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Enough power???

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Alex 3460
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PostPosted: 00:07 - 08 Dec 2016    Post subject: Enough power??? Reply with quote

Hello guys,

First of would like to tell you a little bit about my riding expirience, have ridden off and on over the last 2 years on my CBR400RR, I have recently turned 24 and have since done my full A licence now.


All my training upgrade/test was done on a Shiver 750 V Twin, now the plan was to buy something like a 600 super-sports but I'm in a situation now where I feel like I'll quickly get bored of the 600, don't get me wrong I know they are quick bikes but my CBR didn't feel very quick and the shiver didn't really woo me away so I was thinking of something like a GSXR 750 k7 onwards.

Would like to everyone's opinion on this please.


Thanks
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UrbanRacer
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PostPosted: 00:24 - 08 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

You will shit your pants on a modern 600cc sportsbike (GSXR,R6 etc) when you go full throttle.
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G
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PostPosted: 00:38 - 08 Dec 2016    Post subject: Re: Enough power??? Reply with quote

A modern 600 or a modern 1000 will hit 70 in first in the same time.
Kept on the boil, 600s won't be far behind litre bikes. However, if you're lazy with the throttle the bigger bike will be a good bit faster.

Going from a ZX6R to the same year ZX9R, but a turned race bike and didn't find it 'felt' faster - it was just as fast for longer.
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stevo as b4
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PostPosted: 01:15 - 08 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

I liked my ZX6R and liked the grunt of the Firestorm and the smooth power of a 2003 Fireblade.

But I'm 20years out of date with my views, apparently 600's are dead, and all peaky race bikes. 1000's all rev to 14000rpm with no low down power anymore because they are short stroke WSB ready out of the box, and people can all insure litre bikes now, and those that can't are all having a hard on over dull A2 bikes that are restricted and boring.

Oh yeah and BCF says that 98Blades, all 750's and stuff like ZX9R's and Thunderace's are all slow, dull and boring, and 200bhp should be a minimum for fast road use for the average person.
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arry
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PostPosted: 08:10 - 08 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Liam_ wrote:
You will shit your pants on a modern 600cc sportsbike (GSXR,R6 etc) when you go full throttle.


This.

The Shiver has 10-15 horsepower fewer than a decent 600 sports bike and is tuned for mid range. It's flat up top.

Hit full beans 10,000 rpm on a 600 and see.


Last edited by arry on 09:14 - 08 Dec 2016; edited 1 time in total
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G
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PostPosted: 08:46 - 08 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevo as b4 wrote:

Oh yeah and BCF says that 98Blades, all 750's and stuff like ZX9R's and Thunderace's are all slow, dull and boring

Always thought this Wink.
Well, certainly dull and boring.
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Rogerborg
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PostPosted: 09:10 - 08 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

arry wrote:
Hit full beans 10,000 rpm on a 600 and see.

At which point you're doing 50 in 1st, or 70 in 2nd.

No moralfag, I'd just suggest that you consider how many opportunities you'll really have to do that.
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arry
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PostPosted: 09:14 - 08 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

arry wrote:
Liam_ wrote:
You will shit your pants on a modern 600cc sportsbike (GSXR,R6 etc) when you go full throttle.


This.

The Shiver has 10-15 horsepower fewer than a decent 600 sports bike and is tuned for mid range. It's flat up top.

Hit full beans 10,000 rpm on a 600 and see.


Edited as Rogerborg turned up.
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G
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PostPosted: 09:29 - 08 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rogerborg wrote:

At which point you're doing 50 in 1st, or 70 in 2nd.

No moralfag, I'd just suggest that you consider how many opportunities you'll really have to do that.

Many, each ride; including sticking to the speed limits for first gear, of course!

I call moralfag! Wink

I went to a 600 sports bike from a KLR650, so more of a jump than a sports 600 - it pretty much did feel like 'warp speed' when I first got it.
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stevo as b4
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PostPosted: 10:29 - 08 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm surprised that an Aprilia 750cc twin semi supermoto style bike feels dull and boring after a CBR400? I thought the Aprilia was quite light, and not much heavier than the porky for a 400 CBR?

