out it’s not “get out of my way”, which may well cause an aggressive response, it’s “Hi, I’m here you might want to pay a bit of attention to me”. Now from that point they then have 10 seconds or so to work out how fast I’m closing and if they can pull into lane 1 sensibly or not.

If at 1.5 seconds back from the car there’s no reaction, that’s not they’re in lane 1 but rather showing intention to move into lane 1, then they’re not going to move and I’ve got time to evaluate at my options. If the transition straight into an undertake doesn’t seem on I’ll hold at around 1.5 seconds back from the car waiting for my opportunity.

I get an 70-80% hit rate using this and an awful lot of thumbs up, nods or hand up from drivers as I pass. Why is that? Well because I gave them loads of time and never put them under pressure. Less than 1% of the time I can’t transition into an undertake, if this doesn’t work. If I can’t undertake I was the one that screwed up because I need the space they should have moved into to undertake them.
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Pete.
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PostPosted: 14:38 - 28 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

techathy wrote:
Pete. wrote:
So you flash a vehicle over when you're 20 seconds away then sit 10 seconds back expecting them to move?

20 seconds away? Laughing I think your calculator is broken.

A car doing 70mph in lane 2 means I’m at 80mph. So my flash is when I’m about 2.5 seconds back and closing.


Heh, do your sums again. You're not 2.5 seconds away at 100m doing 80mph unless the vehicle you're following is parked.
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DJP
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PostPosted: 15:24 - 28 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nobby the Bastard wrote:
I just give it the berries in the inside lane. Aint got the time for their shit.


This^^.
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Wafer_Thin_Ham
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PostPosted: 20:03 - 28 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

techathy wrote:
Pete. wrote:
So you flash a vehicle over when you're 20 seconds away then sit 10 seconds back expecting them to move?

20 seconds away? Laughing I think your calculator is broken.

A car doing 70mph in lane 2 means I’m at 80mph. So my flash is when I’m about 2.5 seconds back and closing. At that distance out it’s not “get out of my way”, which may well cause an aggressive response, it’s “Hi, I’m here you might want to pay a bit of attention to me”. Now from that point they then have 10 seconds or so to work out how fast I’m closing and if they can pull into lane 1 sensibly or not.

If at 1.5 seconds back from the car there’s no reaction, that’s not they’re in lane 1 but rather showing intention to move into lane 1, then they’re not going to move and I’ve got time to evaluate at my options. If the transition straight into an undertake doesn’t seem on I’ll hold at around 1.5 seconds back from the car waiting for my opportunity.

I get an 70-80% hit rate using this and an awful lot of thumbs up, nods or hand up from drivers as I pass. Why is that? Well because I gave them loads of time and never put them under pressure. Less than 1% of the time I can’t transition into an undertake, if this doesn’t work. If I can’t undertake I was the one that screwed up because I need the space they should have moved into to undertake them.


Why bother flashing? Just increases the chance of the other user being a dick as they usually interpret headlight flashes as aggression. I've also tried flicking on my right indicator like our friends do on the autobahn. None of these things work, so I just undertake and get on with my day. Life is too short.
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Ichy
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PostPosted: 20:41 - 28 May 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wafer_Thin_Ham wrote:
None of these things work, so I just undertake and get on with my day. Life is too short.


Totally agree. No faffing about, I just use the space available. I suspect that a good number of drivers never even realised I was there and I'm gone before it matters.
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