I guess it depends on how you ride it though too? And how you like the character of the engines etc.

Not a very good comparison, but I found the ER6 and even the CB500 to feel a bit more grunty under 6000rpm than the ZX6R. Its not even that simple though, as apart from the effects of gearing, the IL4 bike has a wider useable rev range without chain snatch, and doesn't chug and lurch at 3000rpm like the other two bikes do.
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skatefreak
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PostPosted: 10:41 - 08 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

The problem with a super sports is it's just that and to get to the ompffhhhh (> 7,000rpm) you will find yourself very quickly passing even the highest speed limit.
I would even go as far as to suggest I used to ride faster on my 98 CBR600 f3 than I do now on my 99 R1 because there is so much more power lower in the rev range I just use than instead of kicking it down a gear and blasting off into the sunset (getting old I know...).
Hell I don't rev through the ompffhhh on the R1 on the road that often because it's licence loosing territory from 2'nd gear >.
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arry
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PostPosted: 10:51 - 08 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevo as b4 wrote:
I'm surprised that an Aprilia 750cc twin semi supermoto style bike feels dull and boring after a CBR400? I thought the Aprilia was quite light, and not much heavier than the porky for a 400 CBR?


It's the way the engine delivers everything low down but not a lot up top, feels a bit asthmatic. It put me off V Twins for a long time TBH.
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Enduro Numpty
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PostPosted: 11:13 - 08 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

"ENOUGH POWER???"

How much do you want? Do you want to top 200mph? Do you want to be able to open the throttle in any gear and know the bike will respond? Do you want a bike you can ride hour after hour or do you want a WSB lookalike? Will you carry a passenger? Will you carry luggage? Do you want to spend a large portion of your disposable income on tyres?

Power isn't the be all and end all. I recently got rid of my 2012 Fireblade which was, quite simply, the easiest bike to ride at ridiculous speeds I've ever known. The problem was that while the bike was capable of stunning performance in every area it was just too much for me to use on the road. A race track maybe but not the road. I don't ride like a pussy by any means but the possibility of bypassing a ban and going straight to jail held absolutely no appeal. Consequently I found it very frustrating and ultimately boring so it had to go Crying or Very sad .

So much choice out there and it's really up to you to decide what you want but big power in itself may not be what you want?
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kgm
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PostPosted: 12:05 - 08 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

See I generally prefer a v-twin to an IL4. The top end rush is...a rush... but I enjoy the low down thrust of a twin and the abruptness of a single. I'd really love and SM. Granted I've not ridden many litre bikes but I always remember the Tuono (the earlier v-twin 1000). That thing pulled like fuck from anywhere in the rev range. Much fun, first bike to actually have me manically laughing as I was riding. https://youtu.be/Xqrz4M9FAnk?t=288 pretty much sums up my reaction the first time I had a go. I'd definitely like to put one in the garage. My current garage, whilst still fun, is too practical.
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G
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PostPosted: 12:22 - 08 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

meggark wrote:
See I generally prefer a v-twin to an IL4. The top end rush is...a rush... but I enjoy the low down thrust of a twin and the abruptness of a single. I'd really love and SM. Granted I've not ridden many litre bikes but I always remember the Tuono (the earlier v-twin 1000). That thing pulled like fuck from anywhere in the rev range.

Sounds like a litre 4 would meet what you're looking for -more usable power throught the entire rev range than twins generally, especially if you go for something like a newer fireblade.
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arry
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PostPosted: 12:38 - 08 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is something deeply amusing about my 990 though. It's geared really well to make use of the lumps of torque so it's pretty consistent blattery right through to the limiter. It's many smiles.
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woo
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PostPosted: 14:04 - 08 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

despite what is written on paper and times there is a massive difference between the power of a 1000cc and a 600cc sports bike, my experience on both has proven this to me and if in doubt watch this video as it will answer that question Laughing
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hopSUZSJdHc

you just gotta decide what you want from the bike and then the decision becomes alot easier!

the GSXR 750 k7 is a great bike however if you want it all out get a GSXR 1000 k5/k6

this just from my own personal experience as ive had them all ive gone from 50cc to 1000cc


Personally i prefer low down grunt which is what my GSXR 1000 k1 gives me but when i feel like a good thrash i use the honda msx 125 as you thrash that bike and cant break any speed limits so to speak Laughing
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 15:40 - 08 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

stevo as b4 wrote:
1000's all rev to 14000rpm with no low down power anymore because they are short stroke WSB ready out of the box


Plenty of litre upright bikes around nowadays that should give a better compromise for the road, and still a good dose of outright power. BMW S1000R, GSX1000S, Z1000, CB1000R etc, plus Vtwins like the Tuono, and the big KTMs etc. They'll certainly have a lot more to offer than the old stuff we started out on. You can happily melt your license with these still, if you're that way inclined.

OP, as usual, the best advice is probably to go get yourself some test rides on different capacities and engine configurations, and see what lights your fire.
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G
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PostPosted: 16:46 - 08 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

woo wrote:
despite what is written on paper and times there is a massive difference between the power of a 1000cc and a 600cc sports bike, my experience on both has proven this to me and if in doubt watch this video as it will answer that question

In the real world, a well ridden 600 (someone that knows how to use their right hand and left foot Smile ) shouldn't be that far off a 1000 unless we're talking continuous high speed (sitting on an empty autobahn.)

So, a video offering a counter-view:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WKGwCHxt-Bg
I'm sure the R6 rider was more skilled; but often there doesn't need to be a massive gap in skills to make up.
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definitelyinc...
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PostPosted: 16:56 - 08 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

G wrote:
woo wrote:
despite what is written on paper and times there is a massive difference between the power of a 1000cc and a 600cc sports bike, my experience on both has proven this to me and if in doubt watch this video as it will answer that question

In the real world, a well ridden 600 (someone that knows how to use their right hand and left foot Smile ) shouldn't be that far off a 1000 unless we're talking continuous high speed (sitting on an empty autobahn.)

So, a video offering a counter-view:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WKGwCHxt-Bg
I'm sure the R6 rider was more skilled; but often there doesn't need to be a massive gap in skills to make up.


That's insane! When my 2 years of a2 is over I was deciding between a 1000 vs 600, think this may have just made up my mind Laughing
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chickenstrip
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PostPosted: 17:20 - 08 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

G wrote:


So, a video offering a counter-view:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WKGwCHxt-Bg
I'm sure the R6 rider was more skilled; but often there doesn't need to be a massive gap in skills to make up.


Hmm, the thousand rider didn't look like he was putting much into that, was he just on a warm up lap? Laughing
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OldRTMan
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PostPosted: 18:31 - 08 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

I decided some time ago that power is not the answer Smile. Not really sure why I have a 1200 (!), on reflection yes its good and comfortable for touring but sometimes the weight makes you want to drop back down to a nippy, light 600 and to be honest I can't remember the last time I screwed back the throttle - hell but it looks good Smile
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stevo as b4
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PostPosted: 19:36 - 08 Dec 2016    Post subject: Reply with quote

A big lazy 1200cc+ is fine and very agreeable to me for easy touring, mile munching or just long fast A-B trips on good roads. It also looks good at the pub having a big naked bike with oil cooler lines and a huge impressive engine sticking out.

Otherwise for in town, ease and convenience I'll take a cheap twist and go, and for having fun on the roads in town or country as a play bike, a silly and light 125-250cc bike that spews out clouds of blue is where it's at for me.

I've had 600's, and ridden bigger sporty bikes, but a full fairing and race focus bikes just make me feel soft and limp now.
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lingeringstin...
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PostPosted: 20:49 - 08 Dec 2016    Post subject: Shit! Reply with quote

I often scare the shit out of myself with 20 horsepower, no suspension, miserable brakes, and the cheapest tyres money can buy. Every inch is an adventure!
